Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I have been thinking about getting a monitor for about a year and have decided on an ackie. Just like with all my lizards I do plenty of research before hand. I am not even thinking about getting one until summer.

Anyway, with all my other lizards (especially the chams) substrate is bad for them causing impactions and such. I've heard lots of bad stuff about using sand for beardies and I was just wondering if it would be possible to keep ackies without substrate.

Just curious!!!!
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Thanks Dawn
1.1 Veiled (Moe and Isis)
0.2 Helmeted Iguana (Louie and Aphrodite)
0.2 Southern Toad (Tiny and Bubba)
1.0 Bearded Dragon (Joker)
3.1 Cats (Buffy, Spike, London, and Lilly)

I do not think that with your other animals, that the substrate itself is what is causing the impaction problem...unless, perhaps it's a snake ingesting large woodchip chunks while eating... If you use most types of soils and sands, the animal would not have a problem with ingesting some of it during feedings, as long as the humidity is correct/suitable.. Many people keep their animals in low-humidity enclosures, despite the true needs of the animal, usually in the form of aquaria with screen tops.. This in most cases leads to dehydration, and thus complications with passing waste properly/safely..

If you are having a problem with your animals becoming impacted with soils, sands, etc.., I would reevaluate your husbandry, and try and correct the humidity problem... Opt to go with a cover that will help hold humidity in, unlike open screen tops..

So, as far as ackies goes, if you give them proper humidity levels, to allow them to be healthy, and digest properly(temps would also play an important role in this), there should be no problems with them becoming impacted. Plus, because of their habits of excavating burrows/tunnels, etc.. I would much rather give them something to burrow and dig in, as opposed to live a boring life on top of astroturf, or newspaper... It is in their nature to burrow, why deprive that?

So, in my honest opinion, I do not think you would have a problem, if you provide them with the proper setup/conditions...I hope this helps a bit, as this is what I have seen personally with several of my animals in the past, and feel that it may help out your husbandry/health of your animals.. not just monitors.. I wish you the best of luck, and have a great day!

bob
The Odatriad

np

There is one major problem with both your comments. If a person was using natural materials, then you are right. But unfortunately, thats not normally always the case.

Heres the problem. Sand is consists of silica, silica is what glass is made out of. Natural sands are rounded and do not have sharp edges. Millions of years of wind and water rounds them.

Manufactered sands(most purchased types) are crushed rock that has been sifted, these types are sharp sands. Think of each grain of sand as a broken piece of glass with sharp edges. These types of sands will cause impactions and harm(shredded gut) on otherwise healthy individuals.

These reallife facts are why I often have problems with your theories. In theory your both right, but unfortunately, in application, you both are wrong. The reason was, your theory did not contain, sharp sand.

Now back to real life. Sharp sands indeed has caused lots of problems with lizards that consume sand, as an aid for digestion. I am not sure monitors do this normally. In other words, healthy monitors do not normally eat sand. But unfortunately, in this thread, you both included beardies, which do. Thanks FR

That's why I offered the following disclaimer:

"Healthy monitors (and bearded dragons, I imagine, although I've never kept any) with access to a hot basking spot will pass most accidentally ingested items out the other end."

I'm going to be the polite one before you get hammered by everyone here.

Most of what you read about substrate and impactions is based on older styles of husbandry, which involved keeping animals a little too cool. Healthy monitors (and bearded dragons, I imagine, although I've never kept any) with access to a hot basking spot will pass most accidentally ingested items out the other end.

Read through some of the older posts on this and other monitor forums, or do a search through the archives, as there have been a lot of discussions on substrate. Substrate is important for small digging monitors like acanthurus for maintaining the right humidity level, a safe hide spot etc.

So, to answer your question:
Is it possible to keep an ackie without substrate? Probably.
Would you want to? Probably not.

My argus is about the size of a grown ackie and he has tunnels all over his enclosure. It is fun to watch him run in one and come out where you least expect it. He has a maze under there. It is so cool. It is worth having the substrate to watch them dig and "play" in the labyrinth they build. You will enjoy it!!!
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Ed

There are water dragons, chameleons, frilled dragons, pythons, and monitors in my jungle room.

Thanks for all the info. I did not say that I have problems with animals impacting. I have only had one lizard die as a result impaction. My chams do have soil in their cages because they have live trees in their cages. My beardies however live on paper towel because I am still unsure of the sand.

Since this is a monitor forum and the question was posed about ackies and substrate I will most likely go with the substrate when I decide to get them. I am not against substrate being used, my southern toads are kept on dirt because they also dig burrows and tunnels. I agree that if it is their nature to dig then they should be able to. I was asking mainly out of curiosity.

Thanks for everyones opinion
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Thanks Dawn
1.1 Veiled (Moe and Isis)
0.2 Helmeted Iguana (Louie and Aphrodite)
0.2 Southern Toad (Tiny and Bubba)
1.0 Bearded Dragon (Joker)
3.1 Cats (Buffy, Spike, London, and Lilly)

This is burrow entrance number 5 this week, he never stops digging for more than a few hours or so. Substrate does so much for them, and that doesnt include nail trimming, and exercise.

I agree, and so does Dorado!

Pam

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