Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Ok I have a couple of questions for you all.

How long does it take Mali Uromastyx to grow to the size of an adult? Like how many years should it take them to get to their max length.

Is there any chance there could be like "midget" or "dwarf" Mali uro's?

See me and my bro have had our Mali's since November of 2002 I think. They were about 6 inches long when we got them and they're only about 9-11 inches long now. We've got the proper heating set ups for them. They both have a hide out (Mine just likes to sleep under his food dish, he's silly) and different food dishes.

They were both shipped to the petsmart together so we got them both at the same time and I think they are both male.

Their poop is normal, no blood or anything weird (except my hair, my mali ares likes chomping on it while he sits on my shoulder.) Both of them have never puked and neither have ever been sick or exposed to anything that could cause parasites. Behavior is normal, playful, they are starting brumation soon I think.

But is there a reason why they haven't grown that much since we've gotten them?
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I'm really starting to wonder if there's a grain of truth to "they only grow to the size of their container". It could be that growth rate is slowed (but not stopped) if the uro is in relatively tight quarters.

I'll let you know if I notice any significant difference in Ra's growth rate when he moves into the 125-gallon tank.

Also, do you have several uros or just one? I believe that uros can actually smell another uro around even if it's not in the same tank. If it's intimidated, growth rate could be reduced.

I noticed Ra acting weird when I first brought Isis home. He never saw her but he knew something was different. He hid for a few hours longer than normal for about 2 days. Now, he spends quite a lot of his time on the right side of his tank (in the general direction of Isis's tank), looking for her.

I hope this helps at least a bit
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1.1 Mali Uromastyx (Ra and Isis)

It's a 55 long I think. They've grown 3 1/2 inches since I got them.

Both were shipped together to Petsmart, where my brother used to work when we got them.
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The cage size may have to do with it, also the type of food, supplements, and lighting will also effect growth rate. Some just grow slower than others too, like people! My mali is about 7 years old, and he was noticeably growing up until last year! Now he just seems to be growing OUT. He is only probably 13 inches or so (I have not measured his length recently), but otherwise very healthy and "happy". So if your Uros are only 3ish years old, and all other signs are good, they may just still be growing.

Also, if you have them housed together, stress may be a factor. Because the Uros are territorial, if both males live in the same cage, and even more so if it is on the small side, they may be expending their energy on stress, instead of growing.

Just my thoughts on the subject.

Elizabeth
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1.0 Uro Archimedes
0.0 Fish
0.1 Sulcata Minnie
1.1 Iguanas Flik and Loki
0.1 Newfoundland Jasmine
0.1 Feline Winter
Indiana & Wisconsin

both males are in same cage.

So today I went downstairs to check on Ares. I picked him up and he's got a scrape on his bottom left foot on the back of his last toe. So I cleaned it out and put flower on it.

I think it could be from Apollo, but it could most likely be from a rock or the stair case (its like a fish tank decoration, he dug under it and was sleeping in it last night when I picked him up).

So I'm thinking, should I put him back in the terrarium with Apollo or should I go and buy him a 40 gallon breeder tank just for him?

Keep in mind I have limited room in my room, and that's where he'd have to go. I'd also have to buy another heat bulb, uvb bulb and heat lamp (the holder for the bulb).

Should I?
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It might be a good idea to separate the two males, particularly if they're reaching sexual maturity. There could be some passive dominance behaviour going on that you aren't aware of. Maybe you should try the separate arrangements for a while and see if they are more comfortable being apart than together.

Good luck
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1.1 Mali Uromastyx (Ra and Isis)

if you have the means to separate them i probably would. they may seem nice to each other but you never really know what is going on in those little brains. someone a while back posted pictures of a male and a female who got into it and it was much worse than a scratch on the foot. it was more like blood on the walls. maybe work on getting the lamps over a couple weeks and then move one of them
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vonnie
***Marriage is a great institution, but I'm not ready for an institution yet. Mae West ***

I might.

I don't know what caused Ares to get hurt, but I know that I don't want him in the tank with Apollo until it gets healed up which might take awhile.

There is a problem though, we only have 2 empty tanks at my house. One is a tank that you would find a chameleon in and the other is only 20 gallons.

Should I go out and buy him a breeder tank to stay in?

Right now I have him inside a garbage can of mine (it's never had garbage in it, I bought it 2 days ago at target and haven't used it yet). There is a towel on the bottom for comfort. It's smooth so he won't be able to climb up and its ablout a foot and a half deep but its only a foot wide.

I'm going to ask again at the end of this post, should I go out and buy him a breeder tank just for him and just keep him and apollo seperated for the rest of their lives??????

I mean I'd like them to visit one another some time like outside of their enclosures. I just want to know if I should just buy the tank and keep him in it or if I should just clean out the 20 gallon and keep him in there until he heals up.
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If it were me, I would get them permanently separated. If you have the means, go ahead and get a complete tank set-up. If money is tight, you could get a 55 gallon rubbermaid bin to use temporarily. That would let you get the more critical stuff (lights and all) first, but still give him lots of space to live in for fairly cheap.
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Torey
Salem, Oregon, USA
1.1 Uromastyx Geyri (Joe and Arthur)
1.0.1 Uromastyx Dispar Maliensis (Tank and Turtle)
1.1 Anolis Carolinensis (Bowser and Leeloo)
1.1.1 African Dwarf Frogs (Bruce and Sheila)
1.0 Betta Splendens (Mr. Miagi)
1.1 Felis Domesticus (Roscolux and Jenny)

Ok I went to the bank and cashed in my change. I also got paid yesterday.

I have a total of $135.62 cash.

Now, I'm thinking that a 40 gallon breeder at Petco Costs about $80, I'm gonna call Petsmart and see how much a 40 gallon is over there. Which ever is cheaper I'm gonna buy.

But here's the thing, my mom has control over me (since i'm under 18 *i'm 17*) and she's saying that the 20 gallon we have is plenty big for him, when I know for a fact it isn't.

Could you all help me figure out a way to tell my mom that I need to get the 40 gallon for him and just seperate them permanently?

And since he's still got that cut on his back left foot on his last toe in the back, what type of substrate should I use? Should I just get 2 20 gallon things of reptile carpeting?
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Maybe you could print out some care sheets for your mom which will help her understand that these lizards need room. Not enough room would mean that these animals are being abused and that's not right. You could also tell her that the 20-gallon will only work for about x number of months before he will outgrow it and need the 40-gallon tank anyway.
If your mom is concerned about the cost, look into buying an appropriate sized Rubbermaid tub, they work great and at a fraction of the cost (that's what I have Isis in now and I know she values the privacy of the opaque walls).

I'm sorry I can't help you out more than this. I've been living here with my husband for about 2 years and he's the one who bought Ra for me as a birthday gift.

Good luck with your mom, just be mature about it and you should do fine.

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1.1 Mali Uromastyx (Ra and Isis)

>>Maybe you could print out some care sheets for your mom which will help her understand that these lizards need room. Not enough room would mean that these animals are being abused and that's not right. You could also tell her that the 20-gallon will only work for about x number of months before he will outgrow it and need the 40-gallon tank anyway.
>>If your mom is concerned about the cost, look into buying an appropriate sized Rubbermaid tub, they work great and at a fraction of the cost (that's what I have Isis in now and I know she values the privacy of the opaque walls).
>>
>>I'm sorry I can't help you out more than this. I've been living here with my husband for about 2 years and he's the one who bought Ra for me as a birthday gift.
>>
>>Good luck with your mom, just be mature about it and you should do fine.
>>
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>>1.1 Mali Uromastyx (Ra and Isis)

What type of heat source do you have on Isis while she's in the rubber maid tub?

Oh and I even told her I could get the tub and it would work and she still wouldn't listen. She says I have no place to put it. Thing is I want to give my old bunk bed to good will, its a good cause and I really don't like sitting up and getting a metal bar in my head every morning. If I could sell it then I'd have a place for a tank. She just doesn't listen to me anymore I even tried bribary and it STILL wouldn't work.

Nothing can help me reason with this woman.
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I use a mercury vapour bulb to provide light, heat, and UV rays and I have an infrared heat lamp to provide additional heat. Isis seems pretty satisfied with her heat sources (especially since the heat light creates a basking spot of 140 F). I used a wire 40-gallon cage top (the same kind as the one on Ra's 40-gallon tank) on the Rubbermaid tub.

Unfortunately, it sounds like you won't be able to convince your mother to change her mind. It is still her house and her rules. The only way you might be able to keep your uros in the same tank would be to (please don't hate me for saying this) trade one of your male uros for a female and hope that your other male and this new female get along. Or maybe if you have a friend that could care for your extra male until things smooth over between you and your mother.

Give her some time and try talking to her about it again when the waters are calm once more. Maybe you can work out a compromise (by the way, bribes never work, trust me ).

Good luck
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1.1 Mali Uromastyx (Ra and Isis)

Well I put Ares in the 50 gallon one he was originally in, then I took Apollo out for a punishment (I found blood on apollo's lower jaw so I'm assuming it was from Ares since Apollow doesn't have a scratch on him). His punishment last 10 minutes, I put him in a tank alone and let him think about what he did. It's sort of like a time out only for animals. He decided to thank me by peeing all over my nice shirt on his way back to the tank. I told him in a firm voice that if I found another scratch on my Ares that I would punish him for an hour next time. *the tank I use is an empty 20 gallon, it has a UVB bulb of 100 watts that I turn on so the animal has heat*

I hope no one hates me for giving time outs to them but I think he deserved it for biting my little baby.

I'll stop bribing her for now. But she'll give in eventually, she can't hold out forever.
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Triad,

If it were me I would definitely seperate them permanently. As for your mother it may or may not help to convert the Uro house parameters to human parameters. ie, the lizard is 6 inches long and the tank is 18 inches long, so 3 times longer. and then have her think about wriglling around on her belly living only in a space 3 times longer than she is. Though this approach would only work depending on the relationship you have with your mother, it could be construed as disrespectful if it is already a tense relationship. Also, you could have her come on and sort through the posts, we have repeatedly warned people away from 20 gallon tanks because they do not allow a temperature gradient that is sufficient for the Uro to thermo-regulate properly. Possibly you just need to explain the need for thermoregulation, how it works, the temperature gradient that is needed, etc. Logic will often work with parents.

In reply to your other question, regarding a cheap place to buy cages, by far the CHEAPEST way is to build them, unless you go with the rubbermaid option of course. The cage building forum here on Kingsnake is invaluable help. The cheapest, decent looking pre-made cages I have found were on ebay under "custom reptile cages".

Otherwise keep your eye out for garage sales and classified ads for aquariums. Be careful with the temporary plastic garbage can, not all of the thinner plastic cans will be able to withstand the heat from the lights without melting.

I wish I had better solutions for you, I have been pulling my hair out trying to figure out housing for my pets too. They sure do appreciate the time and money we spend on proper housing for them though!

Elizabeth
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1.0 Uro Archimedes
0.0 Fish
0.1 Sulcata Minnie
1.1 Iguanas Flik and Loki
0.1 Newfoundland Jasmine
0.1 Feline Winter
Indiana & Wisconsin

>>Triad,
>>
>>If it were me I would definitely seperate them permanently. As for your mother it may or may not help to convert the Uro house parameters to human parameters. ie, the lizard is 6 inches long and the tank is 18 inches long, so 3 times longer. and then have her think about wriglling around on her belly living only in a space 3 times longer than she is. Though this approach would only work depending on the relationship you have with your mother, it could be construed as disrespectful if it is already a tense relationship. Also, you could have her come on and sort through the posts, we have repeatedly warned people away from 20 gallon tanks because they do not allow a temperature gradient that is sufficient for the Uro to thermo-regulate properly. Possibly you just need to explain the need for thermoregulation, how it works, the temperature gradient that is needed, etc. Logic will often work with parents.
>>
>>In reply to your other question, regarding a cheap place to buy cages, by far the CHEAPEST way is to build them, unless you go with the rubbermaid option of course. The cage building forum here on Kingsnake is invaluable help. The cheapest, decent looking pre-made cages I have found were on ebay under "custom reptile cages".
>>
>>Otherwise keep your eye out for garage sales and classified ads for aquariums. Be careful with the temporary plastic garbage can, not all of the thinner plastic cans will be able to withstand the heat from the lights without melting.
>>
>>I wish I had better solutions for you, I have been pulling my hair out trying to figure out housing for my pets too. They sure do appreciate the time and money we spend on proper housing for them though!
>>
>>Elizabeth

See here is the thing, my mom just doesn't like to listen to me anymore. I started reading the post you wrote to her and she just stopped listening to me. She wanted me to tell you all that I don't have a job and that she's been the one paying for crickets and worms. I've paid her back sometimes when I have the money for buying those things. I've worked 2 summers and have saved money from those jobs. I do piece work for her work (I put labels on folders, 10 cents each folder) year round and save that money and use it for their food, lights and supplies.

There is just NO reasoning with my mom. She even told me today to sell some of my lizards, if not some then ALL of them so I would have money. She doesn't understand that I love them all so much that her asking me to sell them would be like someone telling her to sell her first born child for money. It's NOT going to happen I will never sell my pets ever.

Can someone please help me try to get through to her the importance of a tank for the appropriate size he is?
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well if it is a money issue then the only thing that you can really do is go get some kind of job. i did all kinds of jobs when i was in high school and even started working before i started high school
look around in the papers or ask your school counselor if he/she knows of any jobs, maybe you will not even have to do a normal job and just do odd jobs for your neighbors or something. just remember not to get frustrated and yell at her because that will really get you nowhere. didn't you say you had a brother? what does he have to say about all of this?
whenever i was growing up, i had the smallest room because i was the youngest so i took the bottom bunk out of my bunk bed which gave me some extra floor space for things that i liked. it's just a suggestion.
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vonnie
***Marriage is a great institution, but I'm not ready for an institution yet. Mae West ***

Yes I do have a brother, he doesn't really care about anything. He's going through a seperation right now (he got married at 19, and she left on valentines day this year, so he's waiting for her to go file for divorce and he just quit his job and he lost one of his good friends 2 weeks ago).

If I could take the bottom out of my bunk bed I would, but with mine its a Futon bunk bed and the bottom bed is a couch so I can't take it out and I also sleep on the bottom bunk.

I'm not in high school anymore so I don't have a counselor (my age might have lead you to believe that).

But I've talked it over w/her and we're cool now. She just wants me to get a job and sell my bed first before I can buy the 40 gallon breeder for Ares. So that's what I'm going to do. It should take less then a month for me to get a job and sell the bed.
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well i am glad that everything is getting resolved and your babies will get new cages, eventually. be extra nice to your brother. poor guy it sounds like he is having a rough year.
now get out there and find a job
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vonnie
***Marriage is a great institution, but I'm not ready for an institution yet. Mae West ***

Yeah I'll go look for one this week.
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My mom caved in and let me buy the new enclosures for Ares and Hades ( my bearded). Both needed new "homes". It's a little crowded in my room and my brothers room (he's making me keep mine downstairs so he can see his old roomie).

I got repti-carpet in with Hades and little bit of sand in with Ares. The scrape on his toe is healing up very very fast so I'm not worried about it anymore.

Now I have to go find a job.
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I am so glad everything worked out! Mosts parents will eventually work out an agreeable solution.
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1.0 Uro Archimedes
0.0 Fish
0.1 Sulcata Minnie
1.1 Iguanas Flik and Loki
0.1 Newfoundland Jasmine
0.1 Feline Winter
Indiana & Wisconsin

Yeah. It took a bit of convincing and a lot of promises made on my half in order to get the set ups.

I have to get a job and pay for crickets and worms from now on, all she'll buy is the vegetables that I feed them (but she buys them anyway).
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