Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I'm a novice with limited experience (don't own snakes but handle and read about them every chance I get)
In my local reptile store, I was shown a beautiful 7 ft tame amethystine python. From the slender sculptured shape, to the iridescent diamond shaped scales, to the sheer power inherent in that animal, I was and am awestruck.
So, I have a series of questions about these stunning creatures. I understand that they can reach a slender 14 feet. At this size can they be handled alone by a sensible handler and are they a potential danger to life and limb?
At their full size do rats remain an appropriate food item or do they require something larger?
What are their temperments like in general? ie once tamed and consistently handled are they pretty reliable? How difficult are babies to tame compared with other snakes, etc...
How do you recommend feeding them as to prevent a dangerous feeding response?
What are the minimum enclosure measurements needed to keep a fully grown adult comfortable?
And I'm interested in anything else you'd consider useful.
I am in no position to get one now, but perhaps, in the next few years... Anyway, thank you very much for your help.

I am by no means an expert, but I have kept and am a big fan of scrubs, so I thought I'd offer you my insights and opinions. I imagine Yasser of Spitfire Reptiles will respond soon, as he is probably the foremost expert on scrubs in the US. He has figured out how to pretty consistently breed, which is a lot more than I can say about just about everyone else. You may want to just take the initiative and contact him directly. Now onto the questions.

>>I'm a novice with limited experience (don't own snakes but handle and read about them every chance I get)
>>In my local reptile store, I was shown a beautiful 7 ft tame amethystine python. From the slender sculptured shape, to the iridescent diamond shaped scales, to the sheer power inherent in that animal, I was and am awestruck.

Sounds about right. Scrubs are truly awesome snakes. Big ones can take your breath away.

>>So, I have a series of questions about these stunning creatures. I understand that they can reach a slender 14 feet. At this size can they be handled alone by a sensible handler and are they a potential danger to life and limb?

It's generally not a good idea to handle alone a boid of any species when it reaches a lenth of 10' or so. Scrubs are no exception. Though they are quite slender-bodied, they are still very powerful snakes. I could see a 14 to 15' scrub having little to no trouble overpowering a person. I used to have a 9'9" souther scrub, who decided to nail me one day, afterwhich I grabbed her head so she coudln't bite again. She immediately wrapped around the entire length of my arm, and without assistance, I believe I would have had to take another bite or two and let her release me on her own (all this was during an ed. presentation, no less). You'd probably want someone around during handling procedures. That said, not all scrubs reach such great lengths. In fact, only two localities commonly available in the US do: southerns and barnecks. I'm assuming the one you saw, being 7', was probably one of those two, but there are other localities (yet to be described as separate subspecies) out there. Arus and Mollucans are both very attractive snakes and generally tend to stay under 7'.

>>At their full size do rats remain an appropriate food item or do they require something larger?

Scrubs can be fed on rats for their entire lives. However, a really big scrub may need to be graduated to rabbits just for convenient's sake. A 14 or 15' scrub would easily consume 3 or 4, maybe more, adult rats in a single setting. That same mass of food could be handle by one, maybe two, smallish to smaller medium rabbits. They would never be able to take the equivalent rabbit a 15' burm or retic could because of their smaller head size, but two smaller ones would last them a while. Also, according to some of the much more knowledgable persons I've spoken with, scrubs, as adults, don't really need to eat all that often. Once or twice a month should suffice. If the meal is very big (i.e., a couple of rabbits) I'd definitely only feed once a month. Scrubs are supposed to be slender in build, so you don't want to make them obese.

>>What are their temperments like in general? ie once tamed and consistently handled are they pretty reliable? How difficult are babies to tame compared with other snakes, etc...

First off, I would never call a scrub or any other snake or even reptile "tame." I personally just believe that is a title unfit for these animals. Docile, socialized maybe, but tame, never. Tame implies that you can trust the animal, which you absolutely cannot with a reptile. Temperaments of scrubs pythongs are known to be less than flowery. Wild caughts are available often and this is probably where the stereotype comes from. The two southerns I've kept would both bite you if you were stupid enough to wave your hand in front of their face, but otherwise were fairly okay with handling. Always always always use a hook to remove one from the enclosure. Never just reach in, or you're begging for a bite. And bites from scrubs can be a very serious matter. Think of them as giant green tree pythons in the teeth department. The possibility of nerve damage, or even opening an artery, is there. You must always be careful when dealing with them. I was lucky in that the snake that bit me only wrapped her mouth around my forearm. The worst of it was that she burst a blood vessel under the skin and it swelled for a day, then dissipated. It could have been much worse, requiring stitches and maybe even surgery. This is not meant to scare you away from these snakes, just to give you a realistic outlook on the danger.

Baby scrubs, like all baby pythons, will almost without a doubt be snappy. They are smaller and scared, and will protect themselves accordingly in the only manner they feel is effective. If you can get a baby (which I highly recommend), and handle it often after it has had time to adjust to its new home, you will probably be bitten numerous times, but it's better to be bitten then than when it's huge. Once it realizes that biting is just not going to work, which can sometimes be pretty quick and sometimes take months, it should stop. Just keep its environment stress free and feed it well.

>>How do you recommend feeding them as to prevent a dangerous feeding response?

This is a pretty debatable topic. Being that I keep retics, and the cumbersome nature of having to remove them from their enclosure for feeding every time, I just feed them in the enclosure. That is something that is highly recommended against by some keepers, and there is some merit there. Snakes fed inside the cage will develop an expectation for food as soon as the door is open. My retics and olives are no exception. However, that feeding responce can be easily and quickly "turned off" by a tap on the head with a hook, or lightly rubbing the body with the hook. Never smack the snake, just get it to establish a pattern that when this happens, it is not getting fed. Doing this, I've never had any problems with any of my snakes. Of course you can remove the snake for feeding if you wish, but in my opinion, that could cause something even worse to happen: the snake may then begin to expect that whenever handled, food will come. With big snakes, that's a bad notion.

>>What are the minimum enclosure measurements needed to keep a fully grown adult comfortable?

Something about this question bugs me. I realize you mean no harm, but wouldn't it be better to ask, "What size enclosure would be most preferable for an adult?" For a very large adult in excess of 10', I wouldn't give it any less than a 4 or 5' long enclosure, 2 to 3' deep, and maybe with some height for climbing if it so desires. Young scrubs are very arboreal, adults...not so much. So climbing space for adults is probably negligible. You could always go longer, I'm sure they wouldn't mind, but that size would probably be the bare minimum you'd want.

>>And I'm interested in anything else you'd consider useful.
>>I am in no position to get one now, but perhaps, in the next few years... Anyway, thank you very much for your help.

The only other thing I can say about scrubs is that they are a great joy to keep. Just always keep in mind what those many deep labial pits are for: these guys are heat seeking missiles when they want to be, and they rarely miss. When I was bitten by my big adult, I was my own fault. I was distracted by a question, and stupidly waved my arm a bit while talking, which she promptly grabbed. Scrubs certainly can be dangerous, but only as dangerous as you let them be. Always keep a calm, logical head on your shoulders, and you will not have problems. Also, BUY CAPTIVE BORN. Stay well away from w.c., especially if they are fresh. W.c. scrubs can be a nightmare to get to consistantly eat, treat their inevitable parasite load, and calm down. Yasser tends to produce clutches of barnecks and southerns every year or at least every other, and I highly recommend going with him for all your amethystine needs. If you have any more questions, just ask.
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Chance Duncan
http://www.rivervalleysnakes.com

I was cruising the posts and, as I don't know much about scrubs, I read your post. I learned a lot, so thanks for taking the time to write such a good reply.

Moluccans get larger than 7 feet with regularity. I'd say the average adult Mol is around 8-10 feet. While most scrubs are very slender, mature Mols tend to be a bit more thick when compard to other scrubs of the same length. We've seen and owned a few monsters that were in excess of 14 feet and over 40 lbs. This is by far not the norm but it can and does happen from time to time.

-Yasser
Spitfire Reptiles

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For some reason I was thinking Moluccans and Arus both tended to be on the smaller end. Wow....I would LOVE to see a really large, really yellow Moluccan. You don't have any pics on hand eh?
-Chance
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Chance Duncan
http://www.rivervalleysnakes.com

Wow... Thank you for that extremely extensive and thoughtful reply. They're far too much snake for me now, but with a few more years experience, they're certainly something to aspire to. (I'll definitely have to research the Arus!)

I realize that this post has been responded to very well, but thought I would chime in as well.

"I understand that they can reach a slender 14 feet. At this size can they be handled alone by a sensible handler and are they a potential danger to life and limb?"

What do you consider slender? If you are talking compaired to a retic of burm, yes. But they are still are as girthy as a 1 liter bottle at that size.

Here is a pic of my large female barneck from none other than the Yasser man himself.

"At their full size do rats remain an appropriate food item or do they require something larger?"

I would say that my big girl would be ok on a maintenance diet of two colossal rats every two-four weeks. I also feed her chickens regularly which are very cheap to buy and raise to feeding size each year then freeze.

"What are their temperments like in general? ie once tamed and consistently handled are they pretty reliable?"

As with all snakes, it really depends on the individual. Reliable, I wouldn't say that...I have some that have yet to bite me, but just about every one has scared me at one time our another. Whether that be coming out of the cage four foot to snag a rat out of my hands, or just whipping around for no reason while being held, etc.

"How difficult are babies to tame compared with other snakes, etc..."

I have found them rather hard to hand tame with excessive handling, I think they tame better if you just leave them alone. They aren't a handling snake anyway really. They make much better display animals.

"How do you recommend feeding them as to prevent a dangerous feeding response?"

Most don't even need the food offered directly to them, you can get it in the cage however is least dangerous, and they will without a doubt find it and eat.

"What are the minimum enclosure measurements needed to keep a fully grown adult comfortable?"

I keep my biggest girl in a 48x30x18, she seems content, but a little more height would probably be used if offered.

"And I'm interested in anything else you'd consider useful."

I would check out www.spitfirereptiles and moreliapythons.com for more pics and info, or to just talk to more scrub keepers.

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Jim Kuroski

www.moreliapythons.com

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