Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Yesterday my wife and I decided to take a drive up to the new Glades Herp location and check out a couple Malagasy Blonde Hognoses (Leioheterodon modestus). Upon arrival, we were shown two containers, each holding a female blonde. The Glades employee handed on to my wife and I grabbed the other. Both were very squirmy but the one I was holding was particularly bad. She let out loud hisses and lunged at anything that moved. After a minute or so my wife and I traded snakes. The more agitated of the two (which she now had) let out a small amount of musk and before I heard my wife exclaim "Uh-oh. There it goes!" I look over to see the snake gnawing on her forearm. The snake was removed after about ten seconds. The bite area bled profusely and there were noticeable fang marks. After washing it off and making a couple jokes about the incident, we purchased the one that didn't bite my wife and headed home.

The bite didn't initially seem to cause any more pain than that of a rat snake. After a couple hours there was a little tenderness around the fang marks when touched, and some bruising and possibly some swelling (it was so minor it is difficult to say for sure). After about 8-10 hours we could see a definite discoloration around the upper jaw area that measured 1.5 by 2 inches. By this morning, the bite has improved with very little discoloration and pain.

So here is what our experience taught me:
- Malagasy Blondes will bite out of fear/aggression
- There is a little something going on with the venom (hence the discoloration and tenderness around the fang marks)
- The bite was very mild, possibly on par with Heteredon

Anyway, that’s our story. Here is a pic

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2.4 Western Hognose Snakes
1.0 Malagasy Speckled Hognose Snake
0.1 Malagasy Blonde Hognose Snake
1.0 Texas Longnose Snake
1.0 Ball Python
2.2 Bearded Dragons
0.1 Green Iguana
0.1 Cat
0.1 Dog
1.0 Rat

*

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2.4 Western Hognose Snakes
1.0 Malagasy Speckled Hognose Snake
0.1 Malagasy Blonde Hognose Snake
1.0 Texas Longnose Snake
1.0 Ball Python
2.2 Bearded Dragons
0.1 Green Iguana
0.1 Cat
0.1 Dog
1.0 Rat

Just kidding

This is certainly some new information for me, but I have not focused at all on the non-Heterdon kinds of hognoses. And for the record, when I speak about hognoses on this forum I am referring specifically to Heterodon.

I think that this particular bite would be of greater significance if it were Heterodon. Frankly I don't know, or understand, the evolutionary relationships of the different types of hognoses. Is there truly any relationship between the different genera, or are they artificially grouped together because of their common names? For the people who have worked with the other genera, are there any generalizations we can make amongts all of the "hognoses"?
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...the oldest task in human history: to live on a piece of land without spoiling it."
Aldo Leopold (1938)

"Sometimes I think the surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried to contact us."
Calvin and Hobbes (Scientific Progress Goes 'Boink', 1991)

I believe it is quite possible that the different hognose species, particularly those from different hemispheres, might have a good degree of bilateral adaption where similar circumstances have led to similar traits being selected as opposed to sharing a recent common ancestor. I am not saying this for sure, but it is possible. I would love to see a genetic test done comparing Heterodon and Leioheterodon, but nothing has been done so far.

I was curious about the severity (or lack of severity) of this bite. I have never known anyone to be bitten by Leioheterodon but I have read that many people believe it to be worse than Heterodon. The main difference between her experience and those I have heard from with Western Hognose bites is she had no itching. I have heard Western bites tend to itch.

Anyway, thanks for your comment. Pam still has a little discoloration around the bite but that is it. No worse for wear.

Jim
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2.4 Western Hognose Snakes
1.0 Malagasy Speckled Hognose Snake
0.1 Malagasy Blonde Hognose Snake
1.0 Texas Longnose Snake
1.0 Ball Python
2.2 Bearded Dragons
0.1 Green Iguana
0.1 Cat
0.1 Dog
1.0 Rat

We have published one paper on Leioheterodon venom (link below) and have several more in the pipeline. Their venoms are enzyme rich but there are a number of other toxins in there, including neurotoxins. The local effects she experienced are consistent with this. Incidently, they are utterly unrelated to Heterodon. They are actually vasltly closer to elapids! However, I would rate them as not of substantial medical importance.

Cheers
Bryan
Colubroidea venom paper

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Dr. Bryan Grieg Fry
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Australian Venom Research Unit,
University of Melbourne
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Population and Evolutionary Genetics Unit,
Museum Victoria
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http://www.venomdoc.com

Just wanted to say thanks for sharing your photos I looked around on-line a lot last year for info on leioheterodon bites so thank you and thank you Dr. fry.
Happy Herpping Everybody,
Cameron