Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Hello all, has anyone ever seen this before...

This past weekend I attended the NARBC conference and trade show in Chicago (Tinley Park), where I picked up the most unique little mex mex hatchling with a ground coloration I had never seen or heard of before. This little male has all of the usual L. mexicana mexicana pattern and marking traits, however the ground coloration is a light tan/buckskin which carries on to the ventral along with the red and black. There are very slight hints of a light orange hue in ares along the dorsal, particularly within the light saddle outlines. The center of the lateral areas between the red saddles, which are normally tints of gray, are more of a brown or vermillion coloration.

This hatchling was produced by a very reputable breeder of kings and woma pythons who is very dilligent about working with the purest of the species. His breeders were purchased from different sources and are of course unrelated, and to the best of his knowledge there is no history of hybridization in their bloodlines. The female is a very bright high red specimen. A few of these unusual colored babies popped out of his clutch this year and are quite interesting.

Has anyone ever seen or heard of this color morph in a mex mex???

Any input will be greatly appreciated!

Mike

Love to see a few pics! Although I have a few that display a bit of tannish near their head, I haven't produced any with the colors you describe. sounds very much "thayeri" to me, but if you say it is 100%, I can't say it's not. I love the mexicana and would sure welcome some new looks as well, I think.
PICS!!
:Mark

Hey Mark... Top O' the mornin' to ya.

My sweetie has the digicam this week up in Orland Park, when I get it back next weekend I will definitely post a few shots. E-mail me and I will send them directly to you. My first impression of this little guy as well was possible thayeri blood as I am heavy into thayeri, with a couple dozen high end future breeders in my colony from Tim Gebhard, Dan Vermilya and David Weymouth. A few of my milksnake phase thayeri specimens from Tim's wild projects, produced from a saturated orange male and F1 females, have a "similar" look to them... however this little mex mex has all of the mex mex characteristics.

The parents of this little guy have been sold, I contacted the new owner and asked for pics of these breeders and if I get them, I will pass them along to you as well so we can try to figure this thing out.

Thanks for the reply...

Mike

Tim Gebhard, Dan Vermilya, and David Weymouth are all highly respected breeders when it comes to Thayeri. My 4.4 thayeri are from the three of them as well. I know Dan and David deal with mex-mex too. I have seen photos of mexicana with buckskin backgrounds before, but they don't seem common in the pet trade. I know the whole mexicana complex is highly variable, which is why Gartska eliminated all of the sub-species in 1982. If I were you, I would contact Tim Gebhard or Dan Vermilya. They are both experts on mexicana as far as I'm concerned, and have both spent time in Mexico researching these snakes. I know Dan sells Womas Pythons as well. Did you get this snake from him? If you did, I wouldn't question it's pedigree.

Greg Huston

Pic of a 2002 Dan Vermilya Thayeri

Thanks Greg for your input, it is appreciated. This mex mex hatchling was produced by and purchased from Jim Sargent of Split Rock Reptiles. He sorrowfully sold the parents to move into Ric Blair's "black" dark phase animals. He wishes he had kept the pair that produced these tan colored babies.

That Vermilya high white thayeri... are you the proud owner? If so, I hope that you don't mind that I have been using that very photo as my wallpaper! Fantastic animal. I recently purchased a terrific '04 high white male from Dan (see photo), I also have a couple very nice females from his high white project along with a handfull of his best '03 babies. He has done some outstanding work with his thayeri and so has Tim. Tim's wild Doctor Arroyo animals, of which I have several offspring from, are just amazing with their severely reduced black leonis patterns.

Another attempt at the thayeri photo, excuse the previous mis-fire...

We need to get in touch! I have a pair of '02 white thayeri from Dan, and a pair of '04 white thayeri from him as well. I also have a pair from Tim's wild caught Dr. Arroyo female (Dan says that Tim's snake is from Aramberri, not Dr. Arroyo, but it's Tim's, so I'll go with Dr. Arroyo). My 4th pair of thayeri is from David Weymouth and they are high orange female and a high yellow male.

Greg

I agree Greg and I would love to get in touch, sounds like our thayeri interests are much the same. Contact me through my username above.

Many exciting things are to come of our animals, they are some of the best available I can see and my personal breeding focus will be primarily thayeri. As you may have read in a previous post I also work with alterna, greeri and mex mex in my collection which now consists of 37 animals..... 6 greeri (2 pair and 2 remaining babies, F1 male and Appelgate females. My first successful breeding effort just this year)..... a trio of Blair's phase Pandale Dirt Road alterna (striking wild caught male) ready to breed next season..... 4 very nice mex mex (one male being the interesting "brown phase" animal I am attempting to sort out)..... and 24 superior quality thayeri.

I will be posting photos in the gallery of my animals as I have the time, I would be happy to e-mail many of them to you if you would like to take a look.

I would assume you plan to breed your thayeri?

Mike