Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Hey guys,

I was just wondering if anyone is out looking for Ensatinas or other salamaders lately. That rain we just had in CA should be enough to get them out and about. just curious. replies are, as always,appreciated.

-Phil

the next heavy rains will bring out tigers and pacific giants up here in sonoma county/jon

Jon,
The tiger salamander is native to far E. Oregon but I have never seen one in the wild. Are they introduced or native to Sonoma County? Understand from Rick S. that the Calif. F & G Commission
spent a great deal of time on that species during one day of their recent session.

Weather conditions were unsuitable during my trip south so I made it up and back in three days from the 16th to the 18th. Released 11 boas in SW Oregon and 10 boas in Calif. including the two small subadults in NE Sonoma county.

Found one boa on the way down in Shasta County. Otherwise, it was just a long drive, 2245 miles in those three days.

Richard F. Hoyer

they are native here, but it must be raining hard to see them crossing roads at night. most of the areas i used to find them in are now housing. one certain area i identified to fish and game that is full of tigers crossing after first heavy rains,I hoped to have traffic diverted around, but it fell on deaf ears. the pacific giants are common in certain areas during heavy rains.glad to hear about the charinas/jon

From a biological persperctive, it's Charina, so who cares? But, That's a no-no with Cal DF&G. I wouldn't be posting that...

EL,
For one, I care. There are gobs of C. bottae in preserved collections. Unless a locality is poorly represented or has no representation, then for about 40 years my personal philosophy and preference has been to release specimens where found. When I applied for my scientific permits in Wash., Oregon, and Calif., that was part of the specifications I had incorporated in the wording of such permits.

Richard F. Hoyer

n/p

My permits were issued by the states of Oregon, Washington, and California. No federal permit is necessary as the Rubber Boa is not federally listed.

Richard F. Hoyer

Would you be willing to explain how one gets such a permit? I wish I had know about that during my California time; would have bred and released baby Lampropeltis instead of giving them away or selling them. My experience, at least, was that Cal DF&G always maintaines a pretty adverserial position to private hobbyists like us. Your comments?....

EL,
Eric said: "My experience, at least, was that Cal DF&G always maintaines a pretty adverserial position to private hobbyists like us. Your comments?...."

I believe your assessment is dead on. That appears to be the attitude of other wildlife agencies as well. I believe some of that attitude is driven by law enforcement and part driven by biologist that know virtually nothing about field biology let alone herpetology. Troy Hibbits on this or the Fieldherpers forum provided good insight to the problem when he indicate that there are essentially two type of wildlife biologists that work for wildlife agencies. There are those that graduated with degrees in wildlife science and manage game species. Then there are those that obtain degrees in related fields, such as conservation biology, that basically have a much different approach to wildlife than do the game biologists. That approach is mainly a 'hands-off' approach.

Although I am an amateur herpetologist in the sense my undergraduate degree is in Wildlife Sci. and not herpetology, I have taken my hobby seriously enough to have published some of my findings. That gave me an edge in applying for, and receiving state permits. Otherwise I believe an amateur would need to be affiliated with a university, research organization, or sponsored by a recognized professional. As a matter of fact, I believe the application for a Calif. permit indicates a person needs to have such affiliation or sponsorship. To my way of thinking, that is sad as the non-professional, amateur field herpetologists have a great deal to offer and in the present situation, are pretty much shut out of the process.

As far as appling for a permit, you can contact the CDFG and request an application for a Scientific Collecting Permit. You can access this type of information on their web site.

Richard F. Hoyer