Reptile & Amphibian Forums

ok guys, need some help. I'm having problems with one of my geckos....he has a lump behind his eye and one on his lower lip. the crud on his lip is from a bad shed that we will be working on when he sheds again.

the only thing i know about the lumps is that they are sensitive but solid when you touch them. Louie reacts when you touch them so they must hurt. its only on one side, the other side looks fine. he hasn't been eating a whole lot, but everyone's been on an eating hiatus lately. he might not eat if this hurts as much as i think it does. he can drink, as he demonstrated tonight when he drank from the sink faucet.

any one with any ideas? Tumors? Infection? vet visit? my vet isn't a specialty one but tries hard....this geck has been in to visit before for a prolapse problem last year (actually i think we are looking at another visit for the other side now.....) and was basically 1/2 fixed.

I don't know what to tell you. Except maybe you should get him to a vet, if you could get him to a specialist that would be even better but a vet will do.

Is there a chance that something could have bitten him like a spider?

In MY Opinion that looks like a spider bite. I know because I've been fortunate enough to have been bitten 3 times. 2 were from a riclous and 1 from a wolf spider. If a pussy filled head comes up on the bump then it could be a spider bite. Spider bites are also sensitive ( I had one on the back of my right thigh and it hurt to touch my thigh to anything).
-----
2 mali uro's-Ares and Apollo
2 saharan uro's-Orion and Iris
2 bearded dragon-Hades and Draco
1 leo gecko-Kalypso
1 tokaye gecko-Sid Vicious
1 tarantula-Peter Parker
1 dog-cheeka
1 zebra finch-beeps
1 african gray parrot-keya
1 red headed parrot-pancho
And some fish

we don't have any real dangerous spiders around here but we do have a ton of small spiders and they are all coming into the house for the winter so i would suppose that it is possible that he got bit.

the bite was smaller last week, i'm alarmed now since there is now two and they are bigger.

It's not going to go away by itself and it'll only continue to get worse. Looks like a growing abscess that could've been caused by a number of reasons. He may need to be put on antibiotics.
-----
chickabowwow

Even the smallest spiders and the smallest amount of venom can do seriouis harm. Heck even a grand daddy long legs could've done that (because leopard gecko's are smaller then babies they are also easily succeptable to grand daddy long legs).

This is just from my experience on getting bitten from spiders.

I still say take him/her to the vet today.
-----
2 mali uro's-Ares and Apollo
2 saharan uro's-Orion and Iris
2 bearded dragon-Hades and Draco
1 leo gecko-Kalypso
1 tokaye gecko-Sid Vicious
1 tarantula-Peter Parker
1 dog-cheeka
1 zebra finch-beeps
1 african gray parrot-keya
1 red headed parrot-pancho
And some fish

How in the world can anyone possibly diagnos that as a spider bite???? Are you an expert in spider bites???? Are you a vet that can tell what is wrong with a reptile just by looking at a blurry picture????? Unreal..... Take that leo to the vet!!!!!!!!!!

>>How in the world can anyone possibly diagnos that as a spider bite???? Are you an expert in spider bites???? Are you a vet that can tell what is wrong with a reptile just by looking at a blurry picture????? Unreal..... Take that leo to the vet!!!!!!!!!!

Well if you would've read my first 2 posts you'd know that I said I'm not an expert at all and that I already told the person to take the leo to the vet.

But I am very experienced in the field of spider bites since I myself have been bitten 3 times, 2 times by a brown recluos which is the newest and 2nd most poisonous spider known to man and 1 time by a wolf spider. All of which if left untreated could've cost me a limb.

My dad got bit by a recluos and had this huge pimple type thing and a ton of puss came out of it. I said that it looked like a spider bite, I never once said I was a vet and that the bump is a spider bite.
-----
1.1 mali uro's-Ares and Apollo
1.2 saharan uro's-Orion and Iris
1.2 bearded dragon-Hades and Draco
0.2 leo gecko-Kalypso
0.3 tokaye gecko-Sid Vicious
1.0 tarantula-Peter Parker
0.2 dog-cheeka
0.2 zebra finch-beeps
0.2 african gray parrot-keya
1.0 red headed parrot-pancho
0.3 Fish (sorry no names for them)

Yeah well I can tell how experianced you are when it comes to spider bites especially with your last post..... The "brown reclous" is the 2nd most venomous spider knwon to man???? You are way off there buddy..... I can name 5 species off the top of my head that are much more toxic than the brown recluse.... Anyway, Xelda was much more close to what the problem can be.... You are way off....

.
-----
Katie
Peach State Geckos
Breeding Mealworms
My Email

In my opinion it was misleading info not based on anything other than a blurry pic and a personal experiance with a spider bite....... The only thing that should be said from someone that does not know what it is for sure is "I am not sure what it is.... Take it to a vet...." Hey, I had a snake bite that swelled like that..... Maybe that leo got bitten by a snake....

>>In my opinion it was misleading info not based on anything other than a blurry pic and a personal experiance with a spider bite....... The only thing that should be said from someone that does not know what it is for sure is "I am not sure what it is.... Take it to a vet...." Hey, I had a snake bite that swelled like that..... Maybe that leo got bitten by a snake....
-----
Katie
Peach State Geckos
Breeding Mealworms
My Email

I can't believe this.. Gregg, it seems like wherever you post there's always alot of fighting going on, maybe before you post on here you should attend a few Anger Management classes so that you don't flip out when you can't read something properly? Leave Triad alone, never gave a definite answer and the person who posted that photo even said they were getting alot of little spiders in the house anyway. Also, as far as that Brown Recluse spider being the second deadliest-- He never said "in the world". I've seen pictures and even read up on that spider before because I was biten in my sleep by a spider who I thought might of been that because my wound was looking similar.. Thankfully it was nothing serious. But, anyway.. Gregg, really now.. That was totally uncalled for and you need to have some respect.. Take care.. =
-----
-Britney

Atlantic Reptiles(In the works)

2.4.1 Leopard Geckos: Ron, Raine, Dream, Tango, Go-Go, Johnneh and Salleh.
0.0.1 Bearded Dragon: Lil' Little.

N/P
-----
-Britney

Atlantic Reptiles(In the works)

2.4.1 Leopard Geckos: Ron, Raine, Dream, Tango, Go-Go, Johnneh and Salleh.
0.0.1 Bearded Dragon: Lil' Little.

>>Yeah well I can tell how experianced you are when it comes to spider bites especially with your last post..... The "brown reclous" is the 2nd most venomous spider knwon to man???? You are way off there buddy..... I can name 5 species off the top of my head that are much more toxic than the brown recluse.... Anyway, Xelda was much more close to what the problem can be.... You are way off....

First off, brown rec. is the 2nd most venomous spider in IL, for a fact.

I didn't mean known to man I meant known to me but yesterday I couldn't type very well since I got bit by a bearded dragon and had to get a shot in my hand.

Here is my first post:
Posted by: Triad at Fri Oct 29 21:59:09 2004 [ Report Abuse ] [ Email Message ]

I don't know what to tell you. Except maybe you should get him to a vet, if you could get him to a specialist that would be even better but a vet will do.

Is there a chance that something could have bitten him like a spider?

In MY Opinion that looks like a spider bite. I know because I've been fortunate enough to have been bitten 3 times. 2 were from a riclous and 1 from a wolf spider. If a pussy filled head comes up on the bump then it could be a spider bite. Spider bites are also sensitive ( I had one on the back of my right thigh and it hurt to touch my thigh to anything).

So.....
-----
1.1 mali uro's-Ares and Apollo
1.2 saharan uro's-Orion and Iris
1.2 bearded dragon-Hades and Draco
0.2 leo gecko-Kalypso
0.3 tokaye gecko-Sid Vicious
1.0 tarantula-Peter Parker
0.2 dog-cheeka
0.2 zebra finch-beeps
0.2 african gray parrot-keya
1.0 red headed parrot-pancho
0.3 Fish (sorry no names for them)

"I got bit by a bearded dragon and had to get a shot in my hand."

Now, why would you get a shot for being bitten by a bearded dragon?
-----
My blood is workin', but my, my heart is...DEAD!

>>"I got bit by a bearded dragon and had to get a shot in my hand."
>>
>>
>>Now, why would you get a shot for being bitten by a bearded dragon?
>>-----
>>My blood is workin', but my, my heart is...DEAD!

Bearded Dragons carry Salmanoli, so there's a chance when bitten to get the disease so I had to get one.
-----
1.1 mali uro's-Ares and Apollo
1.2 saharan uro's-Orion and Iris
1.2 bearded dragon-Hades and Draco
0.2 leo gecko-Kalypso
0.3 tokaye gecko-Sid Vicious
1.0 tarantula-Peter Parker
0.2 dog-cheeka
0.2 zebra finch-beeps
0.2 african gray parrot-keya
1.0 red headed parrot-pancho
0.3 Fish (sorry no names for them)

Seriously dude if you do not know the answer, why suggest something that is without a thought of theory behind it. and another thing, you got bit by a spider WHOO HOO doenst make you an expert... i got bit by a misquito, yup since it stuck its mouth part into my arm it transmitted all of these different things into my mind telling me everything about them... quite amazing, in my town they call me "Mr. Misqueet".

Anyhow is you seriously have no clue what the heck it is. then why post something that is false, good job for you for saying take it to the vet, but dont "suggest" something that could cause him more stress in his life and cost him more money.
-----
Leopard Geckos ROCK!!!
Leopard Geckos ROCK!!!
Leopard Geckos ROCK!!!
Leopard Geckos ROCK!!! Leopard Geckos ROCK!!!
Leopard Geckos ROCK!!!
Leopard Geckos ROCK!!!
Leopard Geckos ROCK!!!

You guys are taking Dove for an idiot.
He or she can figure out for themselves whether or not to take the advice. I'm afraid that the only advice i would follow would be from a select few who have posted for a while civilly, maturely and with experience; you others i honestly ignore.

Please avoid flaming people for their opinions, if an experience that is different than ours that doesn't make that person stupid. Don't let the ambiguity of the internet allow you to gang up on the inexperienced.
I've many a time read some of these posts found them outrageous and in turn written a horrible, mean post but never pushed the send button.
Lets calm our egos down, because that's why all the big name breeders left this forum.

do you ever look at my posts? because i've come up with a theory in my life, dont talk if you dont know the answer...
-----
Leopard Geckos ROCK!!!
Leopard Geckos ROCK!!!
Leopard Geckos ROCK!!!
Leopard Geckos ROCK!!! Leopard Geckos ROCK!!!
Leopard Geckos ROCK!!!
Leopard Geckos ROCK!!!
Leopard Geckos ROCK!!!

If we never talked when we didn't know the answer none of this topics would have posts. Many people don't say this but your vet DOES NOT KNOW too. They are trained and know more then us but they often fon't KNOW what they are looking at either. They can suggest things.

I personally will suggest something if i know it will not hurt and that I have seen or heard it somewhere else. AND if it seems a reasonable explanation and is logical. BUT I will always say that I am not sure and suggest perfessional assistance if I feel it is needed. Which in this case if is.
-----
~Akira
1.0 African Fat-tailed Gecko
0.0.1 Leopard Gecko (hypo tangrine circle-back?)
0.0.2 Red Ear Slider

Leopardgeckoman, I'm taken by surprise that you would reply with something so hurtful.. That's taking you down to Gregg's level.. Come on now, use your head..
-----
-Britney

Atlantic Reptiles(In the works)

2.4.1 Leopard Geckos: Ron, Raine, Dream, Tango, Go-Go, Johnneh and Salleh.
0.0.1 Bearded Dragon: Lil' Little.

how is it being so hurtful, yes the comment i said in it wasnt very appropriate i wasnt thinking straight, but the subject itself has to be stated by someone, ive been watching this forum for a year now and even my friend that doesnt have a leopard gecko can tell the info here is false because he has many animals that has the same needs, so you see if i adress this problem, mabye it will get corrected.
-----
Leopard Geckos ROCK!!!
Leopard Geckos ROCK!!!
Leopard Geckos ROCK!!!
Leopard Geckos ROCK!!! Leopard Geckos ROCK!!!
Leopard Geckos ROCK!!!
Leopard Geckos ROCK!!!
Leopard Geckos ROCK!!!

I've got about 10 books on spiders. All of which have been read 3 times over.

I never said I was an expert.

If it were mine, I'd like everyone's in put on the matter.

Oh and Roxi, my first gecko, died of a spider bite that looked like that bump.
-----
1.1 mali uro's-Ares and Apollo
1.2 saharan uro's-Orion and Iris
1.2 bearded dragon-Hades and Draco
0.2 leo gecko-Kalypso
0.3 tokaye gecko-Sid Vicious
1.0 tarantula-Peter Parker
0.2 dog-cheeka
0.2 zebra finch-beeps
0.2 african gray parrot-keya
1.0 red headed parrot-pancho
0.3 Fish (sorry no names for them)

Lay off man. She was just trying to help, we aught to report your for terroristing people. Sheesh. And I can see how she would have to get a shot from a bite, bearded dragons arn't little and there was probably a risk of disese transmittion if it broke skin. Besides that she didn't say if it was wild or her pet.

No one minded her comment about the spider bite. I would bet on it being something else such as a sist or a tumor, however crickets have been known to bite and cause invections so I'm not going to deny the spider bite theory. Either way we all suggested they take the gecko to a vet even with our theories. They are exactly that *Theories*
-----
~Akira
1.0 African Fat-tailed Gecko
0.0.1 Leopard Gecko (hypo tangrine circle-back?)
0.0.2 Red Ear Slider

Listen up, I have been keeping and breeding reptiles longer than you are alive.... Your web site alone tells everyone how much you still need to learn about this whole thing you are into.... How can you have het for patternless albinos and het for blazing blizards???? Get you genetics straight..... Also how can you specialize in captive bred leos when you have not bred any???? Leopardgeckoman is coming "down" to my level???? Well you can only hope to be at my level one day..... You have many years to go...... You know absolutly nothing and it shows with every post you make Britney.... I notice that you seem to give advice after someone with much more knowledge has given it first.... Whats with that???? Britney, you need to know your place..... You are far from being able to give advice..... You should be taking advice..... Its cool that you are eager but YOU need to chill out..... There was nothing uncalled for in my post..... You can not give an opinion like "it looks like a spider bite" based on a blurry pic...... And if you and Triad realy knew anything about reptiles or spiders, you would know that the majority of species have a very high tolerance to things like spider bites and scorpion stings..... They eat them in the wild..... Duh!!!!!

Triad, I am glad you have three books on spiders but that does not mean anything compared to the many years of hands on experiance me and many others have dealing with them..... You have a better chance of getting sick from a spider bite than a leo does....

If you would open your eyes and read through all the words in the post above, you would see that triad infact said the brown recluse was the second most "poisonest"actually venomous) spider known to man..... I I quoted his words.... Put on a pair of glasses....

>>Triad, I am glad you have three books on spiders but that does not mean anything compared to the many years of hands on experiance me and many others have dealing with them..... You have a better chance of getting sick from a spider bite than a leo does....

Thanks? As a back up I plan on going to vet school also. Since being a cop almost guarantee's being shot at on a daily basis I'm going to get a vet degree in case I'm shot and decide to quit the force. Herp. degree really.

I got a 105 temp when I got bit the 2nd time by a reclous so....I really did get sick from it. If leo's have stronger immune systems then that's cool. I'd like one since its Flu season and spider season (they're all trying to come into the house since it's getting cold out).
-----
1.1 mali uro's-Ares and Apollo
1.2 saharan uro's-Orion and Iris
1.2 bearded dragon-Hades and Draco
0.2 leo gecko-Kalypso
0.3 tokaye gecko-Sid Vicious
1.0 tarantula-Peter Parker
0.2 dog-cheeka
0.2 zebra finch-beeps
0.2 african gray parrot-keya
1.0 red headed parrot-pancho
0.3 Fish (sorry no names for them)

>>Lay off man. She was just trying to help, we aught to report your for terroristing people. Sheesh. And I can see how she would have to get a shot from a bite, bearded dragons arn't little and there was probably a risk of disese transmittion if it broke skin. Besides that she didn't say if it was wild or her pet.
>>
>>No one minded her comment about the spider bite. I would bet on it being something else such as a sist or a tumor, however crickets have been known to bite and cause invections so I'm not going to deny the spider bite theory. Either way we all suggested they take the gecko to a vet even with our theories. They are exactly that *Theories*

Thanks for defending me. And also thanks for getting my gender correct for those of you who think Triad is a man's name (it's unisex).

The bearded is a pet, but I don't know if it is wild caught or not. My brother got it while I was in the hospital about 2 years ago.
-----
1.1 mali uro's-Ares and Apollo
1.2 saharan uro's-Orion and Iris
1.2 bearded dragon-Hades and Draco
0.2 leo gecko-Kalypso
0.3 tokaye gecko-Sid Vicious
1.0 tarantula-Peter Parker
0.2 dog-cheeka
0.2 zebra finch-beeps
0.2 african gray parrot-keya
1.0 red headed parrot-pancho
0.3 Fish (sorry no names for them)

Thanks, Gregg for once again lying. If you haven't noticed I've prepared that site for WHEN I breed Leopard Geckos and I AM in fact, quite knowlegable with them.

Hahaha and don't tell me there's no such thing as "Het" with Patternless Albinos and Blazing Blizzards-- I won't even get into detail about that for the second time with you, so stop telling me how to run my site.

Also, I don't need your BS or anyone else's on here when I try to help someone out. My [bleep]ing friend died today and you've just made me feel so much better!! Thanks again and I'm not posting here anymore. Good luck to anyone else I used to know.
-----
-Britney

Atlantic Reptiles(In the works)

2.4.1 Leopard Geckos: Ron, Raine, Dream, Tango, Go-Go, Johnneh and Salleh.
0.0.1 Bearded Dragon: Lil' Little.

Yeah um, you still cannot have a het for patternless albino or a het for blazing blizard..... Even the "big breeders" will tell you that..... Sit back and learn..... And sorry about your friend.....

One last post here.

Gregg, I do consider myself more then just a half-wit about Leopard Geckos-- Perhaps you'd even like to read my care sheet?

I am sure you have ALOT more hands on experience then I. I have been studying and researching for five years now on Leopard Geckos. Surely, this stands for something? I am consistently reading and finding NEW, up-to-date information. I don't know everything about genetics, but my research confirms everything I've ever posted on here.

I am slowly building up to the point that I will be able to breed geckos. Like I said, all my research and studying will enable me to effectively have "hands on experience". With all due respect, it is your generation that seems to think we younger generation know JACK. I know what I know, and your posts just show your prejudice and narrowmindedness. You seem to think because you're older your word is the almighty. Well, to each his own, but maybe someday.. You will realize that old dogs can learn new tricks from those younger then them.
-----
-Britney

Atlantic Reptiles(In the works)

2.4.1 Leopard Geckos: Ron, Raine, Dream, Tango, Go-Go, Johnneh and Salleh.
0.0.1 Bearded Dragon: Lil' Little.

Reading about keeping any kind of reptile can only get you started. All the real knowledge comes from experience. I've been breeding leopard geckos, and other reptiles for five years, which still isn't much, but I disagree with a lot that I read. Especially on this forum. The ten gallons per leo rule is hooey.
-----
My blood is workin', but my, my heart is...DEAD!

np
-----
chickabowwow

with all due respect Gregg, i have seen your animals, and read your posts and i do not doubt your knowledge for herps, BUT name calling... and thinking you are all high and mighty shows a lack of maturity and respect for others, i have known britney for almost a year now..maybe a little bit more, she has a great knowledge for herps and may other animals, just because she has not bred a gecko yet or the fact that she is 18 does not in any way mean she has very little knowledge of herps, like she said, she has been researching for 5 years, of course that going to mean somthing, she may not be an expert, but neither are you, i have kept herps for over 12 years and there is so much more for me to learn, everyday i learn somthing new, everywhere i look it seems like many adults think that us who are younger knoe completely nothing, if that where true than many of use would not have our leos for such a long period, i know for a fact she has had a few of hers for over a year, and dont use the "thats because they are very hardy" excuse, i've seen neglected leos that come from people that know nothing, if she knew nothing than hers would not be fat and colorful, alert, with bright eyes

Triad was just trying to help, i didnt see him giving advice, i just saw him saying it looked like a spider bite, and it does, although it obviously isnt he was just trying to help, you exploading and start saying none of us know anything about herps is very uncalled for

my advice to you gregg, try helping next time, instead of judging

-----
Breeder of Leopard geckos
Bearded Dragons
And soon Knob tail geckos

Dan Quinn
______________
www.geocities.com/tokaydude/Enter.html?1096182519939

Quote me where I call anyone here a name..... You cant because I never did..... Actually someone started with me in this post..... They actually said thing that were uncalled for and I just fired back...... And where does it sound like I am all high and mighty??? Did I state anything that was untrue???? As far as Britney goes, she was dead wrong for stepping in and saying what she said.... I do not care if she read books on reptiles for 5 years..... That is only a quarter the time I had actual hands on experiance with reptiles and 7 years short of the time I have been keeping and breeding venomous snakes..... So, do want to know if I think I am ahead of people that have been keeping reptiles for a few years????? Yes I do..... Can a person that has read alot of books on reptiles in a 5 year span teach me anything???? I doubt it..... Am I better than anyone because of it???? Ofcorse not..... But I can tell you that there is a ton of false info going around on this site stated mostly by the inexperianced people and this is why the bigger names in the hobby do not come here as often..... It is alot of info just blurted out without any type of backing..... I have read a few of your post and would not consider you to be one of the offenders... You have got to see where I am coming from with this...... C'mon, how can you seriously take a breeder seriously if they say they will be selling het for patternless albinos and het for blazing blizzard???? I even pointed it out to Britney and she tried to say she knew more about genetics and even tried to give me a lesson on it.....LOL..... See what I am saying here????

i see where you are coming from, and i do agree, false info has been going around like a plague here.

but i dont thinbk blowing up in someones face for saying it looked like a spider bite was necessary, if he had said somthing like "its fine, it will go away in time, no vet needed" then i could see why you would get mad, i get frusterated when people say their tangerine leo with 3 specks of orange on its tail is a carrot tail, so i see where you're coming from

i can see why it pisses you off, because its happening so much, if you see someone give bad advice, counter it by stating your experience, and give them good advice instead of turning into the hulk, people would take you alot more seriously and they'll listen.
-----
Breeder of Leopard geckos
Bearded Dragons
And soon Knob tail geckos

Dan Quinn
______________
www.geocities.com/tokaydude/Enter.html?1096182519939

I would love for you to quote exactally what i was "terroristing" him about. And another, THIS HAS TO BE MENTION!!! This bad information is getting worse by the months, someone just a week ago was talking about a gecko regurgiatating and something else, which wasnt even close to the same thing, yet he seemed to say it was and that just caused more problems. Im not saying im the person with all the knowledge on this site, but if i know the correct answer from expierence, i share it, unlike some other people you say things that arent true that you heard from someone else. One of these days someone will get mixed up from other posts, because they have no expierence with it what-so-ever and they will say what they thought they heard and give some kind of wrong info. the best example for this would be calcium sand, i doubt anyone will get this mixed up, but its easy to pick apart. They say calcium sand is good, all the big-time breeders left this place because of everyone being immature and not giving right info, the kid puts the calcium sand in the tank and the leo soon dies. Then what???
-----
Leopard Geckos ROCK!!!
Leopard Geckos ROCK!!!
Leopard Geckos ROCK!!!
Leopard Geckos ROCK!!! Leopard Geckos ROCK!!!
Leopard Geckos ROCK!!!
Leopard Geckos ROCK!!!
Leopard Geckos ROCK!!!

One: the Brown recluse is second only to the Black Widow in the US alone. It is NOT the second most venemous spider but the results of its bites sure look like it sometimes due to major Necrosis. I've been bitten by a brown recluse and its not pleasant.. I have a permanent scar and a permanent sensitivity to all other spider venoms now. I spent 6 months being sick off and on from that bite.
2: A daddy long legs has a hard time puncturing its prey with fangs that can't even scratch human skin..It'd have a hard time puncturing a leo's skin especially in that area...

3: That lump is NOT a spider bite... It could be a variety of things but not a spider bite and a vet trip is recommended for certain. I had a female that had a lump beneath her jaw...took her into the vets it turned out just to be a sort of fatty deposit in an odd place but still it was good to have it checked. Unfortunately I lost her 6 months after that to egg binding... not much that could be done... I elected to have her euthanized rather than spend $400 on surgery and her still not pull through since she was so weak... Its always good to have a vet check out anything unusual...
-----
Lucien

1.1 Columbian Redtail Boa (BCI)(Sutekh and Isis)
3.5.3 Leopard geckos (2.0 Blizzards (Caine and Goliath), 0.1 Tangerine Albino (Tequila Sunrise ...Tiki for short), 1.0 Rainwater Albino (Mycah), 0.4 Poss. Het. Albino (Annika, Lace, Rain and Aris) and 2.1 dbl. het blizzard x tang albino (Malice, Malfeas, and Mystic))
0.1 Savannah Monitor (Kiros)
13 rats
2 Dogs (Loki and Storm)
3 cats (Ashe, Sahara and Hercules)
6 Fish (4 Red Danios, 1 Cardinal Fish, and 1 Tiger Barb)
8 Ramshorn snails
"And a Partridge in a Pear Tree!"

But I am going to say it anyway. Just A little back ground first so you know where I am coming from. I'll start by letting you know that as a newcomer to Leos, I come to these boards frequently looking for advice and OPINIONS. Both are welcome and I consider it my job to then sort out the facts that apply to my situation. I have come to a point where I am purchasing new Leos. (Now watch your toes). In looking for a seller I look for someone who is helpful, knowledgeable, and CURTIOUS. I have seen several individuals here correct mis-information. Thats great, that is awesome, that is to be expected. Here is the diffence. How did your correction leave the person feeling? You can teach and coach newbies without being insulting and degrading. I personally would never buy a single animal or item from a person that was mean, hateful, and degrading of others. It would not matter to me if you had the best Leos on the market. I would not feel comfortable asking for advice, and would fear being degraded for not being the "expert" you may claim to be. There is no way I would purchase anything from you. There are two of you on this thread that responded in a manner that guarantees I will never visit your web sites or buy your animals. I think you can figure out for yourselves who you are. And I am pretty sure you won't really care, But I doubt I am the only one that feels this way.
-----
Cheryl

People are trying to diagnose the little guy's situation by only looking at it from the outside. I would put my money on betting that the inside of his mouth looks A LOT worse than the outside, so there's no way to identify the problem without being able to open his mouth and look inside.
-----
chickabowwow

Unless you know how to get your leo to open his mouth, you should have your vet do it to avoid injury.
-----
chickabowwow