Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Just wanted to clarify that in the snake world, there are exceptions to the rule.

Normally, everyone is correct.. if you produce an albino snake and cross it with a regular or normal phase, 100% will be het for albino... or if you breed albino to albino you'll get 100% albino.. but this is not always the case...

Take albino boas for example... if your cross an "original" strain albino boa with a "sharp" strain albino boa.. you don't get the desired albino offspring.. why this is I don't know, I'm not a genetics doctor.. but I do know that is correct.

So therefore, if you had one "original" strain and one "sharp" strain albino boa, and did not know this.. and you kept trying to produce albinos and you couldn't... that might be a clue as to what is going on in the dragon world. Who knows just a thought.

Maybe that's the problem with the "leucistic" dragons out there. Leucistic was a poor choice in terms to describe this phase as everyone has pointed out.. but regardless, maybe that's part of the reason why people breeding "leucistics" are not getting the desired effect...

either way, it's a real shame everyone that invested this money into leucistics under the assumption they'd be producing leucistics right away... hopefully it will all be figured out soon, but it's a shame people have been sold a phase that is not truly understood yet for that kinda money. hopefully we can figure this out soon because it is truly a beautiful dragon when it is correct.

brandon
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Dragons by Nature

Melanin isn't produced by just one gene, it's a group of genes that work like a factory. A defect in any one of these genes will cause some sort of amelanism. But when you cross animals with two different broken genes, the offspring each get one working copy and they turn out normal.
I wonder if leucism, being so much rarer, is caused by a defect in just one gene (or fewer genes) but that's just a wild guess. But I am pretty sure that leucism is a defect at the very beginning of the pigment factory, blocking production of both melanin and xanthin/erythrin. This is why leucy animals are so blinding white and have no pattern at all. To me an animal isn't leucisitc unless it's as snow white as a leucy Texas ratsnake. On the other side of the spectrum, defects near the end of the factory cause things like T albinism and hypomelanism, which replaces black with various shades of light brown. That doesn't have anything to do with beardies, and I'm currently rambling. Bye!

When I think of the Leucistic phase, i too think exactly of the Texas Rat snake.. I had a beautiful pair of these awhile back.. completely white with black eyes.. beautiful snake...

When i first heard of the leucistic dragon, I was like sweet! can't wait to get one.. then I saw the dragon and i was like uhhhh lol.. that's not leucistic...

Regardless, thanks for the info.. you may be right.. my theory is it's just a freak of nature that has happened here or there for whatever reason and it's not a dominant phase yet... so when it's produced you really don't know what's gonna happen..

I hope this phase not to turn out to be like a Snow dragon that can be white, yellow, gray, or a combo of the two.. when I think snow.. i think white with pattern and black eyes.. but again I have a strong background in snakes so i'm biased lol.

I'm rambling now too... thanks again for the input.

brandon
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Dragons by Nature

Take albino boas for example... if your cross an "original" strain albino boa with a "sharp" strain albino boa.. you don't get the desired albino offspring.. why this is I don't know, I'm not a genetics doctor.. but I do know that is correct.

Because they are two different pairs of recessive genes, just like Rainwater, Tremper & Bell albino strains in leopard geckos.

However, I find it VERY unlikely that two or more "leucistic" (or whatever happens to be the actual correct term for what we're seeing) recessive pairs have arisen in such a short span of time.

And still, even if they are two different pairs of genes that give similar homozygous appearances, if you breed them together and 100% of the babies look normalm they will all be double hets (if they are truly recessive pairs). If they are bred to siblings (which is happening whether you are for or against inbreeding), simple laws of probability say that you are going to end up with at least one homozygous offspring. With a single female potentially producing up to & over 100 eggs in a season, as one person pointed out, you've more chance of winning the lottery than NOT getting a single homozygous offspring from two het or double het parents.
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Axe
The Reptile Rooms