Reptile & Amphibian Forums

okay alot of the habbitats i have seen for bearded dragons are not aquariums...is there a reason for this? i am thinking of buying a 75 gallon tank for my dragon, but most of the ones i have seen on websites are not glass on all sides but only on the front...is there a reason for this? just wondering bc i want to get the right cage for my pet thanks

There are several reasons why I personally do not like aquariums for housing reptiles, but these are my opinions/preferences. . .based on 20 years experience.

1. Size-Except for the very largest aquariums, it is hard to obtain aquariums of suitable size to provide a good quality of life for most reptiles.

2. Cost-The aquariums that are indeed large enough are often very expensive.

3. Weight-Did you ever help move a 200 gallon aquarium?

(following are why I really dislike aquariums)

4. Access-I absoluetly hate cages accessed from the top. The top is where lights, heaters go, not access. Top access limits severly the ability to stack cages, and limits the height you can position the cage. It is such a pain to have to clean the bottom of a cage going in from the top. Plus, to get in you either have to remove the screen top and lights or make the screen hinged, in which case you might still have to move lights. Access, access, access!

5. Ventilation- Tanks are in no way conducive to proper ventilation. I like to specifically tailor the ventilation to the particular habitat I am aiming for. 5 sides of solid glass severly limit my options. It is also terribly inefficient energy wise-you have a spot light on the top warming a certain "spot" on the ground, then heat rises and is lost/wasted, not leading to much ambient air warmth, at least INSIDE the cage. I like my ventilation to be mainly near the bottom of the cage leading to very nice convection.

6. Dirty glass sucks!

7. It is more difficult to attach things (ledges, branches) to the sides.

8. Security-It is much harder to have an escape-proof cage with aquariums, not to mention being able to lock it to keep unwanted humans out.

9. Access
10. Access

Aquariums are for fish, turtles and amphibians, not reptiles.

Hope this helps,
Paul

okay thanks for that info, here is what i am thinking now..

the demensions for the tank i was going to get 48Lx18wx21t is very close to what the person im buying my dragon from recomends...

its much cheaper than the home you can buy from them (about 160$)

but im worried its going to affect my dragons health...

yeah top access sucks,

ventilation, didnt think of that so thanks makes sense when you think about it...

anyone else have opinions on this?

I have had a Uro in a 40 gallon breeder tank for the last number of years and recently built him a new cage with front access. If for no other reason than the front access I would recommend spending the extra money if you can. I do not believe that the glass tank negatively impacted my Uros quality of life, but it did mine! lol

The prior comments regarding efficiency, and dirty glass are difinitely true. Even the "pet safe" glass and aquarium cleaner smells, and is a pain in the butt, and you really don't want to use normal glass cleaner on them at all.

If I had realized sooner how much I would enjoy the difference between front and top access, I would have made the switch sooner. I do believe the Uro is happier because I can be more creative with his hides, keep is cage much cleaner, and it is a lot easier to "play" with him while he is still in his cage where it is warm.

With all of that said, I dont know that you would necessarily be doing your Beardie a disservice with the tank, but if you have other options I would definitely consider them.

One last thought, I think you said the tank was 18inches wide, I was under the impression that beardies can get quite long, is that wide enough for a permanent, long term enclosure? I have never had beardies so I am not sure, just something to double check on.

I hope that was a little useful, even if quite long.

Elizabeth

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1.0 Mali Uro Archimedes
0.0.1 Egyptian Uro Zuberi Mosca Khu (Mosca)
0.0 Fish
0.1 Sulcata Minnie
1.1 Iguanas Flik and Loki
0.1 Newfoundland Jasmine
0.1 Feline Winter
Indiana & Wisconsin

umm at fireandicedragons.com (where i am going to get my dragon) they recomend a 48x24x24...so there is a 6 inch difference...hmm lol, i thought it was 20 inches wide till you made me look , well no matter what my dragon will only need a 20 gallon long aquarium to start, so i could just save up the extra and get something that i know will work right and seems (from the responses i am getting) to be the best for me too thanks guys

My fiance's dragon is very large and the interior dimensions of his cage are 48"x18.5". I would have made it bigger but I used leftover birch plywood from another project and did not have a choice.

He does not seem cramped in there at all.
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Current snakes:

1.1 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Silver/Yellow)

3.4 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Green)

2.1 Gonyosoma janseni - (Black)

wow...your setup is beautiful. Did you get a set of plans to build it by or is it your own design?
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0.3.0 Dogs - Delaney, Darcie, Mali
2.1.0 Cats - Dante, Diesel, Dixie
2.0.0 Cockatiels - Toast, Waffles
1.0.0 Canary - Stewie 10/30/04 R.I.P, we'll miss you little man
2.0.0 White's Treefrogs - Splish, Splash
0.1.2 Leopard Geckos - Phoebe, Celena, Isadora
2.0.1 Crested Geckos - Stubbie, Lou, Oz
1.0.0 Chinchilla - Poncho
3.0.0 Guinea Pigs - Rodney, Reese, Ray
1.0.0 Hamster - Harvey
Not to mention the plethera of fish (African Cichlids, Community, Marine, Multiple Bettas)

I did not have plans persay but the forum, and Chris in particular, were invaluable resources. It is based off of a cage Chris built. I kept redrawing the design until it seemed right, and then Chris helped me come up with the measurements. Had everything cut for me, then put it together. I am glad you like it though.

I keep meaning to clean up the drawings I did and make them available... just too much to do!
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1.0 Mali Uro Archimedes
0.0.1 Egyptian Uro Zuberi Mosca Khu (Mosca)
0.0 Fish
0.1 Sulcata Minnie
1.1 Iguanas Flik and Loki
0.1 Newfoundland Jasmine
0.1 Feline Winter
Indiana & Wisconsin

My biggest gripe with aquaria is the access issues. There are some ways around it, but it's never ideal, IMO.

Regarding health, ventilation, and temperature gradiant issues, it might be helpful to specifically look at the species you are planning on housing in this aquarium - a bearded dragon.

My only concern is access and how it specifically effects sanitation issues. With a basic, one-piece lid and lights/heating elements on top it will be hard to do quick cleans. For example, if you're on your way out the door in the AM and you notice your dragon has deficated in its water bowl. With having to move lights, etc. aside will you actually take the time to change the water or will you save it until you get back from work?

Beardeds are messy animals. Who knows what the long term effects of postponing water changes are?

Regarding ventilation and heating efficiency I don't believe these are big issues with dragons. Dragons like very signficiant temperature gradiants and these are usually easier to achieve with well ventilated cages. With a more efficient cage the cooler end of the cage will naturally stay warmer, assuming the same hot spot is achieved at the warm end.

And with the hot basking temperatures necessary for dragons you'll create a significant convection current anyways. I believe there was a German paper showing that a vertical temperature gradiant was sufficent for removing heavy gasses in reptile terraria up to 75 cm in height - about 30". Yours is well under 30".

Still, a small amount of ventilation near the bottom of a cage is better. Just the gap in a sliding door can be enough. But if this aquarium is a good deal you might as well use it, especially if it will serve another purpose in the future. Keep in mind, though, that it may already have leaks. If not, after housing a dragon for a period of time it may develop leaks. These can be very difficult to repair. So if any future use includes water, don't put a dragon in it.

If you're thinking of this tank as a long term solution for your dragon then I would encourage you to consider building a basic cage.

If you do use it for the dragon, at a minimum I'd suggest a two-piece lid. One side can hold all the lights/heating elements, the other can be over the side with the water bowl and feeding area. That way there is a panel that can be removed for feeding, cleaning and water changes. For more thorough cleaning the other panel can be slid to the opposite end or removed.

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Current snakes:

1.1 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Silver/Yellow)

3.4 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Green)

2.1 Gonyosoma janseni - (Black)

wow good reply thanks for all the help and a two piece lid is defianatly the way i will go, and actually i might just save up the money and get the more expensive one bc the 20 gallon long i got will be ok for a while, and saving up 300$ isnt that much...umm i do have a quesiton though, im going to use the repti-sand as my first substrate in the 20 gallon long tank, should the food and water be on the hot side or the cooler side or does it matter? i assume it can be on the colder side since what you said before...thanks for all your help though

>>and saving up 300$ isnt that much...

Are you going to pay $300 for a bearded dragon cage? In that case I'd say your crazy For $300 you could get a heck of a nice front opening cage.

>>im going to use the repti-sand as my first substrate in the 20 gallon long tank, should the food and water be on the hot side or the cooler side or does it matter?

Definately keep the water on the cooler side. Food probably does not matter.

I'd ask about the ReptiSand on the Bearded Dragon Forum. I believe there are some over there who do not like it.
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Current snakes:

1.1 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Silver/Yellow)

3.4 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Green)

2.1 Gonyosoma janseni - (Black)

the 300 is a 48x24x24 cage with sliding front doors, melamine sides with vents, a uvb bulb, a uvb fixture, and a heat lamp. so idk is that not worth it? that is the set up they use at www.fireandicedragons.com where i am buying my beardy...so i figured it was a good thing...oh and that is where i got the repti-sand idea bc they said that is what they use untill the move the beardies over to the larger cage so i assume it will be ok since that is what the baby is used to...

>>the 300 is a 48x24x24 cage with sliding front doors, melamine sides with vents, a uvb bulb, a uvb fixture, and a heat lamp. so idk is that not worth it?

I thought you meant $300 for a nicer aquarium, not a reptile cage.

If you have no interest in building that cage might be a good option, especially since it comes with lights and fixtures.
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Current snakes:

1.1 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Silver/Yellow)

3.4 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Green)

2.1 Gonyosoma janseni - (Black)

with all this talk about ventalation i was thinking.... would a small fan , like a computer fan, be feasable? would it push too much heat out? maybe it would push out too much humidity in humid enclosures? just an idea.

Fans are a good idea in high humidity cages, especially those with standing water and a lot of surface area for mold, algae, etc. to grow. They are very popular in many parts of Europe.

Probably overkill for a desert vivaria, however.
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Current snakes:

1.1 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Silver/Yellow)

3.4 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Green)

2.1 Gonyosoma janseni - (Black)