Reptile & Amphibian Forums

There is nothing worse than a post providing a discription but with no pictures, but here it goes. I live in Boerne Texas (Central Texas), and was crusing the rural roads in our subdivision, Sat night (temps mid 70s).

I passed what I believed was a DOR Western Diamondback, turned around and found it to be a approx. 2.5 foot, thick bodied, female Western Hog. This individual was gorgeous, high contrasting pattern, orange and black belly. I truly wish she was found alive, would have greatly complimented my Hog collection. Question, the terrain was limestone outcrops, no sand, juniper/oaks, hilly grassland.....has any else ever found Western Hognose snakes in the Central Texas Hill Country area?

I have found lots of Easterns in that area, but never a Western. That's a great find! It looks like it could be a county record as well. Did you keep the specimen?

Here's a typical eastern from just north of you in Gillespie County. They are actually quite common up there in similar habitat to that you see around Boerne (although the soil is deeper and sandier).

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Chris Harrison

Ken,

Long time no see. I agree totally with Chris' post: I've seen lots of Easterns from areas near there but never a Western from anywhere east of Val Verde county on the Plateau. Your description of the belly coloration certainly sounds like a Western, though, and I too hope you kept the specimen. Although there is at least one fossil Western from your area, I am aware of no recent records.

Tom Lott

Tom, I still don't understand the relevance of fossil records in regard to nasicus. I have put in many hours of research (from soil charts to voucher specimens) in my quest to find a nasicus on the periphery (and have noticed a few fossil records). To me, the mention of "fossil" brings to mind something that was alive far before we made an impact on the habitat. In my mind, the mention of "fossil" has nothing to do with any current, dynamic event, but then again, a "fossil" is simply a preserved skeleton (if it was found, then it was certainly viewable from the time it was conceived, until the time it was found).
Shane

Shane,

The fossils (vertebrae) in question (I don't have the reference at hand) were from caves on the Plateau and of late Pleistocene to Recent age, similar to those obtained from woodrat middens throughout the Southwest. Their significance lies in the fact that it establishes their presence before the advent of modern man with his penchant for overgrazing and habitat alteration.

The evidence indicates that about two-hundred years ago most of the Edwards Plateau was grassland and had its fair share of grassland species which are now much reduced or absent (e.g., Lampropeltis calligaster, L. getula, Coluber constrictor, Arizona elegans, etc., as well as H. nasicus). Much of the former grassland has been replaced by juniper and various thorny shrubs, most likely shortly following the introduction of livestock in that area.

Tom Lott

Thanks for the info, Tom. I didn't know that the plateau was recently a grassland, but someone once told me that the barren flats on 118 prior to the river were once lush grassland.
My tactic up here (southern OK) is to find the least grazed areas in their "historic?" range. I have read and heard that nasicus can also do quite well in some agricultural areas (in corn up here, and around McCook in your neck of the woods) I keep hoping I'll find one on the periphery....maybe next year.
Shane

Hi Tom, nice to know you are still out there. Bairds Rat snake and there specific eastern range extension is still of interest. A month or so ago, I caught a Texas Rat in the same area as the Hognose snake mentioned (Boerne Texas) …..the individual caught was a pure Texas Rat.

On the topic of the Western Hog, I went back to the site of the DOR to look at the specimen again, and as I suspected, a scavenger took it. Difficult to definitively state a range extension without a picture and/or preserved specimen. Will try to capture a specimen in early spring by searching what I believe is desirable habitat (grassy, sand-loam flood plains in the area), but that is not where this individual Hog was found.

Thanks everyone to responding and it is interesting to note that the Eastern and the Western my co-habitat in similar environments that IMO are not desirable for either sub-species.

Thanks Again, Ken

Ken,

Glad you're still around also. Looks like you've got another interesting herpetological problem in your area!

Tom Lott

Although I haven't found any westerns in the Hill COuntry, I've found some Mexican hogs in the same spots as molossus, subocs, lepidus, and other rocky montane type snakes. Congrats on the find though!

Erik,

How's NM treating you? My computer was down for a while and I no longer have your E-mail address. I didn't get to SE NM this summer, only made one early trip to the Silver City area, where it was so dry I didn't see anything of interest.

Tom Lott

How have you been? I have a couple new e-mail addresses anyway, so here is the one I mainly use: nmherper(at)hotmail.com

I'll be in that area this weekend, but I might not get to do any herping. Just a family visit trip. If I do get to herp anywhere, it'll be Houston. I['ll be sure to let you know how that goes.

Anyway, keep in touch especially if you plan on coming out this way. I found some cool stuff this year here in New Mexico.
My Online Page (herp trips, lifelist, photography, etc)

I found a juvenile eastern hognose near Fischer, Texas (northeast side of Canyon Lake) in the same type of terrain. Surprised me, as well...