Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I was wondering if anyone knows where I could find this? Home Depot and Lowe's only carry 1/4 and 3/4" apperance grade plywood. And wouldn't pine be a bad choice, considering that pine shavings aren't good for a substrate...so why would you want to build the whole cage out of it (i figure..)

I've called around to local lumber yards, but they only carry pressure treated lumber.

Any ideas i'd appreciate it.
-Chris
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-Chris

The reason mainstream thought is thought of as a stream is because it's so shallow. -George Carlin

A fool doesn't learn. A smart man learns from his mistakes. A wise man learns from the mistakes of others. Which one are you?

My Website
Rat/Corn snake care sheet I wrote

Current snakes:
0.1 Licorice Stick Black Rat (Lola)
1.0 Black Rat (Frankie)
1.1 Texas Bairds (Jose and Rosa)
0.1 Blue Beauty (Brunhilde)

I'm guessing that you mean plywood to make furniture from.
I can find 1/2 at my lumberyards here.( CT )
But with the difference in price between 3/4, and 1/2 being so scant. Unless you are trying to lighten up the cage, you may as well buy the 3/4. I think the last time I checked, the difference in proce was around $5.
And nearly all contruction lumber is pine.You seal the cage when contruction is done,you cant seal pine shavings.
After that you get into hardwoods...very pricey.

yeah, i'm looking at doing oak vaneer plywood. i'm really doing it for the weight factor more than anything...

Also, how many coats of a spar varnish should I coat the inside of the tank with? Or would a shellac be a better choice, being a fully natural organic compound?
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-Chris

The reason mainstream thought is thought of as a stream is because it's so shallow. -George Carlin

A fool doesn't learn. A smart man learns from his mistakes. A wise man learns from the mistakes of others. Which one are you?

My Website
Rat/Corn snake care sheet I wrote

Current snakes:
0.1 Licorice Stick Black Rat (Lola)
1.0 Black Rat (Frankie)
1.1 Texas Bairds (Jose and Rosa)
0.1 Blue Beauty (Brunhilde)

>>yeah, i'm looking at doing oak vaneer plywood. i'm really doing it for the weight factor more than anything...

Hi Toon,

What sized cage or cages are you planning to build? What species are you building the cage(s) for? I may have some other suggestions for saving weight depending on the size of the cages and how many your are building.

>>Also, how many coats of a spar varnish should I coat the inside of the tank with? Or would a shellac be a better choice, being a fully natural organic compound?

Spar urethane requires a tremendous amount of patience to allow each coat to dry. You'll likely be smelling fumes for weeks down in humid Florida. But it does offer a nice degree of protection for the cost.

I'm not sure about shellac.

I'll go more into sealers once I hear more about your cage design.
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Current snakes:

1.1 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Silver/Yellow)

3.4 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Green)

2.1 Gonyosoma janseni - (Black)

I just did a quick search on shellac and it sounds like it won't stand up very well to disinfectants commonly used in snake cages. But it was a quick search and you may have other information.
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Current snakes:

1.1 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Silver/Yellow)

3.4 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Green)

2.1 Gonyosoma janseni - (Black)

well i'm going to build two sets of cages. the overall length will be (around) 4 feet, overall height (around) 4 feet. I say around because you lose the amount due to the saw, so its pretty much four but not exactly. I'll have a divider in the middle and a 2-3" toe beam on the bottom so roughly each cage will be just under 2 feet high, and 2 feet deep.

In one of these i'm going to put my black rat snakes. In the other, the top one i'm going to fuly line inside with FRP because im planning on putting a Chondro in there, and with all the misting water i need something non porus, that holds heat well. So I figure an FRP lined wood cage will be just about the best thing. The bottom one i'll place my blue beauty, until I need a bigger cage for her...then i'll either put one of my texas bairdis there or get yet another snake

I'm planning on using a 1/4" finish grade back. My big dilema is do I need a 3/4" middle shelf, mainly for preventing heat coming up from the bottom cage?

The rest of the cages will get an epoxy glaze coat floor and I was just planning on doing about 4-5 coats of an outdoor polyurethane on the rest of the walls and ceiling.

I'm planning on using a 1/4" sliding doors. I'm going to take a router and cut some grooves, make them just over 1/4" apart from each other, and i'll glue a small piece of glass onto the back one, so when they meet there will be a solid wall there.

This actually poses another question, I know you reccomend glass over acrylic, but doesnt the glass have a sharp edge? I don't want this to be a danger to either the snakes or myself.

For heating I was planning on building a little inset into the cage like Captain Hook2 did. I also can't decide between covering the hole with 1/4" wire mesh or 1/8" lexan. I know that it can hurt my snakes if they rub their noses along the mesh and I dont want that, but will they really want to rub it up against a light bulb?

Thanks,
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-Chris

The reason mainstream thought is thought of as a stream is because it's so shallow. -George Carlin

A fool doesn't learn. A smart man learns from his mistakes. A wise man learns from the mistakes of others. Which one are you?

My Website
Rat/Corn snake care sheet I wrote

Current snakes:
0.1 Licorice Stick Black Rat (Lola)
1.0 Black Rat (Frankie)
1.1 Texas Bairds (Jose and Rosa)
0.1 Blue Beauty (Brunhilde)

>>well i'm going to build two sets of cages. the overall length will be (around) 4 feet, overall height (around) 4 feet. I say around because you lose the amount due to the saw, so its pretty much four but not exactly. I'll have a divider in the middle and a 2-3" toe beam on the bottom so roughly each cage will be just under 2 feet high, and 2 feet deep.

So you are building two, double stacks? In other words, two units, each 4'x2'x4' and each consisting of two 4'x2'x2' cages?

In that case, I'd recommend 3/4" plywood for the sides and shelves. The back can be thin. I'd consider 1/8" rather than 1/4".

It sounds like a nice design and I'm sure your snakes will appreciate it.

To save even more weight basically cut two large rectangles out of what will be the floor of each level. The cover those holes with FRP or expanded PVC. This will also make adding supplemental heat easier.

>>I'm planning on using a 1/4" finish grade back. My big dilema is do I need a 3/4" middle shelf, mainly for preventing heat coming up from the bottom cage?

Like I said, I'd recommend 3/4" for this project anyways. With the light back and the floor cutouts I believe you can keep the weight reasonable.

>>The rest of the cages will get an epoxy glaze coat floor and I was just planning on doing about 4-5 coats of an outdoor polyurethane on the rest of the walls and ceiling.

I believe you should use plastic or FRP for the floors. Again, when it's over the cutout it will save weight and it will be very durable. Then you can use something less durable on the walls and ceiling.

>>I'm planning on using a 1/4" sliding doors. I'm going to take a router and cut some grooves, make them just over 1/4" apart from each other, and i'll glue a small piece of glass onto the back one, so when they meet there will be a solid wall there.

I'm not sure if I follow that design but I'll trust you have a good idea. But I don't recommend routing glass grooves into oak plywood. It might work okay if you use a real oak face frame.

>>This actually poses another question, I know you reccomend glass over acrylic, but doesnt the glass have a sharp edge? I don't want this to be a danger to either the snakes or myself.

You'll have the glass edges polished so no worries about that. Glass is the better choice here on all levels except for weight, IMO.

>>For heating I was planning on building a little inset into the cage like Captain Hook2 did. I also can't decide between covering the hole with 1/4" wire mesh or 1/8" lexan.

Don't cover the hole with lexan, especially if you're using CHE's or halogen heat lamps in that inset. Nose rubbing can be a problem but I believe screen will be fine for such a small area.
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Current snakes:

1.1 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Silver/Yellow)

3.4 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Green)

2.1 Gonyosoma janseni - (Black)

>>So you are building two, double stacks? In other words, two units, each 4'x2'x4' and each consisting of two 4'x2'x2' cages?

Yes

>>To save even more weight basically cut two large rectangles out of what will be the floor of each level. The cover those holes with FRP or expanded PVC. This will also make adding supplemental heat easier.

Could I also maybe take some whitewood, say 2"x2" or maybe a 1"x4" and create a frame around the outside and seal the FRP to that? (I can't find expanded PVC in any local hardware store.) Would I seal a bead of the FRP to the bottom as well as the top or put a sheet of 1/8" wood to the top, or how would that work? Or just leave it as is and consider since i'm not looking up dont worry about the looks?

>>Don't cover the hole with lexan, especially if you're using CHE's or halogen heat lamps in that inset. Nose rubbing can be a problem but I believe screen will be fine for such a small area.

I'm planning on using blacklight bulbs. They're considerably cheap (i got some from walmart during the halloween time...i bought like 20 or so for a buck a piece. I put 'em up to a spectrometer and they produce the exact same wavelengths as a "reptile" bulb.)

My grandfather, who basically has done any kind of wood crafting you can imagine...he built his house, made all the cabinents, welded the door handles, etc... is going to help me undertake this project, so just because he does have so much experience we were thinking of using 1/2" - it seems usually the problem with 1/2" is the fact that people can't hit the center straight when you scew in from the side. I don't want it to bow in the center, however...so would 3/4" really be a better choice for that as well? I saw at home depot we carry some rainforest type finished wood, 3/4", for $28.99 or so a sheet. If I do end up with 3/4, as long as thats safe for my snakes, thats probably what i'll use.

Thanks for the help!
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-Chris

The reason mainstream thought is thought of as a stream is because it's so shallow. -George Carlin

A fool doesn't learn. A smart man learns from his mistakes. A wise man learns from the mistakes of others. Which one are you?

My Website
Rat/Corn snake care sheet I wrote

Current snakes:
0.1 Licorice Stick Black Rat (Lola)
1.0 Black Rat (Frankie)
1.1 Texas Bairds (Jose and Rosa)
0.1 Blue Beauty (Brunhilde)

>>Could I also maybe take some whitewood, say 2"x2" or maybe a 1"x4" and create a frame around the outside and seal the FRP to that?

You could, but plywood with it's alternating grain will add more of a structural element to the cage.

At the very least make the very bottom of the cage and the very top out of plywood shelves. Cut holes out of the bottom one, obviously leave the top on solid.

The middle shelf could be made out of a frame no problem, especially with your grandfather helping.

>>I can't find expanded PVC in any local hardware store.)

Call plastic distributors and ask. If there are none within driving distance then call sign shops and ask for Sintra (the most commen brand of expanded PVC). With large cutouts in the floor you should use 1/4" expanded PVC. FRP is also a good choice, just a bit more difficult to work with. PVC will conduct heat better if you ever added UTH's.

>>Would I seal a bead of the FRP to the bottom as well as the top or put a sheet of 1/8" wood to the top, or how would that work? Or just leave it as is and consider since i'm not looking up dont worry about the looks?

I would probably just leave it open. If you ended up using an UTH for some supplemental heat you may end up covering it for peace of mind. The snakes you keep will climb up there.

>>I'm planning on using blacklight bulbs. They're considerably cheap (i got some from walmart during the halloween time...i bought like 20 or so for a buck a piece. I put 'em up to a spectrometer and they produce the exact same wavelengths as a "reptile" bulb.)

I still think screen is better. Lexan does have a melting point, after all. A couple of summers ago I hung a 25 watt red bulb in my snake room to provide a small degree of visible light. I moved it out of my way one day and set it next to a plastic box. It melted through the box in very little time. Pretty dumb of me. Regardless, Lexan will have a higher melting point but I still don't believe it's a good idea. Also, lexan is pretty good at reflecting radiant heat so you'll be reducing efficiency.

>>My grandfather, who basically has done any kind of wood crafting you can imagine...he built his house, made all the cabinents, welded the door handles, etc... is going to help me undertake this project, so just because he does have so much experience we were thinking of using 1/2" - it seems usually the problem with 1/2" is the fact that people can't hit the center straight when you scew in from the side. I don't want it to bow in the center, however...so would 3/4" really be a better choice for that as well?

Chris, in a perfect world I'd use 3/4" ply for the horizontal pieces, possible have the center horizontal piece made from a frame. The sides would be 1/2", the back 1/8".

In fact that might save you the most money. You'll need two 4'x4' back panels so that's one sheet of 1/8".

If you go with a center frame instead of plywood that means you'll need four 2'x4' plywood pieces for the horizontals. That's another full sheet of 3/4".

You'll also need four side panels so that's another full sheet. I'd use 1/2" for that if I could find it.

In fact that might be a good reason to go with a frame for your center horizontal piece. It will save you from having to buy a half sheet of 3/4" or having a 4'x4' scrap piece laying around.
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Current snakes:

1.1 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Silver/Yellow)

3.4 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Green)

2.1 Gonyosoma janseni - (Black)

Ok...I give up.
What is "whitewood"?