Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I just got a pair of them at a reptile show today, and I'd like to compare setup ideas.

Thanks!

if you can post some pics, that would be cool !

I would love to see them!
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Eve / PHEve

They look a bit "deflated". The male was giving it a really good go at chasing crickets when I put them in their new terrarium. I have to go out and buy a 100W bulb so they will be warm enough. I heard they have to be kept very warm to make it. They certainly are beautiful animals. I have previously kept greater earless lizards, which are quite similar but a bit smaller.

Yes, they are opportunistic and will eat smaller lizards, they need lost of room. A 40 gallon cage for one or two lizards should work. If your rich might go with a 55 gallon if you have two. They like it hot and are out even in the hottest part of the day in the Desert, they love to use small low bushes as a way of getting out of the sun, I have seen them sitting in bushes like a sentry post. They are usually are found in small loose nit groups in the wild. Good substrate would be home depot play sand as they love to burry themselves, if you get the right temps they should do well. Be careful because a hot Zebra-tail can go ballistic with speed and they will jump, so be careful or you could lose em real quick. They have a lot of crazy antics and there underside is very bueatiful. I have never fed any of mine veggies, but supposedly they do eat some vegetable material as well. I see them offed from time to time, there's a guy in Arizona that sells them. Anyway it would probably be a fun lizard to have, but remeber this lizard will go down hill without proper temps, if you get an adult and it really has a nice fat body you might let it slow down and hibernate, just check him once a month or so, but otherwise I would keep the temps up during the winter inspite of him naturally slowing down some just so he eats every once in awhile. Unless your getting a pair and intend on breeding. As far as temps, I'd put the hot side at least 105 degrees, and other side 85 degrees. So a Zoomed mercuey 150watt on one end and a 75 watt on the other, that precludes the screen top your using is all open, if you have a closed vented cage then just the 150 should work. They do respond to light quite a bit so just having heat is often not as good as also having light. So what I often do is use a flourescent ESU8.0 desert flourescent with a regular zoomed basking bulb 150 watt on one end and 75 watt on the other end. This puts out more light and the desert species get thier UVA/UVB and extra light. I use this set-up for my fringe-toed sansd lizard as well. I would put in a branch about the width of the lizard or some rocks or both as they do climb from time to time. Just so their is lots of floor space for moving around and burrying. Hope this helps, if he's an adult don't put smaller lizards in with them.......Cheers!!! Its been many years since I've had them, kept mine in an outside cage and recieved a lot of enjoyment watching them over the years.
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Phrynosoma.com

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signature file edited. [phw 11/14/04]

Hey,

Reptoman: awesome post. I wish I knew you kept them when I used to keep them, we could've compared notes.

Esther: My lizards were tough until I got them outside. Then they were one of the easiest lizards I have had the opportunity to keep. They like heat, space, and lots of food. Don't be afraid to try large insects with these guys. I've seen them eat some strangely large bugs..... Follow reptoman's advice, and you will do fine. Most of all, enjoy these awesome lizards.

good luck,
-Phil

My main problem seems to be having to get a bigger tank for them and a bigger basking bulb. Since I live in a NYC apartment, having an outside pen for them is OUT! I could just see an outside pen in the middle of the apartment complex lawn, with every kid and cat trying to get them!

Thanks for the advice. I don't have a 40 gallon tank for them, the biggest tank I currently have is a 30 gallon. What are the dimensions of a 40 gallon? The space I have to keep the tank is not very high, it's under a shelf.

Do they ever have a problem with ingestion of sand? I've seen lizards die from ingesting Calci sand.

Can they do OK with a 100W regular light bulb to bask under, or one of those 100W triangular basking bulbs?

Esther-I understand your predicement. Let me just say I gave you what I believe is a good over-all scenerio to keeping zebra-tails. First of all if you going to keep them why not get them a zoomed bulb? Yes you could use a regular bulb, but your trying to achieve an ambient temprature in the cage, the light from the regular bulb does not force down but spreads everywhere. So I think it's hard to set up a real good bask site with the wrong type bulb, but it probably would work. I assume you have never seen these lizards in the wild, but they can run at incredible speeds and are extreemly active and their territory is rather large. A 30 gallon is the same in bottom space as a 20 but just higher vertically. I honestly think if your going to keep one of these or a pair you need to consider your investment first. You can find a used 40 gallon tank from a fish store or the classifieds in your area, usually they can be had for 20 bucks or so. Deminsions are different on 40 gallons, but they are usually 36" long by 16 or 18" wide, and 16" high or so. As I intimated, the 40 gallon would be a minimum. Keeping them in a 30 for a short period of time should not hurt, but not having a lot of space to move around for a greyhound type lizard is certian to impact them in the long run. Just my opinion. As far as the zoomed bulb there are many on-line reptile product sellers you could by a bulb cheap from. As far as a 100watt bulb, I'm thinking you'll need 150 watt on one side. Remember you need the ambient temps to be like the desert or these guys will not feed or digest their food well. SO here it is, hopefully others will commnet, but I think you need to consider the investment and commitment first before you purchase. There are many lizards that would do well in a 20L or 20 gal. terrerium, but these speedsters need freedom to roam........hope this helps. Cheers!
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Phrynosoma.com

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signature file edited. [phw 11/14/04]

I just put out the word to a Petland manager I'm friendly with to ask around the chain of stores for a 40 gallon breeder tank leaker. This is what they keep feeder goldfish and such in. He will get back to me as soon as he checks around.

I ordered one of those spot basking lights such as you describe today, as well as a Combi-light to hold the UVB and a couple of fill-in incandescent bulbs.

As soon as I can get a bigger tank, I will go to Home Depot and get some common sand for them. The present tank furnishings (broken bricks, a polyresin stump) should suffice. I put a shallower water bowl in there today, too, as they didn't seem to register that water was in the 1.5" high bowl.

I also bought them some waxworms tonight, which they ate with relish.

So, I'm pulling out all the stops to get a proper home together for them as soon as possible.

A 40 breeder is 18 x 36 where a standard forty is 12 x 48. They also have a 65 breeder which is 18 x 48. I think the 65 would be your best bet as it has a lot more floor space. The breeder tanks are also shorter than the standard tanks. We have a company here in MI, Great Lakes Aquarium, that makes critter tanks for cheaper than a tank that will hold water. They are available in 18" and 24" widths and 36", 48", 60" and 72" lengths and heights of 12", 18" and 24". The glass is thinner and they are not sealed as well but are much cheaper than the tanks that hold water. They make ideal lizard cages. I just wish they would make the back and 2 sides of a solid (not see through) material because the openness of an all glass tank I think stresses most lizards. Tom

Do you keep any Lacertids? I believe I have seen your post in the Lacerta forum. What types? I also keep Lacertas now. Viridis, strigata and lepida. They are ideal lizards for MI and NY. Hope to see you reply. Pretty much everything is fair game on this chuck forum. The Lacerta forum is dead so if you want talk about the Lacertas here.

I catch my local Podarcis sicula, which make EXCELLENT pets. I had a pair in a 30 for a couple of years. The male passed away, I have no idea how old they were when I caught them. The female is still going great, I will catch her a new boyfriend next spring.

I had a couple of Darevskia praticola, the Euro "meadow lizard", which a CA friend shipped to me when he moved to Ak and couldn't keep them. One died soon after shipping. The other I had nearly a year before she caught some sort of respiratory infection and treatment didn't work. These are incredibly tiny lizards and you don't even see them often in your tank, they hang out in plants.

I also have 2 female goliath grass lizards, which I love. I am LOOKING FOR A MALE! so if you run across one, please let me know.

I used to keep Eremias sufani, I just adore them, ("Chinese Spotted lacerta", but they just don't live long in captivity, despite good care. I think they are both parasite-loaded and stressed by the horrific shipping conditions from the Iran/Kazakhstan, etc. area they come from. My friend Debra also kept them, and I know she also gave absolutely sterling care, but they just don't last more than a few months to a year.

I wouldn't mind getting my hand on ANY of the tiny European or Euro-asian species such as Podarcis, Eremias, Acanthodactylus, etc.

It is a crying shame that U.S. herpkeepers aren't as into small lacertids as the Europeans are. Your lacerta spp. are just too big for my tanks, but pretty they are. I guess you got some from Bert of Agama International, huh?

What is the scientific name on the goliath grass lizards? I am very good friends with Bert. I also have a freind in San Francisco from the Ukraine. He is going to try to import some nice cold weather dreveskia next summer. Most of the Podarcis are protected and are not that common in the European hobby. I know of a guy that has some pityuensis for sale in Europe but it is very costly to import them. They are legal animals with permits. I agree that I do not know why the European Lacertids are not that well accepted here in the States. They are a very diverse beautiful group of lizards. Please fee free to continue to post here on the chuck forum about your lacertas and other desert desert lizards you may keep. We have a couple guys here that keep sceloporous, uma and dipsosaurus so there are very knowledgeable people available here. Plus I need all the help I can get with the Lacertas. The biggest problem I have is that they like to kill one another. I have 2 pairs finally of the lepida that are compatable. My strigata are starting to get large. I started of with 7 animals and am down to 4. I think ideally they should be kept individually until you can get opposite sex animals that are similar in size then group them. The same goes with the viridis. I started with 4 and am down to now what I believe is a sexed pair and they seem to get along well together except at feeding time. They are like paranhas trying to grab anything that moves. Tom

The goliath lizards are Takydromus septentrionalis. They are much larger and prettier than the T. sexlineatus commonly seen.

I agree, lacertids are a very underappreciated group. People in the U.S. like BIG violent lizards like monitors, ignoring the subtle charm of the tiny lacertids.

You are right, they can be very aggressive, even female to female. I watched female Podarcis sicula hassle each other. I had 3 females and one male and eventually I wound up with the alpha female and the male.

I have always wanted to keep Callisaurus, Uma and petrosuarus mearnsi. I think that all would be high maintenance lizards. I noticed that Loren Pennebraker is working with Uma and P. mernsi but I am not sure if he produced any. I might have to make a collecting trip soon. They used to have a really cool desert setup at the Toronto zoo with Petrosaurus mearnsi in it. They are awesome lizards to observe. Maybe someday. Also Lou the chucks are all down for the count. Hopefully we will get some breeding next season. I am making a lot of adjustments to the cages as I am finding out these guys like it a lot more humid that common chucks. I got a lot of good info on island chucks from Dr. James Jarchow in Tucson. He does all the work for the Desert Museum and has been to the islands quite a few times. He was a little standoffish at first but turned out ok giving me a lot of very useful info on temps and humidity year-round on the islands. "If at first you don't succeed try, try again." Don't know who said it but I will try to live by it. Tom