Reptile & Amphibian Forums

So let me get this straight...there are basically three distinct types of Pastels...right? Judging by the classifieds, it seems they range in price from Pastel Jungle (lowest) to Lemon Pastel (highest).

What's the reason? Or...what makes the Lemon Pastel so much more expensive? Are there fewer on the market? A newer morph? Better looking?

This is confusing.

Thanks,
Chris
-----
"I don't know about you...but I find comfort in that." -- Cowboy

Pastel Jungles tend to brown out with age, blondes tend to hold that blondish color and a good lemon pastel will hold the bright yellow thru adulthood. Now I have seen some normal pastel jungles that have held color, and blondes that have browned out, as well as lemons that have browned out, BUT if you get a lemon that IS bright yellow as a hatchling, it will more the likely keep its color to adulthood.

Lemons are worth the most because of how well they hold color as adults.

Pictured is my NERD Lemon Line Pastel. Hes 600 grams and looks better now then when he was a baby.

I here what your saying on the pastels. These are all credible pastel lines that are all individually marketed.

You have the:

Bell Line
Graziani Line
Nerd's Lemons
Ruppel Line
Blondes.....not sure who proved this line
Enchi Line
and I'm sure more............

All of these are beautiful. The bottom line is each line can produce average pastels and incredible pastels. Each line also tend to have some type of different unique feature or quality...although some of the differences can be very suttle. I would try to get the best looking pastel from the line you prefer. A top shelf A level pastel is more likely to kick higher quality offspring. However, average pastels can produce stunning offspring.

Many more pastel lines are being proven out and I'm sure we will see some more different variations of this morph.

-----
Jim Perron
Python Passion Reptiles
pythonpassion@hotmail.com
www.pythonpassionreptiles.com

Yes. There does seem to be a line for everyone.

"I would try to get the best looking pastel from the line you prefer."

That's why I'm asking about the subtle differences. I can't choose a line I prefer until I know about each line. Only then can I prefer one line over the other. Informative decision blah blah blah. But I think we're on the same page. I must admit that the orange on some lines looks great on the babies, but once they start to "brown out"... I took a trip to the NERD site, too. They claim that their line of Lemon Pastel is the only line that DOES NOT "brown out" with age.

I've only seem a few photos of the Lemon Pastel, and I love it. I'm sure I'd be even more amazed to see one in person. But who knows?

Thanks A Bunch,
Chris
-----
"I don't know about you...but I find comfort in that." -- Cowboy

There are more then just lemons that sustain color. Personally I'm a blushing guy. If they brown out but have really dramatic blushing I'll take that any day. Lot's of color and lot's of blushing (ie...the super) is the best of both worlds.
-----
Jim Perron
Python Passion Reptiles
pythonpassion@hotmail.com
www.pythonpassionreptiles.com

The proof is out there for all of us to see. For example if you take a "Lemon" a "Blonde" and a "normal" Jungle pastel and breed them to five girls each and mix up all the babies will you be able to differentiate them? The answer is NO. We have all seen the below average Pastels that can result from Blonde and Lemon pastels as well as the screamers that can result from "Normal" Pastels.

I think how this all started was early in the game some people got their hands on a really nice, Hi-Yellow Pastel and sincerely thought they had something different. So the new labels were applied. Honest mistake... but we need to now realize and admit that this was a mistake.

I have some good ole Graziani Pastels that can stand up to the majority of lemons and blondes out there. A Pastel is a Pastel is a Pastel.

I'm not out to offend anyone, but that's my take on the situation.

Oz

-----
OZZYBOIDS

I beg to differ. Some of the pastels are different and pass along certain traits that others don't . Some get a brown shoulder area while others don't. Some make better supers than others. To be perfectly honest i am not as thrilled as I would expect with lemon super. A real good lemon is hard to beat, even against the super. I would have hoped for a better super, not enough fading. Graziani super is very different from a graziani pastel, nice step up. Lots of fading!
I see it more with things like bumble bees. The lemon bumble bee is very clean, lots of white. My lemon line also produces a lot of neck striping that others don't. One problem with all of these names, people pawn any pastel as this or that. Some of my bumbles from another pastel line are not as clean, more noise in the pattern.

I do not have all of the pastel lines so I do not know all of the lines.

I will say one thing I noticed with the lemons is that they often start as an ugly duckling. I remember hatching the first three and they were stunning but that may have even been because they were the first pastels and I had no idea what I was really looking at, they did not look normal!
I remember waiting to hatch a fantastic male out for a friend and failing for a few years. I wanted to make sure he got a steller animal. Besides having dreadful odds on ratios(females and low pastel counts) I could not hatch out a black and yellow baby. These babies were ok but not what I expected. I sold these not knowing that they take MONTHS to get better. The same as a jungle carpet. I had to find out that I need to hold onto them and watch them as they change through the next 5 or so sheds. I have now learned what to look for in baby lemons, they change so much, lots of sharp contrast with black, yellow and white. My other pastels often start out nice as babies and some get a bit less fantastic as they mature, a bit opposite from the lemons.

Just my take- Kev@NERD
-----
www.newenglandreptile.com
The Most Extensive Collection of Ball Python Mutations in Captivity

I have noticed the same thing with Pastels. The Hi-yellow babies are not as impressive as the orange babies, but after a few sheds it becomes evident that the yellow babies will look better as adults.

A couple of years back I bought 5 female pastels from the Sutherlands and the one I liked the least is the one that turned out to be the best. She's pictured below as an adult. This animal did not brown out... she lit up! I had pictures of her as a baby but my hard drive crashed.

The brightest pastel I have ever laid eyes on was a lemon from your line, I'll give you that. But I have seen many more lemons and blondes that were not that impressive. It makes me wonder if the coloring, blushing, neck bars and other characteristics associated with certain lines are due to selective breeding or unrelated traits passed on independent of the Jungle Pastel gene. I guess time will tell.

-----
OZZYBOIDS

Here is a 900 gram Bell line male. I also have a very nice ASF Reptile Graziani Male that is as nice with a lot of blushing. thanks David

Yes, but are they really Lemons? I have seen many imposters..in fact a ton!!
Don't believe everything you see out there, some people just snag names!

Kev
-----
www.newenglandreptile.com
The Most Extensive Collection of Ball Python Mutations in Captivity

-----
OZZYBOIDS

got any photos of some adult lemons handy??????

love to see some real ones from the source.

Thanks

I will snap a few new pics - kev
-----
www.newenglandreptile.com
The Most Extensive Collection of Ball Python Mutations in Captivity