Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I have always tried to collect info over the years on others’ do-it-yourself racks and cages b/c I knew the day would eventually come when I would try these projects. Anyway, I recently moved and now have plenty of room to work with for making my own racks and cages. BUT I have some questions as I sit and plan and design...

I really want a natural, wood-look for a rack system, so I was going to use 1/2 inch ply (vs. 3/4 inch pure, bright-white melamine). So...if I stain and seal the wood on the racks, how can I safely use flexwatt heat tape for belly heat? Is there anyway to safely run flexwatt on natural wood? What about if the wood has been poly'd/sealed? I want to be as simple in design as possible...in otherwords, I don't want to have to router grooves or anything, even though I have the tools...it would probably be a pain and I would still have the question about safety if heat tape is in direct contact with the wood.

2nd Q - what type of polyurethane/sealant can be used? I never took note of what others have successfully used. Also, I will probably only go to home depot/lowes for most materials.

My first rack I'll attempt will be for colubrids and I realize that they don't necessarily need belly heat BUT I plan to build another 2 racks for boas and pythons and I'd like to keep the design the same. If there is no way to run heat tape w/thermostat on wood shelves then I may have no other choice but to use back heat, which I don’t want to do.

Advice, comments, suggestions are all welcome…
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Sincerely, Jason
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My Website: www.members.aol.com/northeastsnakes
My collection...
BOAS: 0.1 Solomon Island Ground Boa, 1.1 Brazilian Rainbow Boas, 1.1 Argentine Boas, 2.2 Nicaraguans, 1.1 Sonoran Desert Boas, 1.1 Cay Caulkers, 1.0 Columbian Boa 100% het Kahl Albino, 0.1 Anery Col boa, 1.1 Hog Island Boas, 0.1 Hog Island Boa poss het patternless.
PYTHONS: 1.2 Green Tree Pythons, 2.2 Bismarck Ringed Pythons, 2.8 Normal Ball Pythons, 1.0 Ball Python 100% het Piebald, 1.1 Spotted Pythons.
COLUBRIDS: 1.1 Black Pines, 1.1 Northern Pines, 2.2 Bairds Ratsnakes, 1.2 White-sided Black Ratsnakes.
CORNS: 1.0 Blizzard, 1.2 Bloodreds, 1.2 Butters, 1.0 Ghost, 0.1 Sunglow, 1.0 Hypo het Amber, 1.1 Lavenders, 1.1 Miami Phases, 1.2 Reverse Okeetee, 0.1 Snow, 0.1 Striped Amel, 3.2 Okeetees.
OTHER: 0.0.3 N. Diamondback Terrapins.

shouldnt be any problem with what you are wanting to do...The temps should only be 90 at the most and thats not going to burn it down or anything.......There is a clear outdoor finish called Helmsman..(or somthing like that) I have used it before and it works good. Just make sure the rack has had plenty of time to dry and doesnt stink anymore before putting snakes in it.

>>I really want a natural, wood-look for a rack system, so I was going to use 1/2 inch ply (vs. 3/4 inch pure, bright-white melamine).

Is this for standard sized sweater boxes? Were you planning on having the boxes slide in width-wise to allow for two smaller boxes per level?

I recommend this design but don't agree with using 1/2" ply for the shelves, I believe it would sag.

Instead use 1/2" ply for the sides and 3/4' for the shelves. With the shallower rack you'll save a lot of weight. Make it a backless design and you'll save even more.

Another problem with using plywood is that the boxes slide very poorly over it. This can be improved a few ways.

1) Use thin strips of hardboard or even pegboard (possibly leftover from the back) for the boxes to slide on. This also allows for the boxes to not rub directly on the heat tape.

2) Put down a layer of contact paper on both the top and underside of each shelf.

3) Apply several layers of oil-based polyurethane.

4) Use birch laminated ply in conjuction with one of the above ideas. It's smoother and works much better in racks.

5) Use faux-oak melamine shelving with a bullnosed edge. It's a bit heaver than plywood but solves all of your problems.

>>So...if I stain and seal the wood on the racks, how can I safely use flexwatt heat tape for belly heat? Is there anyway to safely run flexwatt on natural wood? What about if the wood has been poly'd/sealed? I want to be as simple in design as possible...in otherwords, I don't want to have to router grooves or anything, even though I have the tools...it would probably be a pain and I would still have the question about safety if heat tape is in direct contact with the wood.

The hardboard or pegboard shims are the way to go.

But since you want to this be as simple as possible I'd recommend the bull-nosed melamine shelving. Just stain your plywood sides to match.

>>2nd Q - what type of polyurethane/sealant can be used?

If you go with an all plywood rack, I'd recommend an oil-based, interior polyurethane. It's a lot of work, though.

If you use the melamine shelves, then the sides would only need a water-based poly like Polycrylic. I cannot stress enough how much easier and quicker this product is to use over oil-based polys. However, I'm not sure it would provide enough protection for the shelves. Just another reason to use the oak melamine for your shelves.

From reading your post I have a pretty good feel for what you concerns are.

I highly recommend 1/2" oak plywood for the sides, pegboard for the back, and 3/4" bullnosed melamine shelving for the shelves.

Here's a rack I built similar to that.

I used cheap AC plywood for the sides but never stained it. The shelves are the bullnosed product I mentioned. With oak plywood on the sides I could have easily stained the sides to match.

The rack has no back. Instead it had thin metal angle to stop the boxes.

When this picture was taken the rack was only being used to house herp supplies and mealworms.

Note that there are either one full sized box or two half-sized boxes per level. I prefer this design as it's lighter and more versatile.

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Current snakes:

1.1 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Silver/Yellow)

3.4 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Green)

2.1 Gonyosoma janseni - (Black)

Chris,
Did you bullnose it yourself or buy it as is? and if you bought as is...Where is this approximately located in H.Depot (or Lowes) and what dimensions does it come in? I can NEVER find anything at ANY of the H.Depots or Lowes in my area that I can work with for my sterilite boxes...and there are several of these stores in a 1/2 hour radius...all of which never have anything. I guess I thought if I saw this then I would have possibly thought to use it.

Otherwise, I went to the shelving section and the shelf sizes are only in 10" or 12" x 1/2" sizes. Other than that...white Melamine comes in the standard 3/4" X 4 X 8' sheets and thats about it as far as I saw, unless I'm looking in the wrong section. Anyway, working with what they have is mainly what turned me off to melamine, besides the heaviness. But if I can build several like yours with relative ease, then I might do that and modify it so I could stack them. The more I think about ply..the more of a headache it would probably be to poly the whole thing...plus its more expensive than melamine I guess.

BTW...my rack will be for Sterilite 32-qt containers (model # 1756). Would these fit? I have too many of them to switch over to rubbermaid...and besides, for some odd reason, I like sterilte better anyway.lol
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Sincerely, Jason
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My Website: www.members.aol.com/northeastsnakes
My collection...
BOAS: 0.1 Solomon Island Ground Boa, 1.1 Brazilian Rainbow Boas, 1.1 Argentine Boas, 2.2 Nicaraguans, 1.1 Sonoran Desert Boas, 1.1 Cay Caulkers, 1.0 Columbian Boa 100% het Kahl Albino, 0.1 Anery Col boa, 1.1 Hog Island Boas, 0.1 Hog Island Boa poss het patternless.
PYTHONS: 1.2 Green Tree Pythons, 2.2 Bismarck Ringed Pythons, 2.8 Normal Ball Pythons, 1.0 Ball Python 100% het Piebald, 1.1 Spotted Pythons.
COLUBRIDS: 1.1 Black Pines, 1.1 Northern Pines, 2.2 Bairds Ratsnakes, 1.2 White-sided Black Ratsnakes.
CORNS: 1.0 Blizzard, 1.2 Bloodreds, 1.2 Butters, 1.0 Ghost, 0.1 Sunglow, 1.0 Hypo het Amber, 1.1 Lavenders, 1.1 Miami Phases, 1.2 Reverse Okeetee, 0.1 Snow, 0.1 Striped Amel, 3.2 Okeetees.
OTHER: 0.0.3 N. Diamondback Terrapins.

>>Chris,
>>Did you bullnose it yourself or buy it as is?

Sorry, I bought it at Menard's, a fairly common Midwest Home Improvment Center. It came as is.

Home Depot really does not have a similar product. I buy the 23" wide stuff and rip it down to 1" wider than the box I'm planning to use.

>>I can NEVER find anything at ANY of the H.Depots or Lowes in my area that I can work with for my sterilite boxes...

I've had the same problem at Lowes. I did buy a bunch of melamine shelving at Home Depot and used it to build a rack. Again, I had to rip it down to 17" wide or whatever to build the rack. It had a pre-finished edge I liked and I did not have a vehicle to move full sheets of melamine. Both made it worth the extra money.

I have also seen an unfinished, particle board shelving with a bull nose. Just last week someone posted a picture of a rack built from that material. He painted it to provide moisture resistance.

>>The more I think about ply..the more of a headache it would probably be to poly the whole thing...plus its more expensive than melamine I guess.

Correct on both counts. I do like the idea of plywood sides for the weight savings, though. My next racks will be 1/2" oak plywood sides and use the bullnosed oak melamine for the shelves.

>>BTW...my rack will be for Sterilite 32-qt containers (model # 1756). Would these fit? I have too many of them to switch over to rubbermaid...and besides, for some odd reason, I like sterilte better anyway.lol

That particular Sterilite box is very nice, one of my favorite boxes, in fact. However, I use the rubbermaids for a few main reasons:

1) When using 3/4" shelves you can only fit 6 Sterilite tubs in a 4' tall rack. With the rubbermaids I can fit 7. Since lumber comes in 4' increments I think this is a nice benefit.

2) The Rubbermaids are cheaper from my local sources. I don't know if that still holds true, however.

3) The 14 qt. Sterilites that go with the 1756 are just a hair taller than the 32's on average. So if you build with a real tight gap sometimes the 12 qt. boxes don't fit. Or, conversely, the gap for the 32 qt. is too big.

This can actually be used to your advantage since typically the snakes that go in the smaller boxes are better escape artists.

4) I used to keep a lot of venomous and it was easier to use a hook to slide open the rubbermaids than the Sterilites.

All in all, though, I would use the Sterilites if I had them.
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Current snakes:

1.1 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Silver/Yellow)

3.4 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Green)

2.1 Gonyosoma janseni - (Black)

Chris,
Do you know if Lowes has the bullnose Oak melamine? Otherwise, where else can I get melamine from? Its so frustrating everytime I go to Home Depot...no matter what I go for...they never have it, and when I try to find someone to ask...its like Where's Waldo. Its even worse now that its the holiday season. I really want to get a rack in place before xmas b/c my project over my break from teaching is going to be framing out my herp room, which will be an exciting event. I have a little one on the way and needless to say, I won't have the time I thought I would over the summer to do alot of these projects. I decided to put off breeding any of my snakes for another year just b/c of the lack of time to do this stuff.

Anyway, I really appreciate the help trying to make this work. Occassionally I'll do a google search and kingsnake threads from 2002 will pop up with related topics.lol.

I like the idea of creating subunits so that I don't have a rack the size or weight of a fridge.

I'm thinking 20x26" shelf sizes so I can get 7 shelves out of 1 4x8' board. I thought I could give slightly larger dimensions to the Home Depot or Lowes people and have them cut the boards so I can get them home. I'm pretty sure they don't do precision cuts. If I did this and then brought the pieces home to make a more precise, cleaner cut, what blade would I use so I wouldn't tear through the melamine?

Also, I am thinking of using 2x3's with maybe 1x2's laddered so the melamine shelves would lay on top of them. This would leave the sides open so I could easily run underbelly heat tape (or back heat if I wanted to change it later on). I would probably just build the unit upside-down and insert the shelves (with a small spacer) making slight adjustments as I go. I have the basic, general idea of how I want to do it, its just a matter of getting the shelving I like. I really wanted exactly what you described but its no where to be found in my area. Any other options or ideas without having to special order supplies? Otherwise I feel so limited with what I can do...either ply or white melamine...and I'm not really happy with either but I can't afford $2000's worth of racks so melamine may be my only option.
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Sincerely, Jason
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My Website: www.members.aol.com/northeastsnakes
My collection...
BOAS: 0.1 Solomon Island Ground Boa, 1.1 Brazilian Rainbow Boas, 1.1 Argentine Boas, 2.2 Nicaraguans, 1.1 Sonoran Desert Boas, 1.1 Cay Caulkers, 1.0 Columbian Boa 100% het Kahl Albino, 0.1 Anery Col boa, 1.1 Hog Island Boas, 0.1 Hog Island Boa poss het patternless.
PYTHONS: 1.2 Green Tree Pythons, 2.2 Bismarck Ringed Pythons, 2.8 Normal Ball Pythons, 1.0 Ball Python 100% het Piebald, 1.1 Spotted Pythons.
COLUBRIDS: 1.1 Black Pines, 1.1 Northern Pines, 2.2 Bairds Ratsnakes, 1.2 White-sided Black Ratsnakes.
CORNS: 1.0 Blizzard, 1.2 Bloodreds, 1.2 Butters, 1.0 Ghost, 0.1 Sunglow, 1.0 Hypo het Amber, 1.1 Lavenders, 1.1 Miami Phases, 1.2 Reverse Okeetee, 0.1 Snow, 0.1 Striped Amel, 3.2 Okeetees.
OTHER: 0.0.3 N. Diamondback Terrapins.

>>Chris,
>>Do you know if Lowes has the bullnose Oak melamine?

I've been in several Lowes and Home Depot's in five different states in the last year and a half and it seems everyone is different. Regardless, the only place I've ever seen the oak, bull-nosed melamine is Menards.

>>Otherwise, where else can I get melamine from?

Well I assume you mean the oak stuff, so I don't know other than Menards.

>>I really want to get a rack in place before xmas b/c my project over my break from teaching is going to be framing out my herp room, which will be an exciting event.

LOL. Let me know how that goes. I've moving into a house with a 38'x25' garage and need to frame out a herp room or two in there.

>>I like the idea of creating subunits so that I don't have a rack the size or weight of a fridge.

You know, racks are a pain to move, period. I just build 4' tall racks, put casters on the bottom, and then set cages, incubators, hatchling racks, and supplies on top. I've tried the subunit idea and did not like it.

>>I'm thinking 20x26" shelf sizes so I can get 7 shelves out of 1 4x8' board.

Now you lost me. I typically get ten shelves out of a full sheet of melamine. Melamine is 49"x97", not 4'x8' so you can get ten shelves, each at 19.4"x24.5" not accounting for blade width. That size is more than big enough.

>>I thought I could give slightly larger dimensions to the Home Depot or Lowes people and have them cut the boards so I can get them home. I'm pretty sure they don't do precision cuts. If I did this and then brought the pieces home to make a more precise, cleaner cut, what blade would I use so I wouldn't tear through the melamine?

You know, I've done this at Lowes before and ended up with shelves that were all identical. I'm glad I still have them cut oversized, though, as I've also had poor quality cuts made there.

I think it's a good idea. You should be able to get ten shelves.

>>Also, I am thinking of using 2x3's with maybe 1x2's laddered so the melamine shelves would lay on top of them. This would leave the sides open so I could easily run underbelly heat tape (or back heat if I wanted to change it later on).

I have done this. Understand this material is more likely to shrink and warp etc. as it dried out in a warm herp room. This can cause boxes to sieze over time. I've not had the same issue with plywood sides.

I'd stick with plywood and cut grooves for the heat tape.

One other solution to your melamine problem. Sorry I forgot this one earlier.

Go ahead and use 1/2" oak plywood for the sides.

For the shelves use white melamine.

But cover the exposed, cut edge of each melamine shelf with some real oak trim designed to laminate plywood edges. Basically its a trim that duplicates the bull-nosed edge.

With boxes you don't end up seeing much of the white and the little bit you do see makes a very nice contrast to the dark stained oak.

I built one of these before and it looked fantastic. The only thing I did not like was the white top but I just covered that with some faux-oak contact paper.

I believe this solves all of your problems.
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Current snakes:

1.1 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Silver/Yellow)

3.4 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Green)

2.1 Gonyosoma janseni - (Black)

You can also use foil tape over the flexwatt to protect it from rubbing when the tubs are pulled out.. As long as you have a quaity thermosat on ther you dont have to worry about a fire.. And Chris that is an awsome rack....
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www.mgreptiles.com
CBB Herps and Heating Supplies

Back then AC plywood was cheap so I got a half sheet for around $9. Then two pieces of 96"x23" melamine shelving for $25. I already had screws, glue, and casters from other projects but the glue and screws would not have cost much. I also coated the underside of each shelf with rubberized contact paper I had leftover from another project.

I'm not sure how much this rack would cost today. Certainly over $40 without the casters, but not much more.
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Current snakes:

1.1 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Silver/Yellow)

3.4 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Green)

2.1 Gonyosoma janseni - (Black)

"as long as you have a quaity thermostat on ther you don't have to worry about a fire".
is that to say a potential fire could only orignate from the thermostats performance? not to long ago someone posted a picture of some flexwatt that burned and melted.then of coarse there's a possibilty of arcing on the connectors.i think that statement could possibly give someone a false sense of security.have fun!