I just got this email back from Bob at Pro-Products this morning, explaning the difference between a regular permethrin based pesticide and provent a mite. Here is his reply.

This is like saying that laundry detergent and hand dishwashing liquid are
the same because they are both "soap". Try to soak your snake in powdered
laundry detergent and see what the "active & inert" ingredients can cause.
There are different isomers of permethrin which all have different toxicity
levels as well as the synergists, surfactants and other inerts, many which
are toxic to reptiles that are used in these other products. None of this is
or has to be disclosed on the label.

Pyrethrins are widely used in many products as they pose no major risk to
mammals and birds as a rule, but they are definitely toxic to reptiles.
Most of these products also use chemicals such as Piperonyl butoxide, which
is a synergist that modifies and increases the toxicity of the active in
various ways. One will find that most formulations use this and/or other
synergists as it is much cheaper than the active and creates a more lethal
product.

Studies have been done, and products are marketed, showing that Piperonyl
butoxide as well as other chemicals are definitely toxic to reptiles,
regarding the killing of brown tree and other snakes, and improve the
formula to do just that. You can do a search on these products used in the
South Pacific and Indonesia that use various formulas to KILL snakes. They
are packaged in high pressure containers (like a wasp & hornet spray) so you
can hit the snake up to 20 feet away.

These products can be absolutely lethal to snakes. Many product labels can
appear to be the same or very similar as Provent-a-mite as to the generic
active, but they are very different products.

There are many other chemicals in these formulas that will never be made
public and since the manufacture did not make any claims to the EPA (or on
the label) that the product would be safe and effective on reptiles, no such
studies or proof would be required. Many of these inerts can be potentially
toxic to reptiles and since no tests or studies have ever been performed, no
one knows. Since all formulas are proprietary and secret, no one will ever
know what is really in the can and will only be sure that the product is OK
to use with reptiles if that claim is specifically on the label. This is
why it is a federal offense to sell, distribute, offer for sale, promote or
use any pesticide for an unlabeled use. The EPA enforces this, as using a
pesticide indiscriminately for a non tested use can have deleterious effects
on the site, host and environment and they do not want any such problems to
develop.

These products have never been clinically tested on reptiles and are not the
same formula as Provent-a-mite. Also many of these products are designed to
break down quickly, which will expose the mites and ticks to a sub-lethal
dose, which can lead to(and has with other species of ectoparasites)creating
a resistant strain of ectoparasites that would be difficult if not
impossible to eradicate!
Call these companies and ask if their product is safe to use on reptiles,
and to put it in writing and see what response you get. Many people have
learned the hard way that these products are not the same formula as
Provent-a-mite. Often, these products can cause chronic long term problems,
so one never associates the demise of the animal with a mite treatment done
previously as well as outright death of the reptile.

Provent-a-mite is the only product approved by the EPA and the USDA,
specifically for use with reptiles (no other product can say this).
Provent-a-mite is approved for the uses stated on our label for which such
an approval would not have been granted without submitting the required
efficacy and toxicity studies.

The EPA requires very detailed studies done by a specific set of protocols
in order to register a formula for a specific use. These studies must
follow certain guidelines and conform to such certifications as GLP (good
laboratory practices) or equivalent. We spent 6 years and several
tests/studies before we received EPA approval for our product to be used
specifically on reptiles. This was after the approximately 10 years we
spent developing the formula. We had to show that Provent-a-mite didn't
hurt the reptile, had efficacy results per our claims and did not pose any
risk or environmental hazards when used per the directions as set forth in
our submittal.

Most of our studies, like any other company, contain proprietary
information, so will never be released to the public. However, there are a
few completed, non proprietary studies that either have been published or
will be soon.

What follows is an excerpt from a paper that will be published in the near
future in a recognized scientific journal. Until it is published, we can't
provide any additional information.

"...However, it was realized that different formulations of acaricides
contain different ingredients in addition to the active compound, some of
which might be toxic to reptiles. For example, Piperonyl butoxide, added to
some formulations as a synergist, has been associated with snake mortality.
Therefore, commercially available permethrin formulations were examined and
only one, a patented formulation containing 0.5% permethrin called
Provent-a-miteT(Pro Products, Mahopac, New York), was found which had been
prepared specifically for use on reptiles and which had been marketed in the
United States for several years as an acaricide for control of mites and
ticks that feed on reptiles. The clinical effects of application of
Provent-a-miteT were studied on three species of reptiles by direct
application to African spurred tortoises (Geochelone sulcata) and by
application to the bedding of rosy boas (Lichanura trivirgata) and green
iguanas (Iguana iguana), using on each occasion 10 times the recommended
dosage every fifth day for a total of six applications. Despite the
excessive doses of acaricides applied, no evidence of toxic reactions
related to treatment with the permethrin formulation was found in any of the
three species of reptiles treated, suggesting that Provent-a-miteT is a safe
product to use as an acaricide for control of ticks on tortoises, snakes and
lizards..."

People are always making claims about various pesticides and state they are
OK to use with reptiles when they have no knowledge as to what chemicals are
even in the formula. Even with a product that lists the same "generic"
active, the active can be a different isomer and the remainder of the
formula will always be a mystery. Just because one does not see any
negative outward effects after using an off labeled product, certainly
doesn't mean that it is not causing chronic health problems to the animal
over the long term or creating other problems, such as the potential for
resistant mites and other environmental damage.

No Pest strips were once considered safe (and some people still hang on to
this theory), but after many years of our reptiles being guinea pigs, it was
found that they are harmful, both acutely and chronically. Some of our
leading vets, including Douglas Mader as well as several zoos have confirmed
this. Unless the product has been specifically tested and approved for use
by the USEPA, no one can state whether or not it can be harmful to a
reptile.

Bob@ Pro Products
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-Chris

The reason mainstream thought is thought of as a stream is because it's so shallow. -George Carlin

A fool doesn't learn. A smart man learns from his mistakes. A wise man learns from the mistakes of others. Which one are you?

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