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Hello, I was wondering if anyone could point me in the right direction. I would like to know: who I need to talk to, cost, and any requirements. I have caught a couple in my life time one in my shed in Chuluota, FL and one when I was herping in Geneva, FL. But as I marveled at these beautiful snakes while they were in my possession I couldn't help but feel as if I was being watched by the man. I know its probably illegal to keep wild caughts on top of everything else so I would also like to know who is breeding them out there? I have heard about that guy out in CA but thats about it.

Thanks

>>Hello, I was wondering if anyone could point me in the right direction. I would like to know: who I need to talk to, cost, and any requirements. I have caught a couple in my life time one in my shed in Chuluota, FL and one when I was herping in Geneva, FL. But as I marveled at these beautiful snakes while they were in my possession I couldn't help but feel as if I was being watched by the man. I know its probably illegal to keep wild caughts on top of everything else so I would also like to know who is breeding them out there? I have heard about that guy out in CA but thats about it.
>>
>>Thanks

Not only is it illegal to keep a wild caught Indigo, it is illegal to TOUCH one. The permit is applied for through the Florida Department of Game and Freshwater Fish...but don't hold your breath. They are next to impossible to get. There is a list of breeders on www.indigosnakes.com, but no one is going to ship to Florida (or Georgia, Mississippi, Alabama or South Carolina) without a copy of valid State and Federal permits. Forget about a permit to catch one, it ain't gonna happen.
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We do not inherit the Earth from our ancestors; we borrow it from our children. Ralph Waldo Emerson

In addition to the info above, the State of Florida will issue permits for captive born Indigos. The catch is that you can't have both sexes. They won't let you breed them in Florida. They also require you to use them for educational purposes like demonstrations at schools and parks etc.
It's not impossible, I have sold many to folks in Florida over the years but the process is getting tougher all the time.
Good luck.
Chuck Elliott

Was to the Calusa Herp Society in Ft. Myers. Evidently it took them quite some time & a note from God to get it. They do have a website which you can find a link for on Kathy Love's Website

www.cornutopia.com

or just look under breeder/dealers on the Kingsnake.com main page.

Although I'd like to say something encouraging to you, I'd suggest, like the other guys said, try working with another Drymarchon. Look into getting yourself a nice Texas Indigo, there ARE some really pretty black specimens to be had which are ALMOST as nice as Easterns.

best of luck

Dean

Thanks for the info. I'll check their site out.

Not that I would discourage you from working with drymarchon... I just think you'd find your efforts better rewarded if you worked with ANY of the other subs if you live in Florida.

With the exception of Blacktail Cribos, you're going to pay as much or more. With the exception of 'some' Yellowtail cribos, your interaction with the snakes will be the same.

Although I've only worked with 2 of the subspecies, I didn't find couperi to be so unique from the texas indigos to be worth excluding the rest of them.

I know it's just my opinion, but perhaps finding a good substitute that you can enjoy without permits or fear of legal action if you breed them is worth the effort... just my thoughts.

Doug T

I think recently (since the time Chuck has sold into Florida)
it has gotten much more difficult.

I had a conversation with Paul Moeler, state herpetologist in FL
with the FL dept of game and freshwater fish.

He said that it should not be difficult for a zoo / wildlife center etc to get permission to get a captive born snake, but they are not really interested in giving them to private keepers.

And, like oldherper said, no way no how are you going to get permission to take a wild snake!

You should talk to oldherper about his rubidus (Mexican "indigos" or go with TX indigos or one of the other subs.

I beleive that it is more hassle than it is worth to apply for permits in Florida for D.c. couperi. Five out of the fourteen Couperi customers that I had all ended up not being able to get permits for the snake they wished to purchase from ME.

I believe Doug is right, it might be more beneficial and equally as rewarding getting either Rubidus(I want them too) or some nice c/b yellowtails.With all the drama surrounding the acquisition of permits, getting one of these fine snakes would not be a step down. I wish I HAD some nice yeelowtails, and I know alot of the other guys here feel the same way. And RUBIDUS? Rare as hens teeth.And worth every bit as much as a Couperi.

So, look on the bright side, windows close so that doors can open..Heck, if you breed them I might be your first customer.

Sincerely,

Fredrick Albury

As a fellow Floridian, non-native as I may be, allow me to offer my 2 cents.

OH and Deano are wise beyond their years. As I would expect them to be. Although I can not attest to Dean’s age I suspect that OH comes by his wisdom honestly . Dean does as well but he has us (OH included) at a disadvantage in that he is legally able to keep D. couperi in the Buckeye state.

We who have chosen to live within the accepted range of D. couperi face a far more different problem. Specifically, that you’ll need to sacrifice your first born and then promise more, to acquire a permit to keep D. couperi, even for educational purposes.

If you don’t already know, Chuck E. is well respected as a Dry breeder (dare I say an idol), and I have no desire to offend him by challenging his contention that it is possible to get a permit to keep D. couperi in Florida for educational purposes. I suspect that that information may be dated. Or, I have not yet found the right belly-button in the puzzle-palace to push.

In the short term we have cultured a relationship with a wildlife officer that lives down the street. Gently educating him as to our collection and the distinction between D. couperi and other Dry's. Honesty IS the best policy... and education of the enforcer is in your best interest.

Nay the less, as a pacifier, spousal unit and I have taken to keeping those Dry's that do not require permits in Fl. Currently we keep Texans, Rubies, and Yellowtails. Those would be enough for any aspiring Dry keeper. As soon as you become FULLY aware of the husbandry requirements you may change your mind about keeping any...

Regards,
Jeff Nichols

Thanks for the info ya'll. I take into consideration some of the suggestions made.

In response to your comment about permits in Florida. My info is dated for sure. I haven't bred and/or sold any Indigos for about 5 years. I can't remember when I sold them to anybody in Florida but I suppose I can look up the date. I have sold many to private breeders and a few to State animal reserves even in Florida as well as Georgia. I do remember that in the early days (late 80's or early 90's) I used to be able to sell pairs to private breeders. As time went on the State got tougher and tougher to get a permit from.
So I don't feel offended at anyone's comments, I readily admit I am not caught up with the rest of you folks. I totally agree with the rest of you that if I lived in Florida, which by the way I would love to live there, I would keep the other subspecies of drymarchon. My favorite would be the D.c.corais.
I hope you all had a great Christmas and hope you have a wonderful New Years.
I really enjoy reading all the posts. I hope to catch up with the rest of you some day.

Chuck