Reptile & Amphibian Forums

This is similar to the message I posted on the Ball python forum. I need all the input I can get:

I need some advice from those of you with experience in the minefield of snake purchase options!

Years ago, I was a foster home to what was probably a Columbian Red-Tailed boa, about 3.5', supposedly female. My husband and I both really liked her and would have kept her ourselves but someone said she'd have to eat rabbits eventually and I just didn't want to go there. Now I understand she may have been just fine on rats, albeit needing two at a time instead of one, so I'm sorta kicking myself for not keeping her. She did end up going to a good home, so I feel pretty good about that, at least.

Anyway, I'm planning to get another snake (I have a corn snake that's doing really well, plus an iguana, parrots, ferrets, cats, dogs and a duck) and have set my sites on one of the smaller boids, something that will grow to 5-6' or less. The ball python is on the top of my list, but I'm wondering if I should consider a small boa. A local pet store (privately owned) has what they claim is a dwarf red-tailed boa, also known as a Nicaraguan boa. I can't find anything about any boas from Nicaragua, so I'm wondering about this. The store owner says the snake's a female, has a good disposition and shouldn't get more than 4' or so. She's priced at $200.00 which is more than what I'd like to spend but could do it with some saving. The owner also says that ball pythons get bigger than what I've read, and that they are too problematic when it comes to feeding (like getting one to eat at all is a miracle, and you have to use live or freshly killed prey). Overall her opinion of the ball doesn't seem that great, but maybe it's because she doesn't have one for sale right now? Maybe I'm too much of a skeptic and she really just doesn't think they're a good choice?

Another local pet store (one of the pet store chains, but not one of the big "super" stores)has a young ball, for which they want $100. I haven't looked this snake over yet, just noticed him/her when I was in there buying supplies, so I haven't talked to the store about their feeding experiences with this snake. The store owner with the dwarf boa said never buy anything from this other store. Their snakes have mites, they buy from puppy mills, etc. Since I figure one store isn't going to speak highly of another, I take some of this info with a grain of salt.

I understand the issues involved with potential ball feeding problems, and for that reason, if I go with a bal, I'm wanting to buy either a c/b baby or an older snake that is used to f/t mice or rats. I've also looked into getting a snake from a reptile rescue facility or an individual, but so far haven't found anyone with a ball they need to place. I haven't asked about rescuing any boas since I'm trying to go with something smaller, and am a little overwhelmed with the different species choices. Plus the conflicting information I've gotten about just how big boas get has me confused.

Temperament-wise, I haven't found much information comparing boas to the ball python. Mainly I'm looking for something that "likes" to be handled--in quotes because I realize there's a limit to how much joy reptiles experience from human contact. The size limitation has more to do with how much room I can devote to caging and the fact that I don't want to have to feed anything larger than a rat, preferrably f/t.

I'm wondering how a dwarf Nicaraguan boa (if there is such a thing) stacks up in comparison to a ball python. I'm also confused about the best way to aquire my new snake. A pet store is probably easiest, especially since I can examine the indivdual. Getting one shipped seems a bit scary, and probably wouldn't be any cheaper. I don't care about fancy morphs at this point, and can't afford most of them anyway!

So here are my questions, to sum up:
Is there such a thing as a dwarf or Nicaraguan boa?
If not, how in the world might I know what the store actually has?
Are there other smaller boas that would be good for a beg/int herper? And how might they compare to a ball python?
How would you compare pet store buying to having your snake shipped to you?

I realize I've asked a lot here, but I'm looking for input from experienced people without an agenda. I could talk to these pet stores, but they may only tell me what they think is going to make them a sale.

Thanks so much for any help you can offer.

I have never heard of a dwarf Nicaraguan Boa, But Nics do stay small. As far as buying a snake online there are many good breeders out there that will back there animals. As far as paying $200 for a Nic that seems high you can go to the KS classifieds and find one much cheaper including shipping. A good place to go to find some info on boas is riobravoreptiles.com Good luck Duncs.

np
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www.chrisolsonreptiles.com
Naked I see the camp of those who desire nothing

Those prices are high. You should be able to get a nice, normal,
captive born and bred Ball python for under $100.

The Nicarauguan boa is overpriced as well. Look at the LLL
website, or the Glades website to get an idea of 'regular' prices.

Your best bet is to try and find a reptile show close to where
you're at and checking it out. The prices will be better, the
quality should be better and the chances of getting a good
deal and a HEALTHY animal are much better.

Ball pythons make great pets if you take proper care of them.
They're kind of bland though, boas are more interesting to
me.

(No agenda, I don't sell them.) I haven't kept any Nicaraguans, but they have a reputation for being a little nippy and hissy. Also Nics are known to be really finicky about taking frozen thawed, while my hogs didn't miss a beat when I switched them to f/t as babies. Hogs and nics are about the same size, 5 or 6 feet and maybe 15 pounds, compared to a common Colombian that can reach 10 feet and 60 pounds.

My experience with ball pythons is that they are shy and don't really have any personality. I've heard that in general, pythons have longer teeth and their owners are more likely to find that out the hard way.

I take my hogs to my local reptile club meetings and let the kids handle them, especially the female, she's the nicest snake I've known. You can get a hog from a reputable dealer on the classifieds here for anywhere between about $125 and $225 depending mostly on coloration. Here's a link to a pic of my 04 male from PMHerps. He seems to really, really like being held, he hangs out wrapped around my arm while I'm on the computer or watching TV, sometimes he sits in ambush posture hunting while I'm holding him but he hasn't ever tried to bite me. Hogs are hard to photo, all the pink on his sides didn't show up in the pic.
Link

>Is there such a thing as a dwarf or Nicaraguan boa?

There are dwarf boa constrictors, but they usually go by names like Hogg Island or Crawl Cay boas. My experience has been with boa constrictors that were probably imported from Colombia.

>If not, how in the world might I know what the store actually has?

From the price, odds are that it is Boa constrictor imperitor. That subspecies is found from northern Mexico to northern and western Colombia. While some pet store operators are good, many will lie like a rug. Rule of thumb: get independent confirmation of anything a pet store operator tells you unless/until you know enough to do it yourself. IOW, if a pet store guy says another pet store's snakes have mites and his do not, assume there are mites on snakes from both stores.

>Are there other smaller boas that would be good for a beg/int herper? And how might they compare to a ball python?

Other possibilities include spotted pythons and rainbow boas. Rainbows are a little demanding as to humidity, especially the babies. Colombian rainbows get around 4 feet long while the more colorful Brazilians max around 6 feet. I've never kept a spotted python.

I like both boas and balls but boa constrictors a shade better than ball pythons because the boas I've had were considerably easier to get to take f/t. OTOH, when I was keeping ball pythons, almost all were wild caught. And I got at least one good deal on a WC ball python that was on a hunger strike. Turned out all he wanted was a nice quiet hiding box and a live mouse.

>How would you compare pet store buying to having your snake shipped to you?

Pet store - major benefit is seeing what you are buying. Shipped in- major benefit is lower price. This time of year, shipped snakes are likely to freeze to death in transit.

IMHO, the best place is a reptile sale/swap meet sponsored by an amateur herpetology society and advertized as captive bred only. Many of the amateur herp societies around the country have adoption programs, too. If you check google, you may find an amateur group near you where you can get a line on local breeders, swap meets, adoption programs, long term captives that the owner wants to sell, and tips about the species you are interested in. Good luck.

Paul Hollander

I would suggest just about any of the BCI forms that are available. Theres plenty of great deals on the Nic's these days.Yes their farmed imports but from the right sources they'll be healthy and well started on f/t rodents.Check for bcijoe he still prolly has a nice Nic for $100 or less shipped ?He has/had some others for sale for abit more that were pretty sweet last I saw in his classified ads.
As far as BP's ? I cant hardly stand the two that I own now,but their here for LTC so I deal with their worthless @ss's.

I really like both. I have a Dumeril's and a ball python.

though ball's get a bad reputation for not eating, mine will eat anything and everything you put in front of it...and more!

The dumeril's will also. They are both great snakes. I have had great success with the classifieds on here. Great people, and great information!

i currently own 1.1 ball pythons and 1.1 argentine boas. frankly, i love my pythons to death. they're both such gentile and easy going snakes i can't believe it sometimes. the balls will stay pretty small, i think the record length is like 6 foot, but that would be rare, and males stay smaller. make sure any ball python you get is feeding at the pet store, if you don't you're starting off in a hole. a ball was my first snake and i'd highly suggest one for a first snake(despite all the exploitation they've had in the past). don't get me wrong, my boas are great, even if they're a bit grumpy sometimes, but it sounds like you'd enjoy keeping a ball python.
when you're looking for a snake, make sure you get a good vibe from the pet store. if things feel wrong, they probably are. reptile shows are great places to be able to compare snakes from different breeders/retailers. good luck, do whatever you think works for you.

cheers,
Pete

i currently own 1.1 ball pythons and 1.1 argentine boas. frankly, i love my pythons to death. they're both such gentile and easy going snakes i can't believe it sometimes. the balls will stay pretty small, i think the record length is like 6 foot, but that would be rare, and males stay smaller. make sure any ball python you get is feeding at the pet store, if you don't you're starting off in a hole. a ball was my first snake and i'd highly suggest one for a first snake(despite all the exploitation they've had in the past). don't get me wrong, my boas are great, even if they're a bit grumpy sometimes, but it sounds like you'd enjoy keeping a ball python.
when you're looking for a snake, make sure you get a good vibe from the pet store. if things feel wrong, they probably are. reptile shows are great places to be able to compare snakes from different breeders/retailers. good luck, do whatever you think works for you.

cheers,
Pete