Reptile & Amphibian Forums

HB 1151 has been granted a hearing before the House Judiciary Committee on Wednesday, January 26, 2005 at 1:30pm in House Hearing Room B in the John L. O’Brien Building. Please try to attend the hearing.
Read the bill here: http://www.leg.wa.gov/wsladm/billinfo1/dspBillSummary.cfm?billnumber=1151&year=2005

The Senate bill has been granted a hearing before the Senate Judiciary Committee on Thursday, January 27, 2005 at 10:00am in Senate Hearing Room 1 in the J. A. Cherberg Building. Please try to attend the hearing.

Yup...sure looks that way....another one bites the dust.

As I been saying, if we can't "police ourselves and be responsable...the states will do it for us..
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Take nothing but pictures, leave nothing but footprints.

I can't [bleep]ing believe it!!!
My understanding is that venomous snakes weren't banned in washington because if they escaped they wouldn't be able to survive.WHAT on earth inspired this bill to be authored in the first place?!?

Well...Have you seen all the BAD press Hot Herps have been getting?? All of the bites this year? None of these people had their own stock of Antivenom to save their own ASS. So then, some poor Zoo keeper gets to run back to the Zoo in the middle of the night because he has to send HIS (Zoo's) supply of Antivenom to save a life. Then he's out of luck if one of his staff member gets tagged and the Zoo's out of lots of money all because very few private keepers keep their own supply.

Do you really think the law makers would pass up a chance to pass a law that benefits nearly all of his voters but just a few snake lovers. The people in the state for the most part HATE Snakes especially the venomous ones. You think they are gonna stop them....NO WAY.

Your only hope is to convince them to enact a permit system like Florida, so responsible keepers can keep their collection.

Lets see; NY, LA, ND, WA in just less than 12 months...What state next?

Al

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Take nothing but pictures, leave nothing but footprints.

sounds like I better get one will I still can!:lol
I guess I haven't heard much bad press coming from washington.I wonder if there will still be an "venom underground" of hot herpers and breeders-sure hope so.

that hurts the hobby and I hope it was a joke. Maybe the correct path woulo be to organize something to try and fight the law. Like some good research on why it should not be illegal to keep venomous herps. Why the law is more of a nuisance than a correction. Why venomous snakes can be an advantage to society. Not "oh well, I better go get a venomous snake as soon as I can then" or I hope there is a good illegal market to support whatever I want. I am guessing that was a joke so I wont get on you at all...but dang, its sad to see that is probably what is going to happen.

So, when they ban hots in your state (wich they probably will), are you gonna get rid of your animals, or not get anymore? Are you all a bunch of puppets? Let them tell you what you can/can't keep...LOL. Go ahead & waste your time trying to fight laws, I'll take the easy route.

Later,
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Chad Bachman

Just so you know, Hots are illegal in my state. My hope is some day the laws may be reworked. Currently we have a restriction on snakes over 15ft. However, the dangerous animal may someday be passed over to DNR from department of ag. I have spoken to people about this and it may be possible to see a caging requirement in the future instead of an all out restriction. We luckily knocked down the proposed ban on species which regularly grow over 15 ft. It may not seem like much but it would be a start in the right direction. Maybe someday the laws can be reworked and a permit system could be possible. I have no idea. I do know I like to be looked at well by whatever depatment does hold enforcement of these laws. I would like to see us slowly come out of the deep hole we are in with laws, but I see no hope when each state is dropping in one by one. This is my choice to take some form of action in hopes to see a more fair regulation among all states.

Ok folks I stepped up to the plate and took a swing, now it's your turn. I sent this email to every sponsor of this Bill, use the link I provided.

Al

Dear Sir:

Although I don't live in your wonderful State that I am luck to visit periodically I would like to voice my thoughts on Bill 1151, specifically the section regarding Venomous Snakes.

I feel an all out ban would not be the best course of action, for the people that have them would keep them anyway and just drive the whole issue underground. Snake keepers feel like gun owners in a lot of ways, just because it will be illegal to have them does not mean they will abide by the law. Many laws across this great country are on the books but just not very enforceable, this one will have the same fate I feel. People will be willing to "Ride out" a snakebite and risk their own death to retain their collection.

Please take a look at the current regulation on the books in Florida, where regulation is the key to safe and responsable keeping of Venomous Snakes that benefits all that live in that great State.

I can also send you information of a Bill currently in the House in North Dakota that employs strict standards to keeping these animals. I feel regulation is more enforceable and certainly preferable to a ban which will just drive the issue underground and make no one safer.

Respectfully,

Al Coritz
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Take nothing but pictures, leave nothing but footprints.

I think people should send actual mail. It is pretty easy to deleat a few emails but very difficult to ignor hundreds of letters delivered to you. I would also like to point out we may wish to distiguish a line between us and gun keepers. Many gun keepers will use "a right to protection" as a crutch. While there is a personal benefit greater in keeping a gun, there are much more problems associated. We keep these animals for the love of nature and an extreme passion to learn about these animals through controled and carefull "hands on interaction" (of course with tools as substitute for our actual hands). While certainly there are people who will "go underground"...is the message we wish to send out "we will do it anyway...and will break the law to do so"? I understand what you are saying but I think we should be very carefull when wording those issues. I am the president of the Illinois State Herpetological Society and I will be passing the concern about this law out on wednesday. If it is alright with you Al, may I use your letter and discuss the same issues I felt we should take caution around which I mentioned in this post? Feel free to voice anything anyone feels could be of concern in what I wrote as well.

Yes, I forgot to say that when I posted it...

Al
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Take nothing but pictures, leave nothing but footprints.

Did any of this help the NY ban?

I don't see it working, but good luck.
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Chad Bachman

Chicago stopped a large ban. It just took work and one of the largest herpetological societies working for it. I dont think New York tried even close to hard enough to stop that ban. Email Lori King ans ask her what it took to fight Chicagos proposed ban. Granted venomous was illegal under Illinois dangerous animal act, there were many of the same species and the large costrictors that were on the NY bill. They were nearly identical.

Can't work Chad if you don't try...Or would you rather go down without a fight?

Al
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Take nothing but pictures, leave nothing but footprints.

Good luck, I hope you can make some progress. The only problem with leading the charge is that you become the target.

Thats how I feel about it. If I am not one of the people trying to fight the laws, they have no idea what I keep.

I do wish everybody the best of luck trying to stop these rediculous laws, but I feel a permit system already in effect (before they even think about a ban) is the best, and maybe only chance of seeing things go our way.
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Chad Bachman

I just don't want authorities knowing I am one of the ones trying to stop a ban, that way they have no idea about what I keep, or where it's being kept. Seems like this is the way they want it, so thats the way they'll get it from me.

I wish you luck, but for me, I'll just be happy keeping what I keep without anybody knowing.

Good luck, and I do mean that.

Take care,
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Chad Bachman

Speaking of Bad Press, I have never heard of any stories about venomous snakes in private collections causing problems here in washington. Most of the problems with snakes here are with very large constrictors like the Burmese Python and other boids that grow to 10 feet or longer.Does anybody have any anecdotes of recent problems in WA?

Just making a note that should not be an action in any letter. That would only further fuel more restrictions and lead to bans on reptiles in general. yes, there are too many unqualified people with burmese pythons and other large constrictors...that is the pet store fault. A 20 foot snake sounds cool and when a pet store tells people how tame they are...makes it sound cooler. Until you have a 20 ft snake. Then python pete comes in to give even more bad press.