Reptile & Amphibian Forums

It's seems like some nice I've seen a few chocolate/brown phase mex mex pics here and I was wondering if they were baby's, juvi's, or adults.

Are these a new color morph/phase for the mex mex?

Wow, right now I know I am getting 1 more mexicana ssp to add to my collection this summer and it's very, very hard to choose my favorite because there's so many I like.
Thanks,
Uncloudy

.....and I too would love to see someone post a few pics of others, especially adults, but there just doesn't seem to be many around.

This is an '04 male, unfortunately I got to it after the breeder sold the parents and the remainder of the clutch. From what I have been told here in the forum, these were once common in the early days of mex mex captive breeding, not a new color morph, and have been nearly eliminated from captive breeding colonies in favor of the more popular gray animals. Matter of fact, the breeder of this male you see sold the parents for the very same reason. He chose to work with the popular "black phase" specimens from Ric Blair, once owned and developed by Kim's Colubrids. Personally, I think this brown phase is quite attractive and would love to see more interest and an effort to bring them back.

I certainly hope to preserve these "brown phase" mex mex through this male as best I can. I could sure use a good female or two to work with this male, but finding them is going to be tough. If people have no interest in buying them, no one will put the effort into breeding them and that is what I am seeing.

My '04 male.....

Nice shot of a beautiful snake. I like them too, but can't find any anywhere. You need to grow that one up and breed it to any color phase mexmex and see if the gene is dominant or codominant. If the babies all look grey then you will have to hold back a pair and breed them together, hopefully producing some brown offspring. If some are produced the gene is recessive. Sounds like a project.
Are you up to it? LOL
Thanks for the photo,
John Lassiter

Nice shot of a beautiful snake. I like them too, but can't find any anywhere. You need to grow that one up and breed it to any color phase mexmex and see if the gene is dominant or codominant. If the babies all look grey then you will have to hold back a pair and breed them together or back to the brown parent, hopefully producing some brown offspring. If some are produced the gene is recessive. Sounds like a project.
Are you up to it? LOL
Thanks for the photo,
John Lassiter

Hey John... thanks for the compliment on this guy, wish I could take credit for producing him and sorry for the delayed reply, had to get some sleep. I start my day for the real job at 3am.

These things are almost impossible to find, but it is good to hear that others of us have interest. I know they are out there, there were sibs to this male that also had the tan/brown ground color and they were produced from dark gray parents. I hope for two things to happen... the new owner of the breeders that produced this male to produce more this year and come forward with them and, the owners of the sibs to him end up being breeders and put some out there for us.

Regardless, I do plan to use your approach to producing from this male and I am certainly up to the task! If I am successful in producing more, I hope to trade/loan these things around so that we can get them established again. I am hoping that this trait is dominant or codominant and I have reason to believe it is, on close inspection of many I have seen(even your dark phase), I can see hints of this brown coloration. Yours has it on the dorsal between the saddles and hints of it down the sides, especially towards the tail? Sure looks like it to me.

Would you be interested in using this male at some point to help me out? He should be ready to produce in two years.

Mike

Mike, I would be glad to help you out with those. I am a huge fan of Mexmex and would like all kinds. I even hear of some white ones out in California, but I will have to follow up on that. I will probably get some speckled ones this year from a friend. I will keep you guys posted on those as well.
And I do see some brown in my Dark Phase Mexmex. Keep me posted on your male's progress. Drop me an email whenever you get a chance.
John Lassiter

Makisfree,
Great shot of your brown phase and I can't wait to see more pictures as it get bigger.
It really is sad there aren't more brown phase around.
So from what you posted I must assume the brown phase is a naturally occuring form of mex mex. Hopefully in the future we will see more of them and I think it's a good possibility especially if the mexicana ssp. grows in popularity others will be seeking them out. Follow John Lassiter's advice and hopefully we can get and see more in the hobby.
You did get me interested in something else, the black phase. I have never see a black phase mex mex is it all black or black with saddles. Can you post a link to where I could see some pics. Thanks for the reply and nice post.
Uncloudy

These are my favorite along with the splitbanded specimens.
John Lassiter
Thanks for looking....

Also,
Those wanting to see other Dark Phase Mexmex can check out Ric Blair's website. He has Kims' Colubrids breeding stock. They are awesome and worth a look.
John Lassiter

I was told by many people that Ric Blair had Kim's Dark phase Mex mex. After speaking with him I was mis-informed. Ric got his Black Mex mex from a breeder by the name of Matt Smith.
I do not know where Kim's Dark Mexmex went since I was for certain Ric Blair had them but he doesn't.

If you look at Ric's hatchling pics on his website they have that "brown" coloration as well. Since I have seen many adult dark phase and NO hatchling that are black. I am beginning to think that these brown Mexmex are just juvenile Dark phase Mexmex.

What do you guys think?
John Lassiter

.

...I will certainly post more shots of this guy as he matures.

I agree, it's sad these fine animals have become rare in the hobby but for one, I am serious about bringing them back strong if at all possible. I am still learning about these things as I am relatively new to mex mex, but I am told this is a naturally occuring color trait. I will be following John's advice on producing these, and as I mentioned to him I will be looking for other serious breeders that might want to use this male. A couple of seasons of loaning him out and we should have a good breeding base to work with. Interested?

Here is a link to Ric Blair's site with the great pics of the dark or "black" phase mex mex.....

http://www.ricblairreptiles.com/