Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Well I ordered the nutriback as I was informed in the post below for the female that had the diareaha!But yesterday she took a turn for the worse!It had been over a week since her last bowl movement an everything actually looked back to normal!An she ate 1 large rat the night before an I thought Kool,I am out of the woods!WRONG WAS i ever!Cause yesterday she did the same thing!She weighs in at 21 lbs so yesterday she got started on 2cc's of baytrill every other day!I was also advised about Flagill an I have no experience at all with!Panacure was also mentioned to give her but I dont have no knowladge at all!Was told that safeguard is the same thing that also comes in a paste but I don't know how much too use or weather I shopuld just order the flagill from bean farm!I definatley moved her clear away from the rest of the collection yesterday an I am glad because she did regurge the rat this morning that she ate 2 days ago!I understand that she dont need to be offered anything else to eat for about 2 or 3 weeks!But I dont figure she would eat anyway on the antibiotic!I am keeping her temps an a 85 to 87 degree ambiant air temp an a 91 to 95 dgree hot spot!I am very worried about her,She is a normal bci but I still love her the same an if I can get her threw this then thats what I want to do,She has had enough bad treatment in life before I got her an I am pissed at myself for her getting into this kind of shape!I just dont understand what I was doing wrong for her to get so sick!I watch my temps an humidity well I guess I make a bigger deal about that than what I need to from what I have been told!How could she get so sick when I watch my temps an everything!Heck I take better care of my boa's than I do myself!Ive probably only ate 1 meal a day for the last month because I been so worried over getting the babies to eating an everything with their care!I know with my health problems I shouldntr be doing this but I love my boa's!Any info that anyone can help with or point me too for other things I should do it would be greatly appriciated!Thanks Eric
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E&C's Exotic House of Reptiles

OK I would not recomend flagil or panacure just yet. Have you takin her to the vet yet? If so have you done a fecal exam? I have not looked for any other post reguarding this snake so I dont know the whole picture yet. 2 to 3 weeks for feeding sounds about right after a regurge and to fill you in she probably would eat even though she is getting baytril, all the snakes I have treated with baytril would continue to eat even while being treated. I assume you got the baytril from the vet right? I have always given baytril on a daily basis (recomended by my vet)but I'm not vet so do what yours recomends. Regurges and the "runs" will make a boa dehydrated very quickly so keep some pedialite on hand. I had a female that would dump her water out as soon as I put it in her cage so after about a week she became very dehydrated in fact I came home from work and I thought she was dead it was really sad, I sould have given her a dish that she could not dump but I did'nt. After a 24 hour soak in pedalite and some down the hatch she was fine but to warn you, things can happen quick. If she is 21 lbs then she probably will not starve to death so I would lay off the feeding for a few weeks and maybe give some pedalite orally. (flavor,color,odorless) I donot have much experiance with nutribac but I do use it and it seems to do the trick and it is easy to use (mix in pedialite and down the hatch or inject into the next meal) As far as the deworming goes, I would wait to see what the fecal exam shows but if that is not possible then do what you must. Good luck
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True Redtails

>>OK I would not recomend flagil or panacure just yet. Have you takin her to the vet yet? If so have you done a fecal exam? I have not looked for any other post reguarding this snake so I dont know the whole picture yet. 2 to 3 weeks for feeding sounds about right after a regurge and to fill you in she probably would eat even though she is getting baytril, all the snakes I have treated with baytril would continue to eat even while being treated. I assume you got the baytril from the vet right? I have always given baytril on a daily basis (recomended by my vet)but I'm not vet so do what yours recomends. Regurges and the "runs" will make a boa dehydrated very quickly so keep some pedialite on hand. I had a female that would dump her water out as soon as I put it in her cage so after about a week she became very dehydrated in fact I came home from work and I thought she was dead it was really sad, I sould have given her a dish that she could not dump but I did'nt. After a 24 hour soak in pedalite and some down the hatch she was fine but to warn you, things can happen quick. If she is 21 lbs then she probably will not starve to death so I would lay off the feeding for a few weeks and maybe give some pedalite orally. (flavor,color,odorless) I donot have much experiance with nutribac but I do use it and it seems to do the trick and it is easy to use (mix in pedialite and down the hatch or inject into the next meal) As far as the deworming goes, I would wait to see what the fecal exam shows but if that is not possible then do what you must. Good luck
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>>True Redtails
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E&C's Exotic House of Reptiles

Just because some vets don't know how to take care of reptiles, let alone treat them, doesn't mean it is useless to seek out a vet that is more experienced with reptiles.
try www.arav.com or herpvetconnect

As far as using any of the mentioned medications without prior consultation with a veterinarian I strongly recommend against it.

It disgusts me that the bean farm sells dewormer like it was candy. I know it's only my opinion, but I believe it should be a prescription like anything else.

Hey Eric whats going on.... how did you with all the wonderful care that you give to your boas get a sick one? i thought you were only the one who fixed the boas and rescued them from an unsure future.....? Give me a call if there is something that i can help you with okay... keep in touch

Sincerely,
Rose Hipskind
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www.srsnakes.com

>>Hey Eric whats going on.... how did you with all the wonderful care that you give to your boas get a sick one? i thought you were only the one who fixed the boas and rescued them from an unsure future.....? Give me a call if there is something that i can help you with okay... keep in touch
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>>Sincerely,
>>Rose Hipskind
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>>www.srsnakes.com
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E&C's Exotic House of Reptiles

COULD HAVE A GLOGED TRACK DO TO TOO MUCH HAIR. THATS NOT FOR SURE BUT IT COULD BE.?

RUBEN MICHEL

>>COULD HAVE A GLOGED TRACK DO TO TOO MUCH HAIR. THATS NOT FOR SURE BUT IT COULD BE.?
>>
>>RUBEN MICHEL

Yea rubb it in bro!Believe me I know an it was a short haired guinee pig!I am pretty accurate when I say I have learnt my lesson on that one!Or as dumb as some think I am maybe I might try it a few more times!yea right!
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E&C's Exotic House of Reptiles

Go ahead and finish off the treatments with Baytril so you don't produce a bacterial resistance problem and then stop using it in this case. Baytril will have almost no effect on an intestinal bacterial infection if that is what the problem is. As stated in a previous post, have the vet run a fecal to determine if the diarrhea is parasitic in origin before starting with Flagyl or fenbendazole (Panacur). If no parasites are found, a broad spectrum oral antibiotic would be in order that is indicated for intestinal infections, Cipro would be a good one but let the vet determine that. Maintain strict quarantine procedures with this snake. Two other questions; how long have you had this boa, and are any other snakes in your collection showing signs of this. Thanks,

Kelly

I'm going to give you an arm-chair vets advice here but the diarrhea she's having is probably either a bacterial infection or coccidiosis, possibly both. I agree with Kelly that Baytril might not have been the most effective treatment. But I did have a boa that I bought last season that came with a weird stool(and other problems) that was fixed by Baytril- actually surprised me. However, I'm more inclined to think that this could be caused by a single celled parasite, coccidiosis. It'll require a fecal exam to diagnose, but results can be unconclusive as they will only test for coccidiosis while the parasite is shedding eggs. The treatment is Albon for several days and it does cause dehydration so be advised to keep fluids up. Animals of all types can carry coccidiosis without signs of infection but once they are stressed they start to show symptoms. Something to look into.
Good luck-
Matt Schubarth
Pet Nebula

it is very unusual to see regurgitations with coccidia infestations, unless it is extremely heavy or it involves cryptosporidia. That is why I suggested strict quarantine procedures until the cause is isolated, and asked how long he had this snake and if others had been showing any symptoms. Coccidia have direct life cycles and they can easily move through a collection if you are not extremely careful. As Matt stated, coccidia oocysts can sometimes be difficult to find, especially with cryptosporidia because theirs are very small. Care must also be taken diagnosing coccidiosis as sometimes a snake can be passing large numbers of secondary oocysts from mammalian prey items that will not be able to survive in a reptile. This is fairly common when using rabbits for feeders. Matt is also correct in that Albon is the drug of choice except in cases of cryptosporidia.

Kelly

>>it is very unusual to see regurgitations with coccidia infestations, unless it is extremely heavy or it involves cryptosporidia. That is why I suggested strict quarantine procedures until the cause is isolated, and asked how long he had this snake and if others had been showing any symptoms. Coccidia have direct life cycles and they can easily move through a collection if you are not extremely careful. As Matt stated, coccidia oocysts can sometimes be difficult to find, especially with cryptosporidia because theirs are very small. Care must also be taken diagnosing coccidiosis as sometimes a snake can be passing large numbers of secondary oocysts from mammalian prey items that will not be able to survive in a reptile. This is fairly common when using rabbits for feeders. Matt is also correct in that Albon is the drug of choice except in cases of cryptosporidia.
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>>Kelly

I have had her for about 4 an a half months now an she was very under weight when I got her but she ate fine an put on the weight fast!She is definatley on the opposite side of the house away from the whole collection!An the male that was in with her before she started dong this is showing no sign of any of these symptoms period!I still wander if their may have been somthing wrong with the guinnee pig?An vets in my area are not reptile vets so I am basically at a loss!They will try to treat a ri infection but no more than that as that was what I was told!Thats why I asked about the dosage of panacure!Another question is how many miligrams od baytril to kilograms of bogy weight is a good amount?Thanks for helping!Eric
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E&C's Exotic House of Reptiles

"I still wander if their may have been somthing wrong with the guinnee pig?An vets in my area are not reptile vets so I am basically at a loss!They will try to treat a ri infection but no more than that as that was what I was told!"

Eric.... I strongly suggest you try to find a reptile vet somewhere in a driveable area around you.

I marvel at the number of posts where people write about having no good reptile vets in "their area". Those statements always make me think - well then, find one OUT of your area. If you or Cammie got sick or injured and there were no Doctors or hospitals in your area, wouldn't you drive to where-ever for treatment? I would, and it is no different for my snakes.

I live in a small mountain town in the middle of nowhere. We have 3 vets here, that do dogs, cats, horses and cattle. None of them are equipped to handle real equine crisis situations. We horse owners cringe when we think about needing one in the middle of the night, or on the weekends. None of them like each other and they do not rotate the off hours. A horse can get sick and die....RIGHT NOW. We all keep horse pain meds and tranquilizers on hand, load up and go to Reno for emergencies. I have driven as far as the Sacramento area once when one of my mares was injured - - - that is 4 hours from me.

My snake vet is in Reno as well. Reno is 85 miles from me - one way. I would drive it in a heartbeat in an emergency. I drive it for normal appointments. I would drive as far as I needed, to a good vet. So when I hear people say they can't find a good vet "in their area", they just need to keep on looking OUT of their area!!

If you locate one or two "out of area" vets now, then when you really need one, there won't be such a panic and you'll be able to know who to call and where they are. Even better, schedule a regular appointment with one now (like with your current sick boa) and get set up as a client before one of those emergencies crop up.
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Linda Hedgpeth
lindafh@frontiernet.net
Sierra Serpents

"...and God took a handful of southerly wind, blew his breath over it and created the horse..."

Coccidia ive seen it in dogs alot ,and it's a single celled parasite,that feeds on the inner walls mainly intestanal in its host most of the animals that have this,will have blood in there stool, and its easy to get rid of but will hang around in the host sometimes for years,ablon will clean this out but so will baytil,,,,,,,,,best thing to do is not feed that animal for alittle longer maybe it has a very upset stomach and feeding it and adding meds is just making it worse,,,sorry if this is hard to read i had a ruff night,,,Greg