Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Down below, the originator of this so called black pearl posted. He mentions that his Costa Ricans were imported over 15 years ago. I will check to see if exporting from Costa Rica occured then.

He also mentions a question, are BABY leopards as dark as the black pearl. As far as I know, new borns have more gray silver color, and darken after the first few sheds. Can someone enlighten me to this? His "Black Pearls" are BLACK at new borns!

HMM!

If indeed everything is true as stated by the producer, we may have a trait like the leopard exhibited in another population. Like Motleys appearing in C.A., Colombian, and Argentine boas.

"As far as I know, new borns have more gray silver color, and darken after the first few sheds. Can someone enlighten me to this?"

Out of curiousity, what are you basing this on to begin with? There's only a couple people in this country that can tell you exactly what they look like at an hour old! That might be why he's not getting a lot of answers on how dark they may or may not be as NEWBORNS. The best place for that answer would be Hans W. As far as them being imported, you said you got yours from a company in Costa Rica that CAN export them....who's to say he's not a customer as well? Possibly at the time he states, there was another company that was able to do this as well, if they were not being exported then to begin with. Your going to have to do a lot of research to be able to prove he didn't export them from Costa Rica. Whether it's worth it or not is up to you! In his words, he basically said the only difference between "black pearls" and "leopards" is that his parental stock are Costa Rican, not Sonorans. If it looks like a duck........LOL, good luck proving his lineage. Take care

Paul

The pictures of new born/baby Leopards I saw were from Vincent Russo. He has one posted on his site, the baby is grey and silver, mostly.

I know there was exportation from Costa Rica a while back, Gus Rentfo has been working with them. I did not get mine from a company, they are from a Serpentarium in Grecia by origin, the same location Rich Ihle and Brandon of Summit Reptiles got their Sabogae from. He was the only person granted permission to collect both types of boa constrictor.

I was not looking for an argueement, just curious about the supposed new morph.

As you and everyone know many times there is disscrepancy as to origin of animals, I am only looking for answers.

No arguement at all! Just one animal in a picture isn't a good basis to gain an overall opinion on them. And you have to remember people will read a post and gain an opinion and if they trust your word, they're going to pass on the same opinion. Check out the classifieds and look at the pics of Russ L. leopards for sale...fairly black and if lumped together in an out of focus pic, would look very black. As far as not getting yours from a "company", I would call a "serpentarium" a company/business. I'm sure they're making money. I really don't even think this is worth wasting your time on...unless your planning on buying some "black pearls" from the guy instead of leopards from someone else, why waste your energy? If someone wants to pay more for the same thing, let em'! If he's even asking more?? Again, if you want to do the work, that's your call, and you can do anything you want! Take care

Paul

I appreciate your understanding.

I am interested in getting these. Being that I work with Costa Ricans it would be nice to introduce a pure blood genetic mutation into my group in the future.

Also, the reason I asked for opinions from leopard breeders is I would like to see more than one example to make a basis on.

I have been talking to Russ the last few days. The leopards he has were produced summer '04 by Hans. Since they have already gotten the traditional darker color they aren't exactly a prime example.

But, how old is Vins in the picture? They are really variable. My female hasn't gotten darker at all, rather she is lightening up as she ages. She's an 03' and not NEAR as dark as the ones Russ has for sale now. Really, going by a pic of one or 10 even, doesn't really show how variable the leopards can be. I'd definitely ask for better pics from that guy if your interested in that line. Maybe a pic side by side with a normal for better color comparison. Check out some pics on Hans site as well if you haven't already...some are gray with nice pinks, like the one Vin shows I believe(If I'm thinking of the right pic...the one in Reptiles magazine was pretty gray/pink). None of mine have ever been gray like that. Well, I hope they end up being pure Costa Rican for your projects. If anything, I think it's like your afterthought above...same morph, different locale. Oh yeah, for the BEST Leopard answers just contact Hans, he will reply to you and he will know better than anybody. Take care!

Paul

I talke to Hans a while back. He sent me 35 pictures, and all i asked was when his '05 babies were going to be born.

I think the picture from Vin was the one in Reptiles mag.

Maybe he was saying..."Don't know, but you can buy one of these!" LOL, Hans is a good guy! Take care

Paul

Does it really matter? If people like them they will buy them, if they think their leopards or not. Dude, do you work for the F.B.I. ?

James W. Arnold

No I do not work for the F.B.I., lol.

I like to know origins of morphs, I try to understand the background of the many awesome boas out there. Being that I know work with a verifiable group of Costa Ricans I would love to work with genetic mutations of the same locale!

I am just curious if these are Costa Rican or Sonoran, and whichever, if they are a mutation of identical genotype to the Leopard (Mephisto as its original name) morph or if this is a trait of simply similar phenotype.

Mephisto boa! Were they produced first? I know Hans had some, and a woman, I believe, had some around the same time and called them "Mephisto" boas. That info hasn't been talked about in so long, I don't remember the hole story. I can't remember who was first in any case, but it's funny to see that brought up again after such a long time. Atleast your doing your homework(hence the FBI comment, I'm guessing-LOL) Maybe a career change??? LOL, take care

Paul

Future career if interested, actually debateing law or aerospace engineering. I am 16. Although my dad is a PA State Trooper, and ex Special Forces leiutenent (had a family)

I do not know where the first was produced, the Mephisto may have been the other name, not given by Hans. It would make sense, being that the majority of the Leopards in the U.S. came from Hans, and what he called them is probably what stuck. He emailed me the original description he made after first proveing them genetic. Hans made refference to the "wiskers" of a leopard they had on their heads, and the "spots" like a leopard.

We don't need any more lawyers-LOL! Go with choice B. Hey, your dads not strict by any chance is he-ha! I remember how old ya are, you told me a while back! I bet you can't get away with much at home. Your going to get into college and go nuts, binge drinking, chasing the ladies, and we'll be seeing you selling rubber snakes to kids at the Daytona expo ten years from now! LMAO, J/K! Take care

Paul

Yeah my parents are pretty strict. Just keep up the grades, and be good at home, and everything is okay for them. (Everything else stays with me, lol).

"His "Black Pearls" are BLACK at new borns!"

We saw the pic he took at whatever age...you could see pattern. The only baby boa that is BLACK at birth, and BLACK after a few sheds, and STILL BLACK to this day is the BLACK BOA that Alex B.(Boa Republic) produced from the C.A. Motleys! Now, THAT is a BLACK BOA...a true "pearl"!

I honestly do not know why you are targeting me. There is slight pattern in the black pearl babies, but I am saying that they are black as a base color.

I am fully aware of Alex's C.A. Super Motley, the Black Patternless. What does this have to do with what the "black pearls" look like as babies.

YOUR NOT BEING TARGETED!!! The "black pearl" has pattern, it's easy to see even in the BAD pics of them. If I took a close up of one of my leopards I could make it look jet black as well. Those that have leopards say they look like leopards. We have leopards to look at in person to make that comparison. If there is something vastly different about these, he's going to have to prove it somehow. If you look closely at the pics of the litter on his website you can even see the tail pattern/color which looks just like a leopard(wonder why?) The mention of Alex's BLACK BOA is because at this point, it is the ONLY...BLACK BOA! So, if someone really likes the concept of BLACK BOAS, they need to look at buying a pair of C.A. Motleys and producing some, or wait until someone is selling BLACK BOAS from their C.A. Motleys. Why are people getting all excited about a controversial "morph" when we already have a BLACK BOA that is exactly as named-BLACK!

I think people are getting controversial, becuase these are so much like the leopards. Possibly identical. And with the notion that it is a new morph, and a rare locale, people want to know the truth and gather opinions to make a logical assumtion, at least i do.

If you look at my posts below on the Black Pearls, the first thing I thought was, it isn't new, someone else just had a litter of Leopards.

nm

First, I have to resolve a misunderstanding. I'm the owner of the adult animals and the producer of the Black Pearl Boas. My friend Matt (he posted the first infos) got the informations about the parents and their origin from me. These informations are true!
Together, we produced the first hets in 2004. His posting was just an information about the color and pattern morph we called Black Pearl, because they are black and white - not patternless black.

Pictures of the new borns of 2004 (Black Pearls before and after the first shedding and hets), 6 month old and adult boas are on my website www.boanet.de

I will take more pictures of the babys and their parents and publish them soon on my website.

Let me please advance an opinion about the discussion to the leopards: the genetic reason for the color- and pattern morph could be the same - I don't know. I have got the Boas from Costa Rica Boas (imported more than 15 years ago), leopards were bred by H-J. Winner from mexicana (Sonora) boas.

Gero
boanet.de

Thank you for imputing your information.

I would appreciate any validation you can provide toward the origin of your animal, like C.I.T.E.S. documents and/or reciepts.
I am not saying they are not Costa Rican, I just want to know as much as I can about their background. Also, where did they come from, the name of collecter, zoo, whatever.

Thanks!

I have got these informations, but I wont publish them. Business secret. Sorry, but I know, you will understand it!

Gero
boanet.de

n/p