Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Has Anyone Produced A Hybino (Albino Hypo) Albino x Hypo yet or is anyone working on this project yet. Thanks Scott Glover

I don't think any have been produced yet. I haven't heard of any or seen any for sale.

Mike
Michael's Place

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I wonder why no one has produced a hybino cal king yet. The hybino cal king would probably look nice what do you think. Thanks Scott Glover

Show me a picture of a "hypo" cal king.

I've seen LOTS of them advertised on kingsnake classifieds, and have yet to see a picture of one. Lots of pictures of cal kings that are called hypo.... but aren't.

I've got hypo Desert Kings (simple recessive gene). And since they are very similar in color combinations, a cal king that is "hypo" ought to look like them. Desert Kings and Cal Kings naturally breed in the wild here in Arizona. I also have het (albino) Desert Kings and in a few years I will have Albino Hypos (Hybinos).

Maybe next year I will breed my Desert Kings into my Cal Kings, a natural occuring range in Arizona.

Kerby...

I will see if I can find a pic of one. Thanks Scott Glover

Ok, I found a pic. Go to KS photo gallery click user name and put in silverwing and there are 2 pics go to the last one. Thanks Scott Glover

That is NOT a hypo cal king. I've produced numerous ones like that, they change as they get older. A LOT of baby cal kings have that "hypo" look as they hatch.

Also his info is totally wrong. He says that the father is an albino and the mother is a hypo, and that all the babies are albino and hypo. That is totally wrong in genetics 101. "IF" the father is an albino and the mother is a hypo, then ALL THE BABIES WOULD BE NORMAL LOOKING and be double hets (albino & hypo). Breeding these babies back to each other will produce albinos, hypos, normals, normals that hets, and 1/16 will be an albino hypo (hybino).

I would still like to see a picture of a "hypo" cal king that is genetically proven and not "hypo" looking. I've produced numerous "hypo" looking cal kings, but I dare not call them something that isn't.

Kerby...

>>That is NOT a hypo cal king. I've produced numerous ones like that, they change as they get older. A LOT of baby cal kings have that "hypo" look as they hatch.
>>
>>... He says that the father is an albino and the mother is a hypo, and that all the babies are albino and hypo.

then if someone asks the person to post a picture of the mother, THAT would be a pic of a hypo, right? (adult, looks hypo, etc) OR it would be the picture to refute. Can someone ask the owner to post such a pic?

terry

My opinion is that the Merker line of Cal Kings are true hypos. I do think hypo is difficult to prove in Cal Kings though because the natural chocolate phases look so similar. I have 2.1 from Gerold Merker and they are adults now and have not changed color. They look like wax. They are in hibernation now but I will post pics in a few days although the pics never seem to show their subtle colors. Or check out Gerald and Cindy Merkers website here in the breeders/dealers section.

So are we referring to Blue-eyed Blondes as hypo?

Kerby...

My opinion about the Blue-Eyed Blonds is that they are a different strain of Lavender. I guess they could also be considered hypo since the melanin appears reduced.

So what is the difference between those on his site and other brown and white cal kings?

And what would you call the "Ghost" cal kings that B.H.B. sells?

Thanks

Kerby...

Want is a ghost cal. king produce from???????????? I don't know were any pics of adult hypo cal. kings are. Thanks Scott Glover

Kerby...

Kerby...

Kerby...

Thanks for the pics kerby, Is ghost simple recvee gene??????????? It looks like the ghost should be a hypo looks like what do you think??????????. Thanks Scott Glover

Not sure if Ghost is appropriate, hypo does seem more descriptive, but I was going by what Briam from B.H.B. had stated.

It is a simple recessive gene.

I will eventually breed it to a Mendota or Davis to see if it is separate from them.

Still lots to figure out in Cal Kings.

Kerby...

And I do think it looks like a hypo to me to. I would cross a ghost into a high-white line or a lavender albino line.
How many kingsnakes do you breed. About a week ago I posted about my female california kingsnakes and what there weights where know since a feed them the big female weighs 150gs and the smaller female weighs 110gs do you think they will be redy to breed next season, And two more questions is a lavender albino cal. king a blonde cal. king??????????????????????????????? and if I breed my lavender albino male to my aberrant 100% het. albino female ( my female is not het. for lav. albino) what do you think it will produce???????????????????????.
Thanks Scott Glover

**And I do think it looks like a hypo to me to. I would cross a ghost into a high-white line or a lavender albino line.**

It's a numbers game, I do not have 20 females of everything (LOL), so I will eventually breed every combo possible from the cal kings that I do have.

**How many kingsnakes do you breed.**

Haven't counted but I have around 80 California Kingsnakes that are either breeders or future breeders. I have around 100 counting Corns, etc.. Then I have some wild-caught snakes that aren't for sale. I produce around 400-500 babies per year, but this year I am trying to reduce that number.

**About a week ago I posted about my female california kingsnakes and what there weights where know since a feed them the big female weighs 150gs and the smaller female weighs 110gs do you think they will be redy to breed next season,**

The bigger female might be, I would wait on the smaller one.

**And two more questions is a lavender albino cal. king a blonde cal. king???????????????????????????????**

I believe they might be. The only sure way to find out is to breed a Lavender to a Blue-eyed Blonde.

**and if I breed my lavender albino male to my aberrant 100% het. albino female ( my female is not het. for lav. albino) what do you think it will produce???????????????????????.**

If you breed a Lavender to a het albino, the babies will be normal looking (except for the aberrancies), they will be 100% het for Lavender and some will be het for albinism. You won't know which ones will be het for albinism until they are proven through breeding.

Kerby...

Thanks Kerby, I am starting to breed my own mice and rats now my female mice just had babies about 3-4 days ago, I am trying to get my male lavender albino to breeding size by next season and I am trying to get my females up to breeding size next season do you breed your own mice and rats????. Thanks Again Kerby, Scott Glover

Yes, I do breed my own rodents (mice and rats), about 1,500 to 2,000 per month when all my colonies are at peak performance

Otherwise, around 1,000 - 1,500 per month. I breed mostly mice but do rats as well. I sell off the excess and that pays for all the rodent bedding and rodent food plus I make some chump change in the process. I change cages one day a week and feed my snakes on the same day. Sometimes I feed my females 2x a week. I do not have any large snakes (exotics) so most of my rats get fed off as rat pups. During the winter I raise my rats to medium (100-199 grams) size and sell them at that size.

I first started off with white mice and have introduced so many fancy mice that I have very few white mice. Every couple of years I will trade male mice with other breeders to break up the gene pool.

I also feed mostly live and have since 1990. I thump the adult mice before they go into the snake's cage. Still fresh, still alive and twitching, but no harm to the snake. Never had an accident.

"Mice, it's what's for dinner"

Kerby...

WOW 1,500-2,000 mice per month I will only have about 20-50 mice per month and about 20-30 rats per month why I breed rats is because first I have ball pythons that need feed rats and second is because my female is a rare silver rat, there is only about 150-250 silver rats produced each year. Thanks Again Kerby, Scott Glover

.

But it is a double het (Lavender & Albino), so I know it isn't a hypo. Different looking though.

Kerby...

That thing is excellent looking! Real sharp Kerby Tom Stevens

Only this a product of breeding a Newport (het albino) to a Mendota (melanistic). Two came out looking different.

But I wouldn't call them hypo. They will be just some nice light looking brown and white cal kings that are 100% het for melanism and possible het for albinism.

Dar, another future project! LOL

Kerby...

You drink Folgers? Good stuff LOL Tom Stevens
if you have no idea what I mean I will let you know....

I do drink Folgers ONLY, plus the new plastic containers make great egg containers LOL

Kerby...

LOL I recognized the can.........just messin around with ya. That stuff kicks ass but ask JOhn Lassiter, my coffee is made in industrial strength doses, one cup and you're flyin! LOL ttyl Tom Stevens

OH YEAH!!!! 1 cup is all you need.....LOL!!
Tom.....I think you should try reading the label on the can for appropriate measurements.......LOL!!
Can you O.D. on caffeine????????????

John Lassiter

Striped male Blue Eyed Blonde calking from Vivid Reptiles:

I like to cut my coffee with a knife and fork and sometimes put it on an english muffin like jelley LMAO! Tom Stevens

Thanks For The Pic John, That looks the same as my lavender albino male the brown on him is a little lighter and the yellow is a little more lighter to will my cal. king get darker as he grows??????????. Thanks Again Scott Glover

Some lavenders look much like an amelanistic as an adult. Some keep their lavender colors into adulthood.
As for blue eyed blondes.....the banded female specimens look much better than than striped specimens or males....just an observation not fact....
John Lassiter

That doe's look like a hypo looking cal. king. Nice Pic Kerby, Scott Glover

Every year - something different.

Christmas - every summer!

Patience..............

Kerby...

Well I think they look "waxy". I have caught brown Cal Kings in Carlsbad and Santa Maria where both places produce dark and light phases and the Merkers just look different.
How would one go about test breeding for hypo with Cal Kings? Say you have a potential hypo coastal cal king and bred it to a desert and got some light babies that wouldn't prove anything since even breeding a dark coastal phase to a desert could potentially produce some babies that were lighter than both parents.

**How would one go about test breeding for hypo with Cal Kings?**

I would take the hypo and breed it to a darker looking cal king from the same area, like the picture Merker has on his site. Because he is insinuating that the lighter one is hypo (otherwise it would be dark like his comparison). If his theory is correct, then all of the babies will come out dark and be het for hypo. If you get a mixture of both light and dark in the same clutch first time around, then it isn't hypo. If they all come out dark then odds are it is a hypo recessive gene and can be proven by breeding back:

het x het
het x hypo

and be able to prove if that hypo is genetic (recessive).

Of course I could have proven all this already if Merker would have returned my e-mails 2 years ago, and Scott's e-mail, and at least 2 other people's e-mails from this forum. I guess he just doesn't want to sell to me or to certain other people who are interested in Cal Kings. At least a courtesy e-mail back would have been nice. I also e-mailed him last year on his Blue-eyed Blondes and he never responded.

Guess I will just have to wait and buy them from someone else who has bought from him. I just want to make sure 100% that I am purchasing Merker stock to prove or disporve my theory.

Kerby...

**How would one go about test breeding for hypo with Cal Kings?**

I would take the hypo and breed it to a darker looking cal king from the same area, like the picture Merker has on his site. Because he is insinuating that the lighter one is hypo (otherwise it would be dark like his comparison). If his theory is correct, then all of the babies will come out dark and be het for hypo. If you get a mixture of both light and dark in the same clutch first time around, then it isn't hypo. If they all come out dark then odds are it is a hypo recessive gene and can be proven by breeding back:

het x het
het x hypo

and be able to prove if that hypo is genetic (recessive).

>>>I can think of two things that could confuse that method. One if the population, like most coastal populations I have seen contains both dark and light normals then any dark phase could throw light babies that were not hypo. I think this would be possible when breeding to a dark generic as well since there could be chocolate somewhere in the background. The second is if you were using a wc dark phase from the same area the normal could be a het and you would get hypos in the first generation.
Another thing is that if there were dark and light phases in the original locality the actual hypo could have genes for dark phase and light phase while still being a hypo and throw light phase babies no matter what it was bred to.
Of course Gerald is more familiar with the wild kings in that area and maybe there are all dark phases there and that's how he knows they are hypo.

Of course I could have proven all this already if Merker would have returned my e-mails 2 years ago, and Scott's e-mail, and at least 2 other people's e-mails from this forum. I guess he just doesn't want to sell to me or to certain other people who are interested in Cal Kings. At least a courtesy e-mail back would have been nice. I also e-mailed him last year on his Blue-eyed Blondes and he never responded.

Guess I will just have to wait and buy them from someone else who has bought from him. I just want to make sure 100% that I am purchasing Merker stock to prove or disporve my theory.

>>>Wow that seems very uncharacteristic of Gerald. I do know that he did not produce any last year. I think prior to that he only had 1.1 ancient pair of breeders and I don't think he had any holdbacks. I think he lost the female last year too. I agree though a courtesy email would have been appropriate.

>>>As far as the BHB Ghosts I think there is a chance they are hypo but definatly a pattern mutation everybody I ever talked to said it was inheritable.

If it is not hypo then a pair of hypos should occasionally throw dark phases as long as the pair is close to wild generation and has not been line bred.