Reptile & Amphibian Forums

He was so pretty and colorful half-way out of the egg.. (still is).. but was a result of too high incubation temps??? The old 'bator thermo went bad.. turned down all the way was still hovering at 32 C !! (not for long!!!) 2 out of 6 hatchlings have "abnorms" similar to this. From what I can figure was during the 100 - 120 days (of about 170?)into the incubation "cycle".. for these eggs in question.

He is now beginning to eat a little.. late compared to the rest.. and getting around much better; might even be straightening out some.

My new incubators are consistent at low 30 C.. now.

What am I dealing with here? Any feedback is most appreciated.

Terry

This is the hatchling from "Hatching Cherryhead" posted by Mayday.. about 4/01!

Thanks.. Terry

While this is just an educated guess, too high temps may cause more rapid growth. This increased the need to conserve room withen an egg that expands at a slower rate, and the spine is yet to be very calcified during this time, thus the spine-rib-shell structure has developed as such. An X-ray would be interesting to view, and may shed some light (pardon the pun) on any long term considerations.

Incubating a higher trmps during the fragile embryolical dvelopment stages results in these malformations. Commonly, temps at 88-90 F may result in an extra scute or two. But at temps higher, the abnorrmalities are more severe. It appears that your hatachlings have scoliosis or "crookedness" tp the vertebral column in addition to the scutes abnormalities. Tortoises with this much deformity will not likely do well long term as they develop poorly and commonly have failure to thrive. If they are able to eat, then they may due well, but the abnormalities are permenant. On the upside, these individuals tend to be females if they reach adulthood. Monitor those temperatures well cause this is what can happen.
Bvpham

I don't think the curvature is that severe (fwd 1/4 of the shell) In any other animal it might be a problem but in the case of a tortoise, I don't think it has as much, if any, impact.

>>Incubating a higher trmps during the fragile embryolical dvelopment stages results in these malformations. Commonly, temps at 88-90 F may result in an extra scute or two. But at temps higher, the abnorrmalities are more severe. It appears that your hatachlings have scoliosis or "crookedness" tp the vertebral column in addition to the scutes abnormalities. Tortoises with this much deformity will not likely do well long term as they develop poorly and commonly have failure to thrive. If they are able to eat, then they may due well, but the abnormalities are permenant. On the upside, these individuals tend to be females if they reach adulthood. Monitor those temperatures well cause this is what can happen.
>>Bvpham
>>
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Ed @ Tortoise Keepers
Trying to keep the fun in Chelonian care

"Tortoises with this much deformity will not likely do well long term as they develop poorly and commonly have failure to thrive. If they are able to eat, then they may due well, but the abnormalities are permenant. On the upside, these individuals tend to be females if they reach adulthood."

though this is a common belief in tort-dom, i do not find this to be the case for russian tortoises.

in my breeding colony 2 of 4 adult males have extra scutes (as ed said, very common in WC populations) all my adult females have perfect shells. of the 80+ hatchlings to date, only one "high" temp (31.5 degrees C.) female deformity compared with 7 low temp (29 degrees C.) male deformities.

all are doing very well. i've never seen any correlated health problems.

i believe your tort will thrive very well.

matt

I'll bet an xray would show that the spine is well formed with maybe a very slight curvature of the spine. If you look at the morphologhy of the shell you will see that the keretin is independent of the bone.

These animals can and usually do grow to be perfectly healthy animals. This condition is relatively common in WC populations.

>>While this is just an educated guess, too high temps may cause more rapid growth. This increased the need to conserve room withen an egg that expands at a slower rate, and the spine is yet to be very calcified during this time, thus the spine-rib-shell structure has developed as such. An X-ray would be interesting to view, and may shed some light (pardon the pun) on any long term considerations.
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Ed @ Tortoise Keepers
Trying to keep the fun in Chelonian care

I'm with you Ed!!!

She is now beginning to eat.. almost up to speed with the others.. and I just love those colors.. don't you?

Terry

Since it takes about 36 hours to emerge wants it "pips".. we have been concerned how this sibling was going to look. The light and humidity plays havoc on my camera sometimes - she looks O.K. so far.

Terry

Just about an hour after she looked like above pic I went out to check and see.. this is what I found YAAAAAHHHHH!!!

A perfect hatchling.. Oh the wonderful world of breeding Chelonians (go figure huh?)

Terry

nearly brings a tear to my eye, poor babies. they're still very beautiful, if this one is any indication of its "special" siblings. if they're eating and moving around, perhaps they can still enjoy long and healthy lives... i certainly hope so!