Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I am having such a problem with alegea growth in my fish tank enclosures for hatchlings-yearlings, I would assume this is being caused by the basking light as the alegea grows in the water were water meets land, but it also seems to like to grow on to the land in the basking area.

This alegea is such a PITA!! ... im going to SCRUB out these tanks and set up new land areas over the next couple of days, I was just looking for ideas to avoid this algea growth after its all done.

I have been using this same type type of fish tank set ups for small crocodilians for many many years, but I have never had a algea problem like this.

Im thinking maybe that I should try differant watt bulbs, differant brand bulbs, or differant spectrum ???

I use UV overhead lighting fixture and a metal clamp fixture as a basking light with normal 75 watt bulbs

Give me some ideas, other than $20.00 specialty basking light bulbs ???

Anyone else have this problem before and how did you resolve it ??

Hi,

I have had the same exact issue in the past. If the land area stays damp, then algae will grow on that as well. One of the things I noticed is that I was using zoo med bulbs before and the algae seemed to grow much more quickly. I used exo-terra's basking bulbs and it seemed that the algae didnt grow as quick, nor as thick. Unfortunately, I have not found a way to exactly resolve this issue with the bulb directly inside the tank. The UV is causing algae growth within the water. Changing the water every other day will help tremendously, but that is a pain as well. My issue didnt stop until I separated my water and land areas when my alligator got a bit too big for his current setup. But if the bulb is directly over the tank, it will help heat the water and the UV will cause algae growth constantly. I have not found a way around this. If anyone else happens to have a workaround, I would love to hear it as well.

Here are my suggestions for algae control/elimination
1) Clean out the aquarium with a bleach-water solution.
2) Replace your basking lamp with a CHE.
OR
3) For both indoor and outdoor enclosures I've had great success using chemical algaecides such as the ones found at http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/NavResults.cfm?N=2004 113000 "Algae Destroyer" works very well.

I agree that CHE's will eliminate algae growth due to no UV rays are given off (well atleast the ones I have dont). But dont crocodilians need the UV rays? I understand that they dont need as much as some other lizards, but at the same time I thought that they would still need the benefit of the UV rays? Just thought I would try to get a clear understanding of this.

Thnx

Crocodilians do not need UV light. Remember, crocodilians are more closely related to birds than to lizards.

I agree with John that crocodilians are closely related to birds,but as in the need for u.v. light,it is a must.Most animals on this planet need some amout of sunlight to maintain a healthy life.Including us humans.I'am not saying that a crocodilian can't survive without natural sunlight,but the animal needs u.v. light to live.One example is rickets.The main result of rickets is lack of vitamins,and sunshine.Another example is fibrous osteodystrophy which is a result of lack of calcium,and V-D3 which is through the sun.Besides a lot of crocodilians are laying out in the sun out in the wild.
Problem with your alage can be corrected with more frequent water changes.The nitrate levels in the water are too high.Another way is too decrease you light down to 8 hours a day.It is the same thing like a fish tank.If the nitrates are too high and there is a lot of light than you will have alage blooms.The only way to get rid of nitrates is to do complete water change or a partial water change.Crocodilians are going to put out 20 times the amount of waste product(ammonia) than 50lbs of fish.Just something to keep in mine.I have raised crocodilians for over 22 yrs and all the animals I have had that did well had u.v. light.The animals that did poorly had very little.Even my dwarf caiman,and dwarf crocodile receive it.All this that I'am saying is for you to take into consideration.
Good Luck
Mike Talka

Mike makes a good point. The key is the nutrition. Bear in mind that there are alligator farmers who raise alligators that never see the light of day -- sunshine or artificial source UV rays -- to ensure premuim hides undamaged by the sun. How do they do this? Proper nutrition.
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Israel Dupont
Winter Haven, FL

...Of course the long-term health of those gators is not of concern in that situation.

For what it's worth, I don't believe sunshine is critical to physical health of carnivores that are being fed properly and are kept a proper temperatures. I think a lot of crocodilians in captivity never get to reach optimum body temperatures, nor do they have as many options for controlling those internal temps. Basking in natural sunlight is great for that. I think the benefits of natural light may be more of a psycological nature.

Bill

We should all keep in mind that the vast majority of crocodilian husbandry research has been geared toward producing the highest quality hide in the shortest time for the least amount of money. With this in mind, the Croc FAQ sums up the light issue nicely: http://crocodilian.com/crocfaq/faq-4.html#5.3.2

that depending on what crocodilian you own will determine the overall effects (negative, positive, or neutral) that UV light takes on the animal? According to the crocodilian FAQ, as mentioned before, certain animals are mainly only out at night. Therefore they will not benefit much from UV wavelength. However, an animal such as an american alligator who is a day hunter and is frequently basking under the sun, UV wavelengths would be necessary and beneficial. Would this assumption be correct?

To my knowledge there is no published scientific data that states UV light is required by American alligators.
If anyone has a scientific reference stating otherwise please post it.

I think one can assume that reasonable amounts of UV won't harm alligators and that it may possibly be beneficial.

I tend to agree with Bill here. I think the sun is more important in terms of heat than UV wavelengths. I have raised more than 1 species both ways and can't say there was a noticable difference in health either way.

Personally I prefer to give the sunlight for financial reasons. The sun is free and electricity isn't.
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CDieter
'Reason, observation, and experience; the holy trinity of science.'

what about for those who cannot benefit much from the sun? Being in Ohio, it is much colder here and I cannot offer a year 'round outdoor setup (unless I want him to die of course). So are basking bulbs that are offered for reptiles sufficient? or unnecessary? During summer months I do have an outdoor setup for him as shown in some pictures in some other threads. But this will not be beneficial for him during the winter. Would the sun that he does get during the summer months be able to suffice until the next year while just using standard basking bulbs?

The point is (for those who don't believe UV to be a critical requirement) that the animal needs to reach approx 88 deg F. at the core to be at "optimum body temperature". This is the temperature where metabolism and other body systems are running at peak efficiency. Whether this is achieved via basking lights or natural sunlight is not of utmost importance (IMO).

The important thing in an artifially created environment, whether using sunlight or artifical light as a heat source, is that the animal can still make choices in order to regulate it's body temp where it needs it to be. For example, if the animal is ill, or injured, it may need it's temperatures elevated past normal OBT. It should have that option built in to whatever evironment is created.

Certainly UV bulbs and natural sunlight will not hurt (sunlight obviously), but whether or not they are *necessary* is open to discussion.

Bill

Bill,

Thanks for making that more understandable. I figure I will just continue to use the bulbs because they seem to be more beneficial than not. Thanks again!!

Much like you would leave a window open for indoor plants, would that be sufficient enough for crocodilians? If a CHE was used to heat the area for the crocodilian, and a window was left open during the day (or if this was a greenhouse,type setup) would the light coming in from the windows be sufficient for providing any UV light they may need?

If you are referring to windows as closed windows with sunlight/UV rays going through them, keep in mind that glass filters out the beneficial effects of UV rays.
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Israel Dupont
Winter Haven, FL

in essence, it would be great for natural light, but at the same time it would not be beneficial for UV reasons. Ok well then, how about this (here I go again), since this seems to be an argument between all of the pro's in here whether UV light is necessary or unnecessary, would a couple of lower watt basking bulbs...lets say... 150W... placed within the enclosure (pretending this is a larger animal inside of a larger indoor enclosure), would this be sufficient enough UV for the animal? Can the UV rays be spread out or is it best to have them more concentrated? Currently in my enclosure the lights are more concentrated due to the fact that he recieves his UV and full basking heat from those bulbs. I am interested to see how I would have to work out a large indoor enclosure for these purposes.

As always, I thank you for your time.

John,
Have you used these types of chemical algaecides such as "Algae Destroyer" in Crocodilian enclosures ??

I have looked at somilar products available at local Pet Shops, on these products the Warning Label made me decide not to use them as they all seem very high hazard levels, one even warned of cancer causing agents.

They seem only to "possibly" be safe for fish and I didnt want to risk the health or life of croc's

I've used chemical algaecides for several years in croc, turtle, fish and amphibian ponds and so far haven't noticed any negative side effects. If you feel uncomfortable using a strong algaecide, use one that is safe for amphibians. I've not used this specific product, but it looks pretty good: http://www.russellwatergardens.com/algae.htm

A "natural" approach is to use barley straw see: http://ianrpubs.unl.edu/wildlife/nf429.htm which in the past has worked fairly well. A somewhat "new" product (that I may try this year) is barley straw extract: http://www.improvementscatalog.com/home/improvements/27005-Barley-Straw-Extract.html