Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Goodmorning all!How's everyone today?For the last 2 years I know I made a big deal about Raindrop!An I was so worried about wether or not the babies were going to be abberant or not that I have overlooked 1 key factor in the litter of babies that I produced this year!!!!Yes I would have to say that their was some really nice abberencies in the litter an at least half the litter had some sort of deviants to the pattern but I am not really worried about that till more breeding trials have been done!Now to the main question!Everyone has seen an complimented on my litter,The 1 thing I have overlooked an have been afraid to bring up with all the debates going on about pastels,is the fact that half the litter an maybe more than half the litter is that daddies color was most definatley passed onto the babies!Now everyone knows that Raindrop definatley is not a pastel an that Bad was possibly one but with no background info on him he could NOT be called a pastel!I know their are plenty of high pink line bread boa's out their an then you have the Awsome Davey Pastels an then you have the Beautiful line of pastels from Jeff Ronnie!But is their an actuall proven codominent pastel?Or are these animals just so amazing that their coloration is just passed on into the litter like anything else that you breed?My point being is from the looks of these babies an seeing what daddy looked like as I raised him is that somthing is definatley being passed on!He will be bread to another unrelated female this fall to see if this happens again??Hopefully it will!An if it does pass on again what then?I have plans to breed him to a high pink nerd line female in the 3rd year of breeding him!I reckin the main question is[Is he a pastel or not?]After these breeding trials are finished that is?Is this a new co-dominent gene or not!Plus by the time he is going threw his 3rd breeding trial one of his high pink male offspring will also be old enough to produce a litter!This is not a debate to start a big arguement,it is me asking questions that I would like to hear other opinions on!Thanks for reading,Eric[Hypoboa]
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E&C's Exotic House of Reptiles

i am by no means an autority on any of this but you asked for opinions. to me they all look like nicely colored normals. but i would also suggest taking pictures that are more true to the color like outdoors without a flash.
aside from this if the male bred to another unrelated female produces young that show this look then i would have to say that it is a co dominent or dominent trait being passed on if it is in fact not a normal with good looks. pastels are not my thing so i may be bias on this subject. i would also have to say that if this is in fact a non normal trait that you would have to breed back an offspring to a parent to determine if the trait is co dominent or dominent as if it is co dominent then the resulting offspring would appear different (like super salmons often do). i appologize if i am confusing but i had written an explanation of genetics in the genetics forum the other day if this needs clarification.
none the less its all my opinion but they are however some pretty good looking snakes normals or not. final advice would be to put up some natural light pictures for better opinions.
good luck with it all

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There are no proven "codominant" pastels. A codominant pastel would mean there is a single gene controlling it ... therfore it is not a selectively bred trait ... it is a sporadic "freak of nature" trait.

Jeff Ronne's pastels are polygenic (controlled by mutliple genes) that were derived through selective breeding. He bred to reduce melanin, revealing color (etherin and xanthin).

As defined by Ronne himself, level of black determines what is and isnt a pastel (reds and yellows play no role in that regard).

The genetics behind Davey's pastels are somewhat unknown at this point. If I remember correctly half exhibited an increased yellow trait (hyper-xanthic?), half exhibited lateral striping and nearly all were reduced enough in the way of black to be deemed pastel in my opinion. There could be more going on with this line though (hyper-xanthic?), I cant wait to see the results from this years breeding of the patriarch Davey pastel.

All the boas pictured are defenitly pastels in my opinion. Very nice litter, congrats.

I don't know if they are genetic pastels...Here is what I have found with the red group "pastel" gene. I have bred 2 red groups together and the babies come out looking like super high colored red group. There is no mistake that these are red group. The Red group have a BCC look about them, but thats another story, and the babies follow that trait. Now the red group crosses are high pink but definitely don't have an etch high color about them. A classic example is the EBV 02 red group. They are still high colored and but not as defined as the orginal red group. They used a diffent non redgroup male that can be found on their site. The animals are still KILLER but lack that BCC look that is indictive of red groups. Eric these are just my observations. I'm not a scholar in genetics but your female and babies look awesome.

>>Goodmorning all!How's everyone today?For the last 2 years I know I made a big deal about Raindrop!An I was so worried about wether or not the babies were going to be abberant or not that I have overlooked 1 key factor in the litter of babies that I produced this year!!!!Yes I would have to say that their was some really nice abberencies in the litter an at least half the litter had some sort of deviants to the pattern but I am not really worried about that till more breeding trials have been done!Now to the main question!Everyone has seen an complimented on my litter,The 1 thing I have overlooked an have been afraid to bring up with all the debates going on about pastels,is the fact that half the litter an maybe more than half the litter is that daddies color was most definatley passed onto the babies!Now everyone knows that Raindrop definatley is not a pastel an that Bad was possibly one but with no background info on him he could NOT be called a pastel!I know their are plenty of high pink line bread boa's out their an then you have the Awsome Davey Pastels an then you have the Beautiful line of pastels from Jeff Ronnie!But is their an actuall proven codominent pastel?Or are these animals just so amazing that their coloration is just passed on into the litter like anything else that you breed?My point being is from the looks of these babies an seeing what daddy looked like as I raised him is that somthing is definatley being passed on!He will be bread to another unrelated female this fall to see if this happens again??Hopefully it will!An if it does pass on again what then?I have plans to breed him to a high pink nerd line female in the 3rd year of breeding him!I reckin the main question is[Is he a pastel or not?]After these breeding trials are finished that is?Is this a new co-dominent gene or not!Plus by the time he is going threw his 3rd breeding trial one of his high pink male offspring will also be old enough to produce a litter!This is not a debate to start a big arguement,it is me asking questions that I would like to hear other opinions on!Thanks for reading,Eric[Hypoboa]
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>>E&C's Exotic House of Reptiles
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E&C's Exotic House of Reptiles

Eric,

I have seen a few pastels, I even have a hugh female breeder pastel (Ronnie line). From what I have seen of your clutch they all look great, just dont for get to set aside the one I pick out of me...ok!

Griff / L.A.Snakes, Inc. / lasnakes@hotmail.com