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My baby Hog Island is 10 months old & is being fed a small rat each Sunday evening. He is growing well. He has always been the type to require "dancing rats" (I feed prekilled & he needs them to be moving around, on tongs, before he'll eat it). Well, I fed him on Sunday & tonight, when I cleaned out his water dish, he got into feeding mode & struck my finger, drawing blood. He's never done this before. I defrosted a rat & he immediately ate it, dancing of course.
My question is, do I need to be feeding him twice a week, or should I be feeding him larger prey? I hate to have my sweet guy become a snake I can't handle because he's always striking whatever's moving, but he just won't eat non-moving things...
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2.1 Corn snakes Snake Plissken, Jack Skellington & Abby
1.1 Hog Island Boas Harley & Isaboa
0.1 Albino Sonoran Gopher Snake Jasmine
1.3 leos, Yoda, Geo, Tang, Ginger
1.0 Blue Tongue Skink Indigo (Indy)
0.1 Pacman frog Buffy the Cricket Slayer
0.0.1 Sulawesi Red Toad Mr. Toad
1.1.3 firebelly newts Wayne Newton, Isaac Newton, Fig Newton, Olivia Newton John & Thandie Newton
1.1 cats Gus & Mena

Do you handle him much?? Or is "feeding time" the only time the cage opens?? If that is the case, he may have have developed the dreaded "open cage, strike at food (or whatever is there) syndrome". I had several animals that did that a while back. It was cured with several weeks of handling, each night, for about 1/2 hour. Don't worry, he'll calm down.

Good luck and take care,

Scott

And what Scott, said..... handle the boa consistently and it will build a tolerance for it.

Try feeding outside of his/her enclosure. I feed my boas inside plastic containers. I never feed them in their enclosures, that way they eventually realize that when the enclosure opens food is not coming in. Once I place them in their tubs they know it's feeding time. I have not had any attempted bites since I started using this method.

I looked in his cage a few minutes ago & found the rat I fed him, uneaten. So, yes, it appears he's thinking of any cage entrance as food at this point because he was looking "strikey" this time too, & I had to put a little wall between him & the rat to get it out w/o getting bit.

This is such a shame, he's always been such a wonderful, calm, handle-able little guy. I haven't handled him as much the last month or so as school & life have been really busy. Any suggestions for ways of getting him out to hold now w/o getting bit? Am I going to need to go buy a snake hook?
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2.1 Corn snakes Snake Plissken, Jack Skellington & Abby
1.1 Hog Island Boas Harley & Isaboa
0.1 Albino Sonoran Gopher Snake Jasmine
1.3 leos, Yoda, Geo, Tang, Ginger
1.0 Blue Tongue Skink Indigo (Indy)
0.1 Pacman frog Buffy the Cricket Slayer
0.0.1 Sulawesi Red Toad Mr. Toad
1.1.3 firebelly newts Wayne Newton, Isaac Newton, Fig Newton, Olivia Newton John & Thandie Newton
1.1 cats Gus & Mena

A snake hook is a useful tool to have handy. Just be consistent with your boa and it should eas up in no time.

Yes, get the snake hook, but in addition, go to the hardware store and buy a pair of the soft leather work gloves. Be sure to get leather, it will be safer for the animal AND it will offer you more protection. With the gloves you will have better interaction with the snake, he will get use to being "handled",and you will not have to be fearful of the strike.

In addition, be sure to wear a long sleeve shirt and keep him a safe distance from your face!!

Good luck and take care,

Scott

I agree with needing a snake hook. You will need to use it to remove him for a little while. Next I started feeding my snakes in a seperate container 3 years ago. This has been the best thing I have done. I never get a feeding response. I have had to deal with boas who thought I was prey and believe me it's no fun when your dealing with a large boa. As far as feeding him 2 times a week. That is too much. A once a week feeding is plenty. At 10 months old very 10 to 14 days is good. Good luck with him.
Chuck

while i agree with the others that it sounds like a problem of not handeling and associating anything entering the cage with food i do not however agree on the solutions as much. while i used to feed in a seperate container with smaller snakes it has become evident that especially with larger snakes it is not such a good idea. i have found that with feeding outside the cage there is more chance for getting bit. the reason for this is because once in the feeding container there is a feeding response, and after eating it is difficult to get the snake back into the cage without dealing with the feeding response and with larger snakes this can be a challenge. the way i see it if you are preforming regular mantinence in the cage as well as regular handeling sessions, it is only a very small percentage of the time that food will be going in the cage. this is not enough to cause a feeding response associated with cage opening. in addition it seems that you have a cage which opens from the top and in my experience some snakes tend to get defensive when approached from above as opposed to from a side opening cage. i think a snake hook would be a good investment as it comes in handy many times. but untill then if your snake is still small you could use alternative things such as a coat hanger which does not have any pointed or sharp edges. good luck and deffiantely hadel and interact with it much more then just feeding.

I really disagree with Jayf.... myself and the numerous breeders and keepers that feed that way are the proof that it is a wonderful way of feeding. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that even though every time you open up the tank may not be to feed you will never know what the boa may be thinking. Why would anyone disagree with getting their boas used to knowing there is no food coming in anytime the enclosure opens? I have not had any problem with my boas before or after feeding! I feel comfortable with my son going into the enclosure to get out a boa. I'm not saying everyone feeds their boas in similar conditions, as a matter of fact the bigger breeders have a hard time following this procedure due to a large quantity of boas, but most of these boas are breeders that don't get handled regularly like "pets". My boas know that it is feeding time when the get put into a large rubbermaid and yes they do get excited when you put them in, however after feeding they are calm again and just want to get placed back in their enclosure and get on some heat. But I definitely don't see how someone will go against advice that will help minimize a keepers chance of getting bit whenever they reach for their animal..... THAT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE! I guess I have been doing it wrong for the last 12 years without getting bit.

Please tell me that your boas have NEVER attempted to strike at you since you began feeding in your enclosure because I can surely tell you it has NOT happened to me!

currently i only have one boa who i have been feeding this way since i rescued him over four years ago. i have never had him attempt to bit me or even show aggression towards me even once. i am not saying your are wrong as there are more then one right way to do things. i do not have twelve years of expreience but i do have eight and this is what works for me. there was a large post about this on the burmese python forum a while ago as they are even more of a danger feeding out of the cage. if that is what works for you then that is fine i am not stating that my way is better. but i feel that since my boa is used to me being in the cage for many reasons many times a week if not to hold him then to check temperatures, humidity, change water, replace hides, clean fecal matter and one once every three weeks am i in there to give him food. also i feed pre killed or frozen thawed and i just leave it in there for him. my problem with feeding out side of the cage with larger snakes is that i feel it make the snake more prone to throwing up as well as risking injury of moving the snake after eating. in addition the snake may still be hungry and still pose a threat to bite when attempting to replace the snake. if you like your method that is fine i am not here to say mine is better but i have not gotten bit by any snakes which i have fed in this manner. lastly i can understand that since i am not a breeder and dont own multiple snakes at the moment that you dont value my opinion as much but if you get a chance search in the burm forums and read the many posts on this topic. once again im not trying to fight nor am i saying my method is better then yours just that this is what makes sense and has worked well for me.

i have included a link to the most recent topic on this subject in the burm forum. im not posting to argue whos side is correct just to show you that there is another side and it has worked for me.
i am by no means an expert on snakes or boa constrictors but i am however in my senior year of college majoring in psychology. i have just finished a course in leanring and memory and have learned a great deal about this subject. the individual snake that this post was started about has indeed associated the cage opeing with getting food and thus provokes a feeding response. i feel that this is due to impropper husbantry as the owner had stated that they had not held the animal in quite some time. if the animal is exposed to regular interactions inside of its cage such as handeling and other husbantry activities there is no reason that there should be an association with opeing the cage and getting food thus no feeding response. i do however feel that if this particular snake is still small that it might be a good idea to feed outside of the cage just to break the association of food and cage opening but i still feel the safest way to feed larger snakes is inside the enclosure. callmedaddie again i am not trying to put down your experience or your knowledge as i feel you are a very knowledgeable individual and i am sure your methods work well for you. but as you stated in your post i CAN say that since i have started feeding my boa (about four years ago when i got him at three feet) inside his enclosure i have never not even once been bit or been shown any agression at any time.
The Most Recent Burm Forum Debate On This Topic

It's not that I hadn't handled him in a long time. I make a point to handle each of my snakes at least once a week. But I can see if, 1/2 the time when I handle him he's getting fed, that would cause a response. This problem started last Sunday, on feeding day. I was defrosting the rats on the floor right outside his cage for several hours (company in the house meant no rats on the kitchen counter) & when I went to feed him, he was quite excited & looked ready to strike from the moment I approached the cage, probably because he'd been smelling them for hours. I cautiously gave him his rat, from tongs & thought no more of it.
He doesn't poop every week, so I'm not in his cage cleaning as often as I am w/ my other breeds. When I went to change his water on Thurs, he was looking "strikey" &, indeed, did tag me. This is what prompted my original post.
Today I took him out, with leather work gloves on & he was fine (although I took him out of his hide, before he had the chance to notice me & look "strikey". He was fine. I will make sure to socialize him much more (at least once a day) for the next little while & see if that helps.
I appreciate everyone's input on this. It's been very helpful. Robin
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2.1 Corn snakes Snake Plissken, Jack Skellington & Abby
1.1 Hog Island Boas Harley & Isaboa
0.1 Albino Sonoran Gopher Snake Jasmine
1.3 leos, Yoda, Geo, Tang, Ginger
1.0 Blue Tongue Skink Indigo (Indy)
0.1 Pacman frog Buffy the Cricket Slayer
0.0.1 Sulawesi Red Toad Mr. Toad
1.1.3 firebelly newts Wayne Newton, Isaac Newton, Fig Newton, Olivia Newton John & Thandie Newton
1.1 cats Gus & Mena

You can't have the smell of food present and not expect to get some type of response from a hungry animal. Also, if you handle rodents and then try to handle your snakes you may get bit. I also use WipeOut hand cleaner between snakes and rodent handling.

Yeah, I'm always careful not to handle them when I've touched a rat. But I did think thawing them in the herp room might have been the impetus behind the original problem. Of course, yesterday when he bit me, there were no rats anywhere. He was fine when I held him earlier today. I'm going to try handling him much more to recondition him. He's such a wonderful snake, I want to get us past this glitch.
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2.1 Corn snakes Snake Plissken, Jack Skellington & Abby
1.1 Hog Island Boas Harley & Isaboa
0.1 Albino Sonoran Gopher Snake Jasmine
1.3 leos, Yoda, Geo, Tang, Ginger
1.0 Blue Tongue Skink Indigo (Indy)
0.1 Pacman frog Buffy the Cricket Slayer
0.0.1 Sulawesi Red Toad Mr. Toad
1.1.3 firebelly newts Wayne Newton, Isaac Newton, Fig Newton, Olivia Newton John & Thandie Newton
1.1 cats Gus & Mena

Robin,

I glad you got the help you were looking for and I hope all works out well for you. Enjoy your Hogg Island, I love my pair!!

Take Care,

Scott

There's no need to reinforce the snake's natural instinct to feed on live prey by 'dancing' the rat/mouse around. If you only own one boa, leave the dead rat/mouse in the cage overnight...It will most likely be gone in the morning. He will probably be less likely to bite if he gets used to his food not moving.

- damian

For three years I've used this method. Thaw the rat in hot TAP WATER (maybe 135 degrees TOPS) for 15 minutes or so- this is after thawing at room temp for the appropriate time/weight ratio per rat.(If you try to thaw too fast in the water I've had problems with skin ripping in large rats and overall nasty things happening.) Then, toss the soggy bastard in the middle of the cage when you go to bed and in the morning...voila!, just like magic it's gone. In three years I've only had one failure to eat with this method-and in the morning in the cage was a huge dump. Couldn't blame her. Cleaned the cage, fed her that next night, no problem. Oh, yeah, I feed every 15th and 30th, when my male starts looking like an adult I'll cut him back to every three weeks.

Really? I have left rats in there for several hours before & he seems to not even know it's food, literally crawling over it looking for dinner. His bio mom (the person who sold him to me) says all the snakes in his line require tongs feeding, that none of them will eat a rat just laying in the cage & this has been my experience w/ him his whole life, since I got him at 2 weeks old...
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2.1 Corn snakes Snake Plissken, Jack Skellington & Abby
1.1 Hog Island Boas Harley & Isaboa
0.1 Albino Sonoran Gopher Snake Jasmine
1.3 leos, Yoda, Geo, Tang, Ginger
1.0 Blue Tongue Skink Indigo (Indy)
0.1 Pacman frog Buffy the Cricket Slayer
0.0.1 Sulawesi Red Toad Mr. Toad
1.1.3 firebelly newts Wayne Newton, Isaac Newton, Fig Newton, Olivia Newton John & Thandie Newton
1.1 cats Gus & Mena

even looks like they snuggle with it. That's why I throw it in the MIDDLE of the cage. That way if it's in there for 4 hours or so it won't get too hot or too cold. All I know is it's gone when I get up to go to work at 5 a.m. everytime. I have NEVER had a regurge.

Thanks. I'm giving it a try tonight. When I threw the rat in, he lunged OVER it & struck the glass! Poor baby I hope he will adjust to non-dancing rats, because I'd really love to be able to just feed him, w/o "dancing" his dinner!
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2.1 Corn snakes Snake Plissken, Jack Skellington & Abby
1.1 Hog Island Boas Harley & Isaboa
0.1 Albino Sonoran Gopher Snake Jasmine
1.3 leos, Yoda, Geo, Tang, Ginger
1.0 Blue Tongue Skink Indigo (Indy)
0.1 Pacman frog Buffy the Cricket Slayer
0.0.1 Sulawesi Red Toad Mr. Toad
1.1.3 firebelly newts Wayne Newton, Isaac Newton, Fig Newton, Olivia Newton John & Thandie Newton
1.1 cats Gus & Mena