Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I have been raising my own rats for over 2 years now and this is a first for me. I recently built a new rack, containing 10 large tubs. Each tub hold a male and three females, tons of room. This particular tub contained 33 3-4 week old babies. I cleaned the cage on Saturday and noticed that 7 had been killed with a bite to the back of the neck. I immediately removed the male, as I did have a male kill once. I cleaned the tub, put the remaining pups back in. Yesterday, I checked on them and 20 more were dead, some half eaten. So...one or more of the females did it. I removed the last few survivors and now I am not sure as to why this happened. I use Mazuri, their food bins were full, the water full, I just dont know what happened. Any ideas?

>>I have been raising my own rats for over 2 years now and this is a first for me. I recently built a new rack, containing 10 large tubs. Each tub hold a male and three females, tons of room. This particular tub contained 33 3-4 week old babies. I cleaned the cage on Saturday and noticed that 7 had been killed with a bite to the back of the neck. I immediately removed the male, as I did have a male kill once. I cleaned the tub, put the remaining pups back in. Yesterday, I checked on them and 20 more were dead, some half eaten. So...one or more of the females did it. I removed the last few survivors and now I am not sure as to why this happened. I use Mazuri, their food bins were full, the water full, I just dont know what happened. Any ideas?

First, is it possible that wild rodents got into your rats? I have seen this in one of the places I worked. Silly innocent babies climb the wire to see someone on the outside and get killed or chewed up for it. Or the sheer stress of the wild prescence makes moms nutsy.
Second, what is the protein and fat in the food and how long have they been making babies on it? I would suggest some cat kibble for a bit to up levels. Is she an older worn out mom or a new one on her first litter? Personally I would feed off any of the ladies involved.
I have only had this happen with mice more than once.

I have only seen an old (pet) auntie rat kill a litter one time. Never had a male do anything to babies but lay around with them.
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Sonya

Haven't we warned you about tampering with the structure of a chaotic system?
Mrs. Neutron

Actually, I use the Mazuri 6f, but you bring up an interesting point, these mothers are all first time mothers. I dont know what else to do. I thought about giving them one more shot, this month.

first time moms the 1st litter. In my exp's after their first litter the shock is gone and they settle down nicely. I'd give them another shot.
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Greg Holland
G&M HERPS
www.gmherps.com
gmherps@sbcglobal.net

...and, there are no wild ones. I had a wild rodent or two coming in to steal food a few months back, but had them exterminated and my rat barn "sealed", which probably doesnt mean anything....

It won't cost much to let them go one more month, unless you need the space. Intrusions from the outside,.....Hmmmmm......could here be a snake?

Of course, if you need the production, feed them off and start a new tub. Sometimes it is not possible to find a cause, we speculate and try to prevent recurences...

DeMak

I think it is definitely worth the wait. They produced a lot of babies for a first time. I will give it one more go, I am watching alot closer this time. I may even cull them from the females as soon as I can instead of letting them nurse an extra week or so. Thanks for your help.

>>I think it is definitely worth the wait. They produced a lot of babies for a first time. I will give it one more go, I am watching alot closer this time. I may even cull them from the females as soon as I can instead of letting them nurse an extra week or so. Thanks for your help.

I will say I have never had a first time mom wait til pups were weeks old to kill them. Usually they just suck as moms and kill off newborns. Good luck with the second try.
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Sonya

Haven't we warned you about tampering with the structure of a chaotic system?
Mrs. Neutron

I have read through the posts and I must mention the fact that since you recently moved the Rats to a new rack did you take into account the new smells/odor that fresh plastic bins can leave on baby or fuzzy rats? I have only had female rats kill pinkies of small litter once but that was with no changes and female had already had many litters prior.

Normally mother Rats kill babies that have genetic faults immediatley following birth that day or when the babies scent has changed. Anyone else have other experience? Any outside rodents stealing food would not normally cause a baby killing response but rather a over protective mother response/dominate male would be very aggressive as they are very territorial of their harem. Did you use "Clorox Wipes" to clean tubs then wipe with cotton cloth? this usually removes plastic residual smells that may attach to newborns/fuzzies.

I wouldn't cull them from your breeding quite yet. Give your group another try another try. Are you still using same wood chips and watering system? And does your rack allow the tubs above access to kicking out waste which may fall into lower level tubs? Basically a process of decutable elimination.