Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Several of my hi-end (het for snow) trans pecos rat snakes have a funny smell.
I had an albino that arrived here with it and it also had a stomatitis, so I gave it Baytril and both the smell and mouth infection went away...then it (the smell) came back a couple of weeks later. I sent the albino back because it started having post-prandial regurges usually within an hour or two after a meal. No handling--of coarse.
Two of my other subocs have had that pungent smell on their skin, and one now has it for sure. They are eating okay.
I know it's not a musk. This smell is all over the skin and very strong. I could wash my hands 3 times and still smell it on myself afterwards.
Could it be pseudomonas? Does cryptosporidiosis have a smell associated with it ever?
I can't find anything in Doug Mader's Reptile medicine and Surgery book related to pungent odors and snakes.
Please help.
Dusty

The problem sounds like it may be bacterial &/or fungal in origin. I would have a vet do a skin/saliva swabbing & see if anything comes up (after sending to a pathology lab).

You didn't seem to indicate anything about substrates or dampness/humidity, but bacteria & fungi can harbor in moist substrates.

Goodluck

My first notion is that you missed an important step when bringing in your new snakes. Quarantine. This should not have been able to spread to your other snakes.

Always question husbandry. This snake arrived with certain symptoms, presumable from an illness obtained from the previous owners (A reason to only buy from reputable people). Make sure that your husbandry is top notch to supplement any treatment involved. This may, or may not be why your Baytril treatment failed.

Baytril. I sure hope a veterinarian was involved in this prescription. If not, please scroll down this forum and read the many, many cases where by-passing a vet visit was a poor choice.
This drug is often the first grabbed by a novice herp vet, or a vet doing the best with an owner's limited finances. A culture and sensitivity should have been done to decide what antibiotic will work the best. If this is something you tried yourself, and just happened to have Baytril laying around, then the treatment most likely failed because of improper dosing, drug choice, administration, and length of therapy.

If you would like to know more about what your snake has, and how it is affecting him systemically, then bloodwork and fecal tests will need to be done.

Dr. Mader's book is a great text book (he has a new, updated one coming out in fall 05!), but it's use is minimal when you do not have the education and experience of a qualified veterinarian.

Ian

This is a bit out of text, but I always have to laugh when smell is hinted at being a diagnostic test

Thank you for your desire to help and inform.
However, you didn't pay attention to what I wrote.
You went on nearly a paragraph and a half about why you think the Baytril failed. Go back and read.
The Baytril worked. I said that I used it for the stomatitis, and the stomatitis went away. I don't know why you think it failed.
You also insenuated that I probably did not buy from a reputable breeder. I bought it from Don Soderberg. Who is a more reputable colubrid breeder than Don? Not many. I would run to Vegas and bet $500 you don't even know who he is. Heck, you didn't even know what a suboc was last time you responded.
More to the point, I was talking about the bad smell on the skin of my snakes.
Even more to the point than that...let's be honest Ian... most of us that keep and breed literally dozens to hundreds of snakes don't take snake #999 to the vet clinic each time it has a mouth bobo. In a more time/cost efficient manner, we keep a supply of Baytril. Besides the point, the most qualified herp vet in Texas told me that I was on the right track with the Baytril usage and dosage.
Also you don't have to be a qualified vet to get more than minimal value from Mader's book. That is ridiculous.
Furthermore, I wasn't hinting at smell being a diagnostic test, and I don't appreciate your snickering because you (once again) ASSUMED that I was hinting at that. I was enquiring whether or not crypto was ever associated with or accompanied by a bad smell...end of story.
And what is more scary than a snake breeder using a little of antibiotic without a vet's go-ahead? Probably a vet tech who (almost daily) plays to have the authority and knowledge of an actual vet in a well-known herp health forum.
I was also once, as you put it, " an animal health tech specializing in herps", as you currently are. Really doesn't mean squat.
Again I am sure wou were only trying to help and I am sure you know SOME things, but you come off a bit too assumptious and haughty for your station.
Warm regards,
D.R.

"...then it (the smell) came back a couple of weeks later. I sent the albino back because it started having post-prandial regurges usually within an hour or two after a meal."

A quote from your original post. I don't think that this snake was treated fully or completely, thus my notion that the Baytril regime has failed.

I'm not a fool and I know that some people keep snakes like farmers keep cows. I'm not going to lower my opinion of proper care for such animals, but some indication in your original post may have avoided our mis-communication.

No, of course I don't know whatshisname from Vegas. I specialize in animal health, and the species that I keep, and high-end colubrids are not included, albeit they are awesome snakes.

I'm not going to ask what vet you use because debating a DVM's practice without him/her here is pointless. I'm sure the passive use of Baytril is more related to the number's of animals that you have and not objective, specific treatment. With that said, herd medicine will always take place and that is not necessarily wrong.

And finally, yes, I am a bad person when it comes to ranting on occasion. Yes, I'm even a little preachy at times, which annoys the fu.. out of me when I read my posts a day later, or responses such as yours. The fact of it is though is that I do know more about animal health than the average person. I don't claim to be a vet and that is why almost every post I make includes the advice of a vet visit. I do make efforts to continually advance my education when it comes to herp vet med. Like every other opinion out there on the net, a grain of salt should be taken when reading.

My regular attendence to this forum only indicates the passion for what I do, and I apologize for not helping you better.

Ian