Reptile & Amphibian Forums

This was year breeding boas and it was a real learning experience to say the least. We attempted to breed a pair of het albino possible het snow boas. Evertything went as expected with the cooling, courting, and copulation. I didn't see an ovulation but I did witness a gradual swelling that seemed to dissapear a few weeks after the male lost interest leading me to beleive she wasn't going to produce this year.

We waited and waited for a post ovulation shed and it never happened. She didn't appear gravid and had a very strong feeding response so we decided to sell her and her mate to fund another project. This was a big mistake...

Yesterday I received an email from the new owner saying she was having babies and he wanted to know what we had bred her to. He said that she had dropped 3 anerythristics proving both parents are het for snow. Even though I was a little upset that I had sold a pair of het snows for a fraction of their worth and that someone else was reaping the rewards of my previous efforts I congratulated the new owner. He said she hadn't finisned and I let him know that he may end up with a snow boa.

Had I known she was gravid I would have surely kept her and her mate. We shipped her to her new owner in Wisconsin who then resold her and shipped her to her new owner in Minnesota. Despite all of this she still managed to have babies. I find this to be quite remarkable. Does anyone else have advice on how to tell if a boa is gravid? For heaven's sakes this boa was owned by three different keepers during her pregnancy and none of us knew she was gravid. What were we missing?

IMO the information on breeding boas is very limited, misleading, and sometimes downright confusing. Everyone does it differently and has different methods. Why is it that the majority of the information about breeding boas says that females shed after they ovulate? I have watched videos, read books, and seen several posts stating that boas will shed after ovulating and have babies about 105 days later. None of the information I have seen says or even hints that they can can have babies without having a POS except for Gus Rentfro's website which IMO is the best info out there.

I feel that this lack of information is very misleading and should be addressed. All new breeders should know that a POS is not going to happen every time and they can have babies without shedding after ovulation.

A friend of mine, IAHerper, also bred boas for the first time this year and his female also did not have a POS. She had 18 babies and one slug. So how common is this?

How many of you have had boas give birth without POS?
-----
Jaremy Douglas

Sorry to hear about your situation. My females have always had the POS, and have always dropped their babies between 103-109 days, 11 years in a row.
My good friend had a litter this year that didn't have a POS, and still had a litter of 28 live and 1 stillborn.
The differences that I see are after their ovulation. Some stay at the warm end, some stay on the cool side. Some coil up to conserve heat, and some stretch along the walls. Always keeping me wondering. Good luck to you in the future.
Did they ever produce snows?
Take care, David
-----
--aka DMOG68

This is my first year breeding, and I only had one female go. She never had a POS and we are now at day 137 post ovulation. She is about to burst and started roaming her cage yesterday. Sooooo any time now I hope.

Matt

I think that there's a lot more information out there about breeding than there was 5-10 years ago. Jeff Ronne(The Boaphile) has some good info on his site and there's a lot of info you can attain from other breeders and this forum, but the best source is your own experience and finding what works for you and your animals. From what I've seen a majority of females will have a post ovulation shed, but a good number will not. I had a female last year which had an obvious ovulation but never a POS and dropped 34 babies about 121 days after ovulation. I find that going 120 days give or take a few days after ovulation is a more accurate predicter of delivery date than the POS, but many people miss the ovulation so they count 105 days after POS, that is if they have a POS. Some females will feed either aggresively or only sparingly and in a 'mellow' way when prego, while other won't touch a rat while prego. It's really an individual thing.

comes from Riobravo's site. He is very specific about all the possible outcomes and about all the ins and outs. The problem you have is that your female didnt have a POS. All the sites will state that the POS and then an average of 105 days, BUT there is no positive way to look at a snake and say oh she's gravid. only ideas and speculations. A very good friend of Steve ann I always tells us "It takes more than beautiful snakes being thrown together at the right time, its takes time and it take a heck of a lot of LUCK". The longer i am in this bussiness the truer this statement becomes. There are large breeders who have this one female that slugs out year after year but they keep trying because they are hoping for a year when LUCK is on there side. I am very sorry you sold a gravid female, and I feel even worse if they guy had a snow on the other end, BUT there isnt a positive way to look at a female and say that female will go this season.. I wish you good luck in the future and you did the right think by congradulating the new owners and feeling bad that you sold her, but i doubt there was anything you could have done better... Sorry to hear about your sad sale.

If I have learned one thing in my life time its that nothing is for sure.

Sincerley,
Rose Hipskind
-----

www.srsnakes.com

then there's the reeeeally strange ones....like my dear Jessica. She and Murphy, the Motley, finished breeding around the 3rd week of November.....back in the year 2004....some of you may remember back then. Well, he lost interest in her, as guys are prone to do, and dropped her like a hot potaaato. She had this humongous swelling on 12/3 and shed on 12/27. I'm happy. It's all good. I keep putting Murphy in with her, just to make sure he's sure he's done He is....he told me so...over and over. December becomes January, which turns into Febuary....then spring arrives and the snow melts....ahhhh. March turns into April. I ultrasound her 4/1 and there are the cutest round ova thingies all lined up and down her gorgeous bod. We do this again on 4/29 and sure enough, there they are again, all light and fluffy....and grainy (cause I'm not getting a good image, but that's another story)....but low and behold....they're bigger!! Noticeably bigger! Yay!!

Well, her due date comes and goes. Oh....and also two more sheds....one on 3/12 and another on 4/18....hmmmmmm.... Still no babeeeez. She's still getting bigger. She still seems fine....just like before....except now, it's almost June!!!! Yikes! What to do....what to do.....but wait...and ponder....the snake At this point, I told "Her Worship" if she'll hold out a few more days, I'll have this other ultrasound and maybe we can take pics of babeeeez on the inside.....maybe....

and think good thoughts, happy thoughts of wiggly worms and NO sweet potaaaaatoes.....
-----
Linda Hedgpeth
lindafh@frontiernet.net
Sierra Serpents

"There is just as much horse sense as ever, but the horses have most of it".