Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I had my fifth clutch laid to date, by a nice large female. Bred to a pastel (mute point). This was her first clutch. She laid six good looking eggs, was candled and plenty of nice red viens. She was frisky and not happy with me removing her from her clutch. On checking on her this evening, she was dead.
I saw no trauma or un due stress about her.
My question is, has this happen to any other ball breeder?
Over the years I bred numerous species of pythons, and this is my first female death due to egg laying. I'm really bummed.
She was close to 2000g and not a young animal.
No signs of illness or diease. No prior signs of stress before breeding season. Everything looked normal, except for the death thing.
Any comments would be welcome.

Cut her open and see if she has another egg in her that she could not pass.

Try palpating her for a egg that she couldnt pass..

Bryan

....cardiovascular event such as heart attack/stroke/aneurysm rupture...

....volvulus (twisting) of oviduct leading to infarct (as Bryan said should be able to palpate a single retained egg, but this in itself wouldn't lead to such rapid death...has to be something else in addition)...

....metabolic imbalance (acid/base, electrolyte) leading to organ failure...

....bottom-line: a fluke event

Sorry for your loss!

Scott J. Michaels DVM

I've got to agree with Scott. It is extremely unlikely for a retained egg to be the cause of your female dying in such short a time. Females can go for weeks - sometimes months with a retained egg, and still survive without any lasting ill-effects. Most likely to have been a genetic weakness of the heart etc.
If you palpate a female you suspect has a retained egg, and find that she has, the egg can be aspirated with a syringe and needle through the belly of the snake - which usually allows the remaining shell to be passed naturally. This procedure can be carried out by a competent herper, but should be carried out by a reptile vet if you are at all hesitant. Eric Davies

Sometimes [bleep] happens. I've had a couple females lay eggs, start eating and then die. I think sometimes the eggs damage their internal organs either while they are developing or the damage something important on the way out. Just be thankful she layed them and then died. If you had to cut the eggs out of her there would be a good chance that they wouldn't make it.

Corey

We've had retained eggs also and have either been able to get them out using manipulation, or drugs to induce contractions. I agree with the DVM also.

We've never had a female die, but we did have an unusal thing happen with a female this year and thought we would share. We had a first time clutch from an animal that was sold to us in 2000 as a CB and when we got her she had ticks...this was before we knew the ropes about WCs (I mention this because we don't know her history). She laid 5 good eggs and all looked well until later that day when I looked in on her and what appeared to be her oviduct was hanging out of here vent. This was something that I had never seen, so Diana and I bandaged her with moist dressings until we could get her in to see the vet the next morning. According to our Vet it was an oviduct and the next day it had all retracted into her body and after antibiotics she's doing fine.

I just thought we'd share in case anyone else experiences this, and we are very sorry about your loss.

Debra and Diana
Camlon Reptiles

I am with the DVM on this one, I really doubt the retained egg if there was one resulted in the death of your snake. We had a pastel this season retain two eggs. We gave her a few days and nothing came out so we tried to move them out only to see that it appeared that there must be a twist in the oviduct as the egg had no way out. So interesting enough after a having moved the egg down to the vent and giving it a about another week we had decided to send her to the vet. We opened up the cage to send her out and there was the egg. So we then moved the other one down to the vent and this one came right out with no problems. Both eggs we no good but the snake is well. Sorry for your loss.

Dan

Although I have never had a ball die so quickly from a retained egg....I have had a boa die that quickly from large sluggs stuck together that she could not pass. This is why I said it could be a retained egg. Anyway, cut that sucker open and rule this easy solution out first.LOL

She had 42 slugs and three runty babies two of which lived. She died the next day. Guess it took too much out of her. Bummer. Any how sorry for your loss. Ive been keeping snakes since I was a kid and have seen some really strange, odd, and weird things happen that you really cant explain. Guess thats the mystery of keeping live animals sometimes.

Well, with the input from here, I took a razor blade and opened up the dead snake. From mid body down to vent.... There were no retained eggs. Since I had her open, I looked around at all the organs looking for diease or damage. I'm no expert, but everything seem to be fine.
I can count on two hands, how many times I've had neocropies done on dead animals, to only be told.. that's the healthiest dead snake I've seen.
It's just sad to lose such a nice animal. She was ideal to produce numerous clutches for years to come. I guess it just wasn't in the cards.... At least I'll have some babies from her in about fifty five to sixty days....
Thanks all for your kind words....
Ron
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