Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I know a lot of you aren't around on the weekemnds but PLEASE help if you can.

details leading up to problem:
She has been on an every other day feeding shcedlue, was gladly taking silkies, strawberries and squash. Yesterday she ate one large silkie and I decided that was enoguh for the day.

She was gaping a lot but her temps wer OK. I turned off one light anyway and she continued to gape. I offered her a piece of strawberry which she refused - first time ever.

This morning, she was hanging upside down from a branch which she does when she is close to laying. I have been monitoring her weight since she laid her 2nd clutch last July.

symptoms/facts

I left her alone and when I checked back she was upright but she was gaping (not a URI)

her color was awful - pale, spotty, mouth is very pale - no pink, sort of pasty white/gray

seems to have slight labored breathing - like big sighs.

Her eyes are quite sunken. I noticed this yesterday and thought it was strange b/c she was FINE earlier!

Her grip is very strong, casque is solid so no MBD

She closes her eyes and does not open them even if I touch them! I thought she was dying at one point b/c she did not respond.

I dug a hole for her and put her in back end. she is sitting in it looking awful.

Vet can't see me until 2:45 this afternoon.

I took some pics and will post as soon as I upload.

any suggestions? thoughts? Many of you know her history with being gravid and she usually stops eating for a long time before and shows lots of other symptoms which have been pretty much the same each time - this is VERY different.

thanks
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Chameleon Help & Resource Info

0.1 Veiled Chameleon - Luna
1.0 Beardie - Darwin
0.2 felines - Kyndra and Lita
0.1 African Clawed Frog - Skipper
0.3 Mad. Hissers (2 died ;(
0.1 Chilean Rose Hair Tarantula - Rosa Leigh
0.1 Goliath Bird-Eater Tarantula - Natasha

I am not sure how much you can tell from these pics. I am trying to show her blotchiness, off colors - especially the white along her spine (no, this not about a shed). The one in her hole shows the most. I know she gets dark when digging, etc. but this is different. Along with all else described - I'm worried. She had been doing so great!

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Chameleon Help & Resource Info

0.1 Veiled Chameleon - Luna
1.0 Beardie - Darwin
0.2 felines - Kyndra and Lita
0.1 African Clawed Frog - Skipper
0.3 Mad. Hissers (2 died ;(
0.1 Chilean Rose Hair Tarantula - Rosa Leigh
0.1 Goliath Bird-Eater Tarantula - Natasha

strange that even though you have restricted her diet, made sure she had good supplimentation, that she continues to produce the dang eggs.

She does look very FULL in your pic, and very pale as you say in the mouth area as well as coloration.

I wish I knew what the heck to tell you, you acted quickly with the lay box, and dug her a hole hopfully she can lay and will pull out of this.
Gosh this lady is something Special, I hope she has the strenght to do what she has to.

I have seen the laboured breathing with my female collareds,it is a very scarey thing. There does not seem to be much you can do to help, sometimes with these smaller ones I can soak in warm water, but they are not as easily stressed as chameleons.

I sure hope the Vet can give you some major help and answers for Luna, to recover.

I sometimes wonder if it may have helped to have bred her, seeing females who lay infertile eggs tend to become eggbound more often than others who lay fertiles.

Thoughts and Prayers for Luna, and You, instantly ZAPPED your way!

Let us know
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PHEve/ Eve

Contact PHEve

thanks...
she is just sitting in her hole. I have a light on her for warmth and gave her a single drop of NeoCalglucon. I am wondering if I should take her out of the tub to bring her to the vet or if this will make it worse. ;-/

The sunken eyes (literally overnight) in combo with the weight gain, color, etc. is what is scaring me. I think her strength is fine, unlike last time. Here is a pic of her, finishing a silkworm, that I took on Wednesday - she was fine.

I am willing to mate her at this point but I have no idea how I will manage it - or even FIND a male!
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Chameleon Help & Resource Info

0.1 Veiled Chameleon - Luna
1.0 Beardie - Darwin
0.2 felines - Kyndra and Lita
0.1 African Clawed Frog - Skipper
0.3 Mad. Hissers (2 died ;(
0.1 Chilean Rose Hair Tarantula - Rosa Leigh
0.1 Goliath Bird-Eater Tarantula - Natasha

this is the one I took on Wed

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Chameleon Help & Resource Info

0.1 Veiled Chameleon - Luna
1.0 Beardie - Darwin
0.2 felines - Kyndra and Lita
0.1 African Clawed Frog - Skipper
0.3 Mad. Hissers (2 died ;(
0.1 Chilean Rose Hair Tarantula - Rosa Leigh
0.1 Goliath Bird-Eater Tarantula - Natasha

I don't like the fact she's pale, in her mouth and lip area, thats never a good sign even in humans.

Take her and see what they think, let us know lele.

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PHEve/ Eve

Contact PHEve

Hi Lele,
Hope all is well. I'll tell you what the vet told me when Chloe was egg bound. The gapping was because Chloe was over heating, possibly as a result from a fever, the eggs she was carrier began to rot in her belly and she had a severe infection. Get that girl to vet as soon as you can and keep us posted. Stitch and I will send good energy your way.
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Feenie

1.1 vieled cham.- Stitch and Rana (Missing you,Chloe)
2.2 Canines Junior-pitbull chiuahuah mix, Jose- chiuahuah, Pearl- Staffie, and Daisy- Red nose Pit- foster child
1.0 boyfriend- Trent species unknown

since she was in her hole and better color we agreed not to disturb her. Then, she began to come out of her hole (no eggs) so I took her outside for some sun and she began the breathing/gaping thing again! I just called him to see if he can squeeze us in. I fnot we are in for 8:20 in the morning. Think I may have her sleep in a smaller cage tonight.

btw, I just weighed her and she is 104g.I really do not think she is gravid - I think this is something else. I have no idea how I am going to pay this bill... I am sure x-rays/ultrasound, etc. will be needed or at the least medication. My card is maxed out so maybe he will work something out.
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Chameleon Help & Resource Info

0.1 Veiled Chameleon - Luna
1.0 Beardie - Darwin
0.2 felines - Kyndra and Lita
0.1 African Clawed Frog - Skipper
0.3 Mad. Hissers (2 died ;(
0.1 Chilean Rose Hair Tarantula - Rosa Leigh
0.1 Goliath Bird-Eater Tarantula - Natasha

Lele,

The coloration does seem to indicate gravidness, but you know her better than anyone else. I obviously do not know how qualified is your veterinarian, but I just don't know how much she/he could do to help Luna. If she is, in fact, gravid, then I'm not sure that a trip to the vet will help her (unless she receives oxycitozin), and nor do I think that moving her back and forth (getting sun, into the sandbox, etc...), or forcing liquid or food into her system is the best thing right now.

I would keep her well hydrated (without forcing her to drink) by increasing the relative humidity in her enclosure, and also make sure that she has a temperature gradient. I'm not really sure about the last comment regarding "fever," as these are ectotherms and do not, by definition, produce heat.

In short, I would personally leave her alone, UNLESS you are sure that she is NOT gravid, and the animal is still in a condition to get through the stress of transportation and being handled by the vet.

In any case, all the best...

Fabian