Reptile & Amphibian Forums

please respond to my post please need help female vieled thanks

first off, be grateful that she is only laying two clutches a year - you see what happened to Luna and I am sure that the rupture had something to do with her constant state of gravidness.

I am assuming from your description that these are infertile eggs?

Can you post a current picture of how she looks? Also, list your setup, feeding etc. (go to link in signature, copy/paste the "questions" section and answer. Sorry of you have done this recently, but short of checking every post by you to find it, it would be more helpful to have it again. This way we can help troubleshoot espceially if you are concerned about overfeeding, improper supplementation or organ problems.

I think if she had retained eggs she would not be acting normally, but would probably be on the bottom of the cgae and/or very lethargic.

Will be looking for your setup info...hope i can help

lele
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Chameleon Help & Resource Info

0.1 Veiled Chameleon - Luna
1.0 Beardie - Darwin
0.2 felines - Kyndra and Lita
0.1 African Clawed Frog - Skipper
0.3 Mad. Hissers (2 died ;(
0.1 Chilean Rose Hair Tarantula - Rosa Leigh
0.1 Goliath Bird-Eater Tarantula - Natasha

hello thanks for responding and i am very sorry to hear about lua it was sad to here the posts her pics are beautiful i tried to copy and past the ?s but cant figure it out my very last post on this forum page is the post i am refering to about half way down but her basking temp is between 80-90 and the ambient temp is around 70-75- during day at night it dropes to around 65 ,she is in a custom enclosure i built L=32 h=32 W=22 all screen,plants include a tropical hibiscu,potho vine hand sanded grape vine and some silk potho mimics . Her food is diverse to include cricketas the main staple,mealworms,mealworm beatles,superworms,katiedids in summer,pinkies only to help her bounce back after egg laying, she gets misted 2 times a day and suplement her with hybiscus flowers,dandilion greens,carot slivers,brocoly tops, she eats insects everyother day,and vegy matter once a week,her food is supplimented with insects and include sand fire dragon ranchcham dust and jurasic pet calsium once a week. the insects are gutloaded with flugars cricket food and carrots,brocoly tops,lemon slices she vary rely gets real upset and i handle her about once every seven days except to examine her she is beautiful and will post a pic real soon today thank and sorry about your loss

Hi - thanks for your sympathies about Luna.

Yes, I saw your post below and sort of replied.
I assume she is adult as she has already laid clutches - her cage is too small. She really needs a 4x2x2 all screen cage.

Her temps sound OK - but what are you using to test them? those strip and needle cheapies that every pet store carries are usueless. At the least you need a digital (about $18 at home depot which includes a humidity gauge) ideally a temp gun ($30 including ship at www.tempgun.com)

"Her food is diverse to include cricketas the main staple,mealworms,mealworm beatles,superworms,katiedids in summer,pinkies only to help her bounce back after egg laying,"

all the insects you mentioned have high chitin (the hard substance that makes up the exoskeleton of insects. I would recommend limiting the mealies, beetles and katydids. Superworms are fatty. I would suggest including silkies as a regular, or at least frequent, feeder and waxworms as treats. go here for chart and article on bug's nutrition:
www.chameleonnews.com/year2002/sept2002/nutrition/nutrition_sept_02.html
pinkies for a veiled? I know some people feed pinkies, but female veiled's are not large animals and I (personally) would not recommend this - there are much better ways to get her back on track after laying - silkworms are naturally high in calcium and waxworms are good for putting a little weight back on. NOTE: waxworms are very high in fat and should NOT be a long term feeder.

"she gets misted 2 times a day and suplement her with hybiscus flowers,dandilion greens,carot slivers,brocoly tops, she eats insects everyother day,and vegy matter once a week"

Offer her veggies everyday if she will take them. Ease up on the broccoli. Here is a great site with nutritional content - it is on a beardie site but is a great reference. http://home.comcast.net/~holachapulin/Nutrition.html I printed it ou in color and refer to it all the time. Feed squash - you can't go wrong with it! Luna loved her butternut squash

Is the misting her only water source? She should have a dripper, auto mister (or humidifier) on a timer. Depending where you live dehydration can be an issue

"her food is supplimented with insects and include sand fire dragon ranchcham dust and jurasic pet calsium once a week."

uh - why a dragon dust? The ones most widely used by cham keeprs is Rep-Cal calcium with Vit D3 and Rep-Cal's Herptivite (multivitamin). An adult should have food dusted with the cal/d3 once/week and vitamin once/month.

"the insects are gutloaded with flugars cricket food and carrots,brocoly tops,lemon slices"

just my opinion, but there are better cricket gutloads than Flukers. Cricketfood.com and you can also make your own (so you know it is fresh) using the gutload recipe at www.adcham.com as a guide.

all that said....you have had her for awhile and she looks healthy in the pic below. But I would really consider giving her a larger cage - even though they tend to stay in the top foot or so

Oh - one last thing that I found invaluable when it came to Luna - a good digital scale. It is a great guide to her health and gravidness. Once you establish her "normal" weight you can chekc it every few days or weekly to maintain and tell if she is gaining or losing.

How is she doing now?

lele
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Chameleon Help & Resource Info

0.1 Veiled Chameleon - Luna
1.0 Beardie - Darwin
0.2 felines - Kyndra and Lita
0.1 African Clawed Frog - Skipper
0.3 Mad. Hissers (2 died ;(
0.1 Chilean Rose Hair Tarantula - Rosa Leigh
0.1 Goliath Bird-Eater Tarantula - Natasha

i apriciate your advice i realy dont think my cage is to small and sand fire dragon ranch formulated spiecies specific daily vitemine supplement i would not give my chams dragon vitemins bu here are the pics the last one is when she was showing gravid hues and a little behavior but not walking cage botom yet. i think it is the kidneys because of how over suplimentation put a hard load on them i just really dont think she is gravid again she is extremely healthy and i am just dumfounded they are only behind her back legs when i examine her thats the only bulges that are present i also use a drip systym and use dial and digital thermometers and hydrometers thanks for the help the next post the person discribes a similar issue with one of his females

She looks like my female veiled when she was carriyg eggs and had problems going on. My advice is to get her to a good herp vet asap and get an xray and such done. Just to make sure things are progressing well and nothing is infected or stuck causing her to bloat up like that. Definitely seek a vets help though soon, just for peace of mind at the least.
Good luck

Erin

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1:1 Veileds (Gene and Alis)
1:0 Sambava Panther (Knoxville)
1:1 Albino Clawed Frogs (Phedre and Jos)
?? Fire belly toad (Harold)
Various cats and dogs

wow that pic looks realy familiar thanks so much for the input
will get back and let you know

thanks alot

I remember when Erin lost Aurora after surgery. Someone elses cham wen thtru the same thing and also had surgery - she survived but had ongoing problems.

I would get her to the vet ASAP - hope you have one that knows chams. If you need a listing go to link below and look at vet links.
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Chameleon Help & Resource Info

0.1 Veiled Chameleon - Luna
1.0 Beardie - Darwin
0.2 felines - Kyndra and Lita
0.1 African Clawed Frog - Skipper
0.3 Mad. Hissers (2 died ;(
0.1 Chilean Rose Hair Tarantula - Rosa Leigh
0.1 Goliath Bird-Eater Tarantula - Natasha

You asked for a picture of a chameleon's anatomy...here's a site
with the anatomy of a chameleon pictured/labelled in it....
http://www.chameleonnews.com/year2002/may2002/necropsy/necropsy.html

Chameleonnews also has some other good articles about chameleon
care, etc.

This site has some useful information too....scan down until you
come to the part on chameleons....
http://www.seavs.com/case_studies/lizards/index.asp

I have had many veiled chameleons over the years that don't
produce as many clutches as they are supposed to....and right
now I have 3 that are over 4 years old that have never produced
a single clutch. I think to some extent the number of
clutches that they have has some relationship to the temperature
that they are kept at and the feeding regime. There is a lot to
balancing this though..so you need to know what you are doing
before you try this. It also seems to help control the size
of the clutches. My clutches are usually in the range of 20 to
25 eggs when I do breed them.

I have one veiled female (she's over 6 years old now) who always
has a lump either side just above the back legs when she is
"very" gravid....but this is the only one that I've ever seen
this happen to.
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You said..."1. she is holdig eggs still seems to long though"...
the best way tell if she has eggs inside her is an x-ray IMHO.
I have had unmated females carry the eggs longer than 30 days
without problems (I'm not talking about part of a clutch)...but
there are always other possibilities as to why a female hasn't
laid her eggs...they may become too large to lay, or she might
have developed some internal problem with the reproductive tract,
or the eggs could be misformed or fused together, or poor
husbandry could have led to imbalances in the system, or the
laying place might be unacceptable to her, etc.

I can't give you any information on why a chameleon will only
lay part of a clutchthough....because I'm not sure about the
reasons.

You said..."2.she maybe seveirly obese"...if you post a picture
of the whole (side-view of) chameleon it might help. If its
stictly obesity, then I don't think bulges
that look like eggs would be seen in the area just above the
back legs...unless she was gravid and obese.

You said..."3.beeing fed to much as an adult"....that might
partly account for the last clutch being 40ish in number.

You said..."4. over suplementation"...don't know what to say
about this. Can you explain more exactly what you mean, please?
Calcium is needed for muscle contractions...so if anything was
making the calcium levels too low, it might have an
effect on egglaying....but I don't know if this would have
anything to do with retaining eggs. Other imbalances that make
the chameleon less than healthy could play a part.

You said..."5. my latest is posible kidny problem from over
suplementation"...please clarify what you mean by this.

You said you use sand fire dragon ranch cham dust or jurasic pet
calcium...I'm not familiar with these. You said..."the insects
are gutloaded with flugars cricket food and carrots,brocoly
tops,lemon slices"...(I assume you mean Flukers?) I think that
your gutload could be improved/added to. There is a gutload that
is reported to be excellent at this site...
http://ADCHAM.com/html/husbandry/gutload.html

Also...I never use broccoli, cabbage or spinach as part of my
gutload....they are likely okay to use very sparingly.

If you suspect that there is a problem with retained eggs, it
might be wise to take her to a vet's to have her checked over?
Egg problems can lead to death if not looked after ASAP.

I hope that you can get this sorted out....and that all will go
well with your chameleon!