Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Okay... so I've reconsidered, and decided that a RBB Snake is probably the best place to start.

Though, I can find a multitude of information as far as the RBB in it's natural habitat (location, populus, breeding, etc), I can't find a whole lot on captive care and husbandry.

So - what is the best enclosure design for this snake? (length, width, height, shape, top opening, front opening, etc)

And - what tools are required? Just a couple of decent, long hooks? Tongs? A bag?

Will RBBs readily take rats/mice?

Thanks to everyone.
Aaron.

Hi Mate:

Although the RBBS is one of my favorite Aussy snakes. I really do think the Death Adder is a much better "starter" than the RBBS. It will not attempt to flee and zoom around the room whenyou open the cage as Will the RBBS. It will hook nicely under most circumstances and sit there placidly. The RBBS will provoke a "mistake" by being so active, whereas the DA will wait for you to make the "mistake" by entering it's strike zone.

I also would consider the DA bite a more straight-foward bite to treat and the RBBS more complex and prone to complications.

I suggest two good quality hooks and a pair of non-injuring tongs at least. As it's been discussed a good teacher is a must.

Good Luck,

Al
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"Fighting on the forums is like competing in the Special Olympics, even if you win, you're still retarded."

DH June 2005

Al,

Thanks for the advice.

Only, there's one problem - I have just about finished the enclosure for a RBB. It is 2 metres long, and 48 cm wide, and 42 cm high. It is top opening, and has 3 glass panels on the front and 3 on top (one on each door). The doors are 4 mm apart, and, between each door, on the inside of the enclosure, there is a 3 mm deep track. I still have to make some insertable walls that can fit between the gaps in the doors and securely into the tracks (so that no unneccesary contact with the snake has to occur) - I can put food in one compartment, whilst the snake is in the others, and then close the door and safely remove the barrier (and likewise for cleaning). Mind, I understand that the snake will need to be regularly hooked to calm it down (persay), and get it used to the idea.

I note your comments about them being flighty.. i guess i'm just going to have to take extra precautions and be on guard at all times. It seems complacency is a big killer. And, I still have every intention of keeping death adders eventually (sooner rather than later).

As I side note though - I suppose that I could keep a rbbs in two thirds of the enlcosure (until it outgrows it), and a death adder in the other third... depends how long I can control my impatience for

Cheers.
Aaron.

Keeping in mind that this is coming from someone who has never kept red bellieds or death adders, I would have to respectfully disagree with Al. He makes some great points, but in my opinion, based upon my own experience with elapids vs. viperids, I find some of the medium to larger elapids to be easier to deal with than some viperids, even some of the smaller ones (sometimes, especially the smaller ones). Death adders are known for their viperid-like morphology and habits. They don't reach particularly large sizes, but have an exceedingly toxic venom. From what I've read and have been told, they tend to be slippery on a hook and are able to strike a considerable distance, maybe even their entire body length. Babies and juveniles can also be a real pain in the rear to feed. Red bellieds, on the other hand, do reach much larger sizes than death adders, but they have a much less toxic venom and seem like they would tend to be more cobra-like in their actions as far as trying to flee or attack. For me personally, snakes like this are easier to avoid bites from than smaller, more volatile ones. Maybe even better than the red bellieds, based upon toxicity and temperament, would be Collett's snakes. I've seen people going so far as to freehandle them with seeming impunity (though I by NO means condone freehandling, as eventually the odds will catch up to you). Collett's are similar in size and body structure to the red bellieds, and are, IMHO, even more beautiful, so maybe you should give them some consideration.

Like some of the other posters have mentioned, there are many other 'lightly' venomous elapids in Australia that would be much safer than any of the above-mentioned species, but I can certainly understand your desire. Since you live in Australia and presumably have easy access to AV, I won't try to push you one way or another as far as what species I think you should keep, because my opinion really doesn't matter. In the end, it's going to come down to what you feel comfortable working with and, maybe even more heavily, what you want. Try to find people you can visit who keep all the snakes you're interested in, and watch them work with their captives. Eventually, try handling a few yourself (under supervision) and see what you're best at working with. Keep us updated. It sounds like you are constructing a very nice enclosure that should suite your needs nicely. And of course, be careful.
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Chance Duncan
www.rivervalleyexotics.com

Chance,

Thanks for the reply,

I have considered the Collett's, and too have seen a 19 year old one free handled. It's actions and behaviour were very much like that of a carpet python - it was the holder that was looking a little nervous

Also, I have never handled a death adder, or black snake (or Collett's). I do however like the fact that the RBB snake is very similar in structure to many other of the Elapids we have here in Aus. Yes, they may be a little flighty sometimes, but every possible option is going to have its pros and cons. It is, however, probably a better snake to gain experience with. (in terms of readiness for others).

I will look into the Collett's further (in terms of size, enclosure requirements, general husbandry, etc), and see if it is still an option.

Thanks again.
Aaron.

Al and all,

I keep and breed both Death Adders and RBB's. I can tell you that rBB's are a much better first hot than a Death Adder.

Most of my Death Adders do sit well on the hooks...most of the time. My females are large by adder standards (one is 2'9 and 670 grams the other 2'8 and 498grams) and get very uncomfortable very quickly on a hook or two and try to fling themselves off. My males are smaller and easier to deal with.

As for temper, well some a psycotic (one adder I photographed (a Dajarra) actually struck constistantly with that much force that it would actually leave the ground) others are great. One thing adders don't seem to do is a "typical" strike position (so body language that means that if you don't back off I will try and bite....yes most flatten out and turn and angle the head towards the target but this is not always the case.

As for feeding...again most are good but as adults sometimes males can be a bit of a sh*t to restart feeding after winter cooling and juveniles can be again just annoying when it comes to food.

RBB's on the other hand....heaps of warning before a strike (in 99% of cases), as opposed to popular belief that average adult max is about 5 feet. They are easy to hook and tail (a skill that is more relevant to keepers of Australian species because until you can hook and tail it makes keeping other Australian elapids whether it be Tigers or Browns etc much harder). Generally good feeders and are probably the most attractive snakes in the world (a very bias personal opinion).

As for the venoms of both species...Death Adders have killed people, rbb's killing potenial is in some opinion yet to be proven. Thats not saying don't treat a bite seriously but there is probably a bit more ground to give with a bite from a black as opposed to an adder.

Regards,
Scott

n/m