Reptile & Amphibian Forums

whats a good docile venomous snake thats not very venomous?

do you have to handle them with a hook or can you hold them like any other snake?

can they be defanged?

are they jumpy or are they just like nonvenomous kinds?
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my addiction:
2 ball pythons (lazlo and izzy)
1 amelenistic corn snake (maizy

and whats a good species for a first "hot herp"
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my addiction:
2 ball pythons (lazlo and izzy)
1 amelenistic corn snake (maizy

You should ALWAYS use proper tools when handling hot herps. You should NEVER free-handle a venomous snake. As Al has already mentioned to your in your post in the "Snakes General" page, you cannot trust these animals. He said it best when he said, "You can take the snake out of the jungle, but you can't take the jungle out of the snake". You have to respect these animals to the utmost ability, they can KILL you. These are certainly not for beginners. I have been working with non-venomous, large constrictors, crocodilians and other assortments of reptiles for a few years. I am NOT even ready to keep these animals.

I still have a few years of learning to do before I am ready to take upon that challenge and even then, you really have to do your homework. Totally separate ESCAPE PROOF rooms are MANDATORY. Special caging to prevent escapes is absolutely necessary. All the proper tools are 100% necessary. On hand antivenin for the species you wish to keep is certainly recommended, but at minimum you need to make sure that your local hospital keeps antivenin on hand.

A bite can run you somewhere in the ballpark of $10,000.00 (minimum) and much much higher.

You should have experience with a very wide range of non-venomous snakes before ever attempting to own a venomous snake. It's best to also find a mentor if you can to help you learn the ropes. Reading books are great, but hands on and guided experience is your best (and safest) bet to ensure that you know what you are doing before taking this very DANGEROUS step upon yourself.

I am not a keeper of venomous snakes, but up until this point, this is the homework I have done and the homework that I HIGHLY RECOMMEND that YOU do.

I am sure that the rest of these individuals that actually keep and maintain these specimens can give you MUCH more info.

Best Wishes, and good luck with your herps

Chris

>>and whats a good species for a first "hot herp"
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>>my addiction:
>>2 ball pythons (lazlo and izzy)
>>1 amelenistic corn snake (maizy

Stay with non venomous for a while longer.Do a whole lot more research!!When you think your ready get a native species and stick with it for a while.Yes you can "defang" a snake but it would be highly cruel and probably illegal.Not to mention the fangs will grow back VERY quick if not instantly.Many might have a fully formed fang already waiting.Be smart be safe and do your homework!! Getting tagged by a hot native or not is NO joke!

Good luck

Trey

i wasnt planning on getting one until im about 30 so ive got a long time until i can get one, i just wanted to know if there were any that dont bite often or have weak venom i could get early
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my addiction:
2 ball pythons (lazlo and izzy)
1 amelenistic corn snake (maizy

Under those circumstances a Mangrove would be the snake for you. They are beautiful, get about 7' and are moderately mild natured (better with handling) and non lethal. they used to be sold as (and in some places still are) as harmless.

A simple pair of cotton gloves (if your nervous) will protect but the bite (I have been nailed dozens of times by them) is less than a bee sting.
Only very large specimens are worth worrying about.

Boiga Cynea is another good one (nice and green).

Frank
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"The luxury of not getting involved departed with the last lifeboat Skipper..."

While I am not familiar with handling mangrove snakes as suggested by Frank, from what I have read thus far I would have to agree. However, a venomous snake is a venomous snake. Even though they might not be lethal (toxicity-wise) you cant be too sure that you wont have an allergic reaction to the venom which in some cases can cause a much more life threatening situation that the venom itself.

Just felt that it needed to be added.

Best Wishes,

Chris

>>Under those circumstances a Mangrove would be the snake for you. They are beautiful, get about 7' and are moderately mild natured (better with handling) and non lethal. they used to be sold as (and in some places still are) as harmless.
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>>A simple pair of cotton gloves (if your nervous) will protect but the bite (I have been nailed dozens of times by them) is less than a bee sting.
>>Only very large specimens are worth worrying about.
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>>Boiga Cynea is another good one (nice and green).
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>>Frank
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>>"The luxury of not getting involved departed with the last lifeboat Skipper..."

I was once bitten in a feeding response on the thumb by a western hognose which are known to be mildly toxic but are never considered harmful to humans. But I had a reaction in which my whole hand swelled up and I broke out in cold sweats after about 15 minutes. It didn't last long and there were no residual effects, but it is something to think about. I also found out a couple years later that I am mildly allergic to bee stings (not life threatening anaphylaxis, but similar to the hognose bite with extreme swelling, cold sweats, and stomach craps).

I have to disagree. Seeing as none of the other snake handlers ( I don't think any are toxicologists) are too concerned (actually rather proud of) mangrove snake bites. I would like to caution you, as a co-worker of mine developed severe nausea, local necrosis, intense headache and mild uphoria from an envenomation from the species. All venomous snakes should be treated with respect. Mangrove snakes are incredibly difficult, almost impossible, to be bitten by if you take intelligent precautions to avoid it. The strike is relatively slow and clumsy. Most of which result in bumbing rather than biting. Word to the wise "the best way to learn about snakebite is through experience..........someone elses!
Use tools, plenty of cover in the cage and forceps long enough to avoid a bite and the species is a great way to start out.

Read, research, re-read, get a responsible mentor use the right tools and this hobby/profession is no more dangerous than picking your nose with your friends finger.

Best Regards,
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It's what you learn AFTER you know it all that counts!

Terry Phillip
Curator of Reptiles
Black Hills Reptile Gardens
Rapid City, SD.

www.reptilegardens.com

I've noticed this too regarding Mangrove bites. Mine will allow you to hold her but when she's had enough she hisses and stares at your arm or hand, and it takes quite a bit to get her to strike. Actually she has never struck at me. Dr. Bryan Fry talks a lot about Mangrove envenomations on the rear fanged forum and is of the mind that even a large adult would be hard pressed to cause a serious envenomation unless you have sensativities to venom. That said though, anyone with a sensativity to venom would be cautioned against holding any colubrid from a rat snake to a hognose as they all have venom glands but a very inefficient delivery system. Just be careful, they do get really big though and they move like a Mamba. Good luck, Eric-

I do agree with Terry's advise on this matter, however I'm not sure I agree with the last comparison. I believe picking your nose with your friends finger can be far more dangerous as Homo sapiens are too unpredictable of creatures. Why else do you think they came up with the statement "You can pick your friends, you can pick your nose, but you can't wipe your friends on the back of the couch" ......or something like that.

"Read, research, re-read, get a responsible mentor use the right tools and this hobby/profession is no more dangerous than picking your nose with your friends finger. "

>>I do agree with Terry's advise on this matter, however I'm not sure I agree with the last comparison. I believe picking your nose with your friends finger can be far more dangerous as Homo sapiens are too unpredictable of creatures. Why else do you think they came up with the statement "You can pick your friends, you can pick your nose, but you can't wipe your friends on the back of the couch" ......or something like that.
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>>"Read, research, re-read, get a responsible mentor use the right tools and this hobby/profession is no more dangerous than picking your nose with your friends finger. "

Maybe you can find a mentor in your area. Reading the various books, literature, and websites is a good place to start. But nothing beats the hands on experience with a respected person showing you the do's and don'ts.

The proper tools are available so free handling is not necessary. If you want to handle them, stick to your Ball Pythons & Corn Snakes.

B.W. Smith's book "Venomous Snakes In Captivity" (Safety and Husbandry) is a great book to start with.
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Tim Cole
www.Designeratrox.com/
www.AustinReptileService.net
www.AustinReptileExpo.com/
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<
Conservation through Education

wait until you find something that you're really passionate about. In the mean time, learn the ropes, and research as the awesome responses above have suggested
Ian

Just a follow up.

Any time you deal with an animal there is the posibility of health risks. Anyone who is sensitive enough to venom to be having the reactions TA mentioned above should seriously consider Pet Rocks.

People in this country are made ill or die from Bee Stings, cat scratches (Cat Scratch Fever is real)and blood poisoning fom a large variety of animal bites and scratches (often from animals considered domestic and harmless).

I mentioned Mangroves because for a (normal healthy person) the risk is beyond minor, with only the largest specimens being capable of delivering any kind of real envenomation.

(Note what I said above. If you show a sensitivity to Bee stings or get infections easily, then don't even think about venemous.)

Am I proud of my Mangrove Bites? Hell NO....A bite is the result of doing something dumb. But (as any Zookeeper knows)it goes with the territory, when you are working with a wild animal with teeth. That is why with my more potent creatures I have a strict NO HANDLING rule.

If the snake cannot reach you, then you don't get bit (hooks and tongs folks.....).

As a consequence, I have never (in 35 years) been bitten by a viper or any other truly dangerous snake. That I am proud of.

I also do not keep Cobras or Mambas etc...at home. That (because of their size and speed) greatly increase the chance of serious envenomation.

As to Mangroves, I basicaly ignore their nibbles, so I get bit frequently. And nothing happens. If you don't allow chew on you, the risk (rearfang people)is a non issue all together.

Caution is advised when touching ANY animal or plant that is strange to you. But keep it in perspective. We are not talking Boomslangs here.

Frank
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"The luxury of not getting involved departed with the last lifeboat Skipper..."

"That said though, anyone with a sensativity to venom would be cautioned against holding any colubrid from a rat snake to a hognose as they all have venom glands but a very inefficient delivery system."

Can someone go into greater detail about this?