Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Hi,
I have had a Fluval 404 and Fluval 304 running in my 150 gallon tank for over 2 years, and things have been fine. It was about that time to change the media, so I just recently changed half the media in the 404, (I heard your not suppose to change it all at once). The water was fine. Then about a week later I totally got rid of the 304 and put in another 404. Also an underwater fluval. Ever since I put the newest filters in, the water has been foggy. Well its been about a week now that I put those new filters in.
But its not clearing up, if anything its getting worse.
Is this because of the new 404?
I think I'm just going to take all the water out and put new water back in. But does anybody know why this is happening?
I would expect my tank to be so clean with two 404s and an underwater filter. I have been putting some dandelion greens in there for him, but I dont think that would be the cause.

Any suggestions or comments would be greatly appreciated
Thanks again!
Jaime

It's going thru a bacterial bloom from the new filter media. Just do water changes and it clear up eventually. This is nothing unusual.

When you say changed the filter media, to what are you referring? Filter media is a very broad statement that could mean chemicl filtation, e.g., carbon, phosguard, ammo-lock, or surface area products for biological filtration (nitrosomonas and nitrobacters), like ceramics or plastic bioballs.

I'm assuming you changed-out the media for the nitrification process, and I would ask why? You're removing the bacteria that rids the tank of ammonia and nitrites.

Also, you shouldn't do a water change if the tank is cycleing. It may be cloudy, but, again, the water change will prolong the cycleing process, because you would be removing the nitrosomonas and nitrobacters.
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2.1.0 water dragons, 2.2 crested geckos, 0.0.3 turtles, 1.0.0 5-line skink, 2.0.0 anoles, 0.0.1 giant millipede, 1.0.0 uromastyx, 1.0.0 armadillo lizard, 1.0.0 veiled chameleon, 1.1.0 bearded dragons, 1.0.0 pictus gecko, 1.1.0 CA banded gecko, 1.0.0 Hondo, 1.1.0 corns, 1.0.0 dog, 1.1.0 cats, 0.1.0 wife, 2 SW tanks - 20H, 55

If the amonia or nitrites are too high then a water change is in order. But water only, no scrubbing, no filter cleaning, just some water. It won't hurt the cycling process.

Laure, anytime you cycle a tank, you're going to see an ammonia spike, followed by nitrite and nitrate spikes, respectively.
Removing the water during the process, will simply prolong whichever phase the tank is moving through. If it's high in ammonia during the cycle and you remove the water, then the appropriate bacteria, in that case, nitrosomonas, the ammonia oxidizers, won't establish levels high enough to convert the ammonia to nitrite.
I don't suppose changeing the water would do any damage, but it would keep the tank in a permanent cycling phase.
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2.1.0 water dragons, 2.2 crested geckos, 0.0.3 turtles, 1.0.0 5-line skink, 2.0.0 anoles, 0.0.1 giant millipede, 1.0.0 uromastyx, 1.0.0 armadillo lizard, 1.0.0 veiled chameleon, 1.1.0 bearded dragons, 1.0.0 pictus gecko, 1.1.0 CA banded gecko, 1.0.0 Hondo, 1.1.0 corns, 1.0.0 dog, 1.1.0 cats, 0.1.0 wife, 2 SW tanks - 20H, 55

Hey guys,
Thanks for the responses.
I'm still a little confused if I should change the water or not. I don't really know much about the ammonia and nitrite spikes. But it's now been about 2 weeks and the water is still cloudy, but its not too bad.
So if it can't hurt, I guess I'll change the water.
But it's good to know that this is a normal thing that happens.
Hopefully it will clear up soon.
Is this ammonia and nitrite spikes bad for the turtle though? That's my bigggest concern.
Thanks again for all of your input, I greatly appreciate it.
Jaime

It's not as bad as it is for fish since turtles breathe air thru lungs, not gills.

1) Laure's 100% right on tank chems and turtle health. Other than ammonia, nitrite and nitrate shouldn't be hard on turts.
High levels of all three can be harmful to SW fish, especially because of the high pH levels which factor in to those tanks.
High ammonia and nitrite are harmful to FW fish, but some can withstand very high levels of nitrate (depending on the species).
Herps should be fine during a cycle, however, because of the reason listed in Laure's post.

2) I am telling you though, a water change during a cycle will prolong the process, thus, keeping the water cloudier, longer.

Plus, you changed the media correctly by not changing it all at once. It's called "seeding." Basically, meaning that you're not starting with an entirely new bacterial load. You're seeding the new media with bacteria from the established media. Because you seeded, if you don't change the water, a cycle should occur in under 3 weeks, as opposed to the normal 6 weeks (roughly).
Hope this helps, Mike
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2.1.0 water dragons, 2.2 crested geckos, 0.0.3 turtles, 1.0.0 5-line skink, 2.0.0 anoles, 0.0.1 giant millipede, 1.0.0 uromastyx, 1.0.0 armadillo lizard, 1.0.0 veiled chameleon, 1.1.0 bearded dragons, 1.0.0 pictus gecko, 1.1.0 CA banded gecko, 1.0.0 Hondo, 1.1.0 corns, 1.0.0 dog, 1.1.0 cats, 0.1.0 wife, 2 SW tanks - 20H, 55

Grish, sorry but we're going to have to agree to disagree. Almost everybdoy I know says to change water during cycling which will not delay the process.

You're right Laure. I've worked w/ FW and SW tanks for 15 years and spent 3 of those years part-time at a local FW/SW retail store, with folks even more experienced than I. The only people I've ever come across that would say to do a water change during a cycle are the well-meaning, but ill-informed employees at your "chain stores."
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2.1.0 water dragons, 2.2 crested geckos, 0.0.3 turtles, 1.0.0 5-line skink, 2.0.0 anoles, 0.0.1 giant millipede, 1.0.0 uromastyx, 1.0.0 armadillo lizard, 1.0.0 veiled chameleon, 1.1.0 bearded dragons, 1.0.0 pictus gecko, 1.1.0 CA banded gecko, 1.0.0 Hondo, 1.1.0 corns, 1.0.0 dog, 1.1.0 cats, 0.1.0 wife, 2 SW tanks - 20H, 55

id have to say i agree with grish.. although i dont have quite as much experience (5 years at various petstores), i do know that continuing to change the water after it starts cycling will only prolong the process.. if the ammonia is extremely high then it is ok to do a partial water change, about 20- 25% .. but other than that, you want to leave it alone and let it settle itself naturally.. it will get clear if you leave it alone! this is a common process that tanks go through after losing beneficial bacteria..
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my pets: clown treefrogs, reed frogs, big eyed treefrogs, tiger leg monkey frogs, gray treefrogs, milk frogs, cuban treefrogs, whites tree frog, green treefrogs, squirrel treefrogs, blue webbed gliding treefrog, chameleon treefrogs?, dusky salamanders, tiger salamander, veiled chameleon, box turtles, mud turtle, map turtle, yellowbelly slider, florida softshell, two saltwater tanks, four cats, two chinchillas, and a boyfriend.

OK. I concede. LOL Chalk it up to brain burn but I apparently was thinking high amonia. You are right, cloudy water is not a cause for concern and will clear itself.