Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I was checking out a local plastics company looking for sintra (found it) and also talked to the salesman about using styrene sheets laminated to plywood. My aim is to use this instead of treating the wood for moisture protection etc. I plan on building a "double-decker" tank for my boas. Upper tank for a colombian boa and lower (seperate tank) for my dumerils boa.

Anyway, I was wondering what you folks thought about the idea. They would use a strong adhesive spray to adhere the 4x8 sheet of styrene to plywood and even offered to cut the sheets into whatever dimensions I give them. The 4x8 sheet of styrene would cost about $10 and he said he would not charge me anything to adhere the plastic sheet to the plywood I bring in or for the cuts. I think the idea is a sound one for moisture and humidy protection. The styrene is very thin plastic and weighs hardly anything.

I plan on using the styrene on the inside walls and maybe even the bottom. Again, all over 3/4 plywood. Should I use it to cover the top as well? I plan on using radiant heat pads to heat the tanks (one for the upper tank and one for the bottom) but may consider using lower wattage incandescant bulbs too (40-60w) if needed to heat up a basking area. Have any of you used styrene and do you think what I've brought up is OK?

I would appreciate any thoughts. Thanks!
-----
Ken Roshak
BlackSwampSerpents@toast.net

>>The 4x8 sheet of styrene would cost about $10 and he said he would not charge me anything to adhere the plastic sheet to the plywood I bring in or for the cuts.

I think this concept is a great idea but I might have some concerns with the application.

1) You say it's pretty thin, how thin? I have some thin pieces of Styrene the scratch and dent easily due to how thin they are. I would consider doing the floors with 1mm Sintra or FRP since this is where most of the abuse will occur.

2) Make sure you have the adhesive sufficient time to offgas.

3) Whenevery you laminate something over the wood in a cage the corners are always a concern. Silicone caulk is the standard treatment but even it can fail and cause water to get to the plywood.

4)) This will still be an expensive deal, even if you use a cheaper plywood. I can think of a few advantages of this. One is the structural integrity of the plywood. It will make for a strong and durable cage.

The other is that you simply want the finished look of a cabinet quality cage on the outside with the durability of a plastic cage on the inside.

Regarding structural integrity, I believe there are lighter and more durable ways to build such a cage. They would be cheaper, too.

Regarding a cabinet quality cage, I would then think you'd want the same look on the inside and would suggest a clear coat of epoxy.

I'm speculating here but I hope this helps you with your thought process.

>>I plan on using the styrene on the inside walls and maybe even the bottom.

Like I said above, I would use something more durable on the floor.

>>Should I use it to cover the top as well?

Unless you are using a ceiling mounted misting system, I'd say probably not. Just a few coats of poly or paint should do.

-----
Current snakes:

1.1 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Silver/Yellow)

2.2 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Green)

4.3 Gonyosoma janseni - (Black)

I'm looking to convert a chest of drawers into a natural planted cage (above post), which will need water. Where do you get epoxy and whats the best method for adhering to the wood?
-----
2.1.0 water dragons, 2.2 crested geckos, 0.0.3 turtles, 1.0.0 5-line skink, 2.0.0 anoles, 0.0.1 giant millipede, 1.0.0 uromastyx, 1.0.0 armadillo lizard, 1.0.0 veiled chameleon, 1.1.0 bearded dragons, 1.0.0 pictus gecko, 1.1.0 CA banded gecko, 1.0.0 Hondo, 1.1.0 corns, 1.0.0 dog, 1.1.0 cats, 0.1.0 wife, 2 SW tanks - 20H, 55

np

The only problem with steryne, is that it gets dammaged by air. I explain: If you take per example a new sheet of white styrene, after a couple of month you will start to see the edges getting yellow, and the plastic will get verry craky with time.

I work in a sign shop and we have a lot of old styrene pieces that are almost turned yellow/tan with time

so if you choose that option....make sure you take black plastic and that you dont put much heat near the plastic.

Styrene is very similar to acrylic and both can exhibit yellowing and cracking when exposed to certain cleaners. This will be worse with the thinner material.

>>The only problem with steryne, is that it gets dammaged by air. I explain: If you take per example a new sheet of white styrene, after a couple of month you will start to see the edges getting yellow, and the plastic will get verry craky with time.
>>
>>I work in a sign shop and we have a lot of old styrene pieces that are almost turned yellow/tan with time
>>
>>so if you choose that option....make sure you take black plastic and that you dont put much heat near the plastic.

Excellent points. I never thought of these issues. I wonder if because it's adhered to plywood that the strength would be better? Meaning it wouldn't be as flimsy and prone to crack because it's backed with plywood? I wonder if painting it would be a good solution to yellowing?
-----
Ken Roshak
BlackSwampSerpents@toast.net

>>1) You say it's pretty thin, how thin? I have some thin pieces of Styrene the scratch and dent easily due to how thin they are. I would consider doing the floors with 1mm Sintra or FRP since this is where most of the abuse will occur.

I'm not certain of the thickness but it's pretty thin. But from the feel I'm pretty certain it would hold up when used on the sides. I agree the bottom may be better served with sintra! Thanks.

>>2) Make sure you have the adhesive sufficient time to offgas.

Yes, for sure.

>>3) Whenevery you laminate something over the wood in a cage the corners are always a concern. Silicone caulk is the standard treatment but even it can fail and cause water to get to the plywood.

I was planning on using a silicone bead in the corners too.

>>4)) This will still be an expensive deal, even if you use a cheaper plywood. I can think of a few advantages of this. One is the structural integrity of the plywood. It will make for a strong and durable cage.

>>The other is that you simply want the finished look of a cabinet quality cage on the outside with the durability of a plastic cage on the inside.

Yep, my thoughts exactly. I like the idea of plastic for the interior and wood for strength and exterior beauty.

>>Regarding structural integrity, I believe there are lighter and more durable ways to build such a cage. They would be cheaper, too.

Lighter and durable, sounds good! --- Can you shed some light Chris?

>>I'm speculating here but I hope this helps you with your thought process.

Yes, always great help

>>Unless you are using a ceiling mounted misting system, I'd say probably not. Just a few coats of poly or paint should do.

Got cha!
-----
Ken Roshak
BlackSwampSerpents@toast.net

The other is that you simply want the finished look of a cabinet quality cage on the outside with the durability of a plastic cage on the inside.

Yep, my thoughts exactly. I like the idea of plastic for the interior and wood for strength and exterior beauty.

In that case I would tend to discourage you from styrene as I don't believe it would be the most attractive solution. Formica comes in a variety of colors and if you find a wood you really like clear epoxy is basically a laminated layer of plastic once applied.

A few questions:

1) What would be your #1 choice for what the interior of the cage would look like?

2) What would be your #1 choice for what the exterior of the cage would look like?

3) Will the sides and top of the cage be visible or will only the front face frames be visible?

Where I'm going with these questions is pretty straightfoward. If you prefer to see the wood grain on the inside of your cage then I do recommend a coat of clear epoxy. Worth the effort and none of the durability and yellowing concerns of styrene.

If you actually prefer a solid color on the inside and only the face frame of the cage will be visible (not the top of sides of the cages), then other options open up.

Regarding structural integrity, I believe there are lighter and more durable ways to build such a cage. They would be cheaper, too.

Lighter and durable, sounds good! --- Can you shed some light Chris?

Well, if attractive looks are your concern, this may not be such a desirable option. But I was thinking of cage assembled from some sort of sign board and held together with solvent-welded PVC angle. It won't be an ugly cage by any means, but it won't be a cabinet quality cage either.

-----
Current snakes:

1.1 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Silver/Yellow)

2.2 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Green)

4.3 Gonyosoma janseni - (Black)

>>In that case I would tend to discourage you from styrene as I don't believe it would be the most attractive solution. Formica comes in a variety of colors and if you find a wood you really like clear epoxy is basically a laminated layer of plastic once applied.

Hmmm...I'll have to check out formica.

>>A few questions:
>>
>>1) What would be your #1 choice for what the interior of the cage would look like?

Honestly, the cages are in my "unfinished" basement so having a "cabinet" quality piece of furniture would not be my first concern. But I don't want anything "junky" looking either. My concern is that because the basement gets cooler (60-65) in the winter my aquariums just don't cut it for maintaining heat. Plus my colombian is outgrowing his 70 gallon. For the interior my main concern is moisture proof that holds up over time. I don't really want to keep "re-doing" the tank every couple of years. Maybe using a nice "foliage" green would be neat instead of the stark white of the styrene.

>>2) What would be your #1 choice for what the exterior of the cage would look like?

I don't want the look of "particle board" but having a cabinet quality finish isn't needed either. I think a simple stain over plywood exterior would be fine. But I'm not opposed to the look of "plastic" either.

>>3) Will the sides and top of the cage be visible or will only the front face frames be visible?

Eventually only the face frames. I have 20 snakes and the goal is to find a good caging solution and replace the aquariums I'm currently using to home made caging. When this happens, the cages will be either back to back or side by side based on space considerations. The tops will come pretty close the basement ceiling so won't be that visible if at all. But until I make these cages, the sides will be visible.

>>Where I'm going with these questions is pretty straightfoward. If you prefer to see the wood grain on the inside of your cage then I do recommend a coat of clear epoxy. Worth the effort and none of the durability and yellowing concerns of styrene.

OK, sounds good. I didn't think about yellowing and cracking. Good thing I posted the question I remember previous posts concerning epoxies. Several very light layers as opposed to 1-2 heavy layers!

>>If you actually prefer a solid color on the inside and only the face frame of the cage will be visible (not the top of sides of the cages), then other options open up.

I can go either way. But based on the number of cages I am planning, cost savings would bode well

>>Regarding structural integrity, I believe there are lighter and more durable ways to build such a cage. They would be cheaper, too.

Now we're talking!

>>Lighter and durable, sounds good! --- Can you shed some light Chris?
>>
>>Well, if attractive looks are your concern, this may not be such a desirable option. But I was thinking of cage assembled from some sort of sign board and held together with solvent-welded PVC angle. It won't be an ugly cage by any means, but it won't be a cabinet quality cage either.

Sign board like Sintra? Would it be as good a choice for the basement temps I described or would wood hold heat better?
Solvent welded PVC angle? Not certain what/how/where you're referring to here, sorry.

I really appreciate the posts and help. This is a quality forum with great advice from all. I look forward to your thoughts on "above" questions.
-----
Ken Roshak
BlackSwampSerpents@toast.net

Ken,

Rather than taking a lot of time to quote every single point, it really sounds like a cabinet quality wood cage sealed with epoxy is not the right choice for you.

I have some specific suggestions for you but don't believe that KS will allow me to post the necessary links. Send me an e-mail and I'll we can discuss it.

Chris
-----
Current snakes:

1.1 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Silver/Yellow)

2.2 Gonyosoma oxycephala - (Green)

4.3 Gonyosoma janseni - (Black)

no post