Reptile & Amphibian Forums

The first four that hatched,

The fifth to hatch

a headshot

The last egg just hatched and it appears to be a normal milksnake phase. More pics after they hatch if anyone is interested, Thanks FR

Are you saying the female Thayeri was never with a male Thayeri? I have done hybrids for 15 years and have never seen any calf king hybrid that shows this amount of red the first generation much less looks like the pure snake it bred. The calf has no red and for it to hatch pure looking thayeri I don't see how it was never with a male thayeri. The same thing with the albino Priarie awhile back. It looked pure Alb Prairie. I use to breed alb Prairies and the babies were always bright and red even though they turned yellow later. I think it was also with a pure mate. HDEAN

They do look pure thayeri but the thayeri(lets say gene?)is very domenate.No matter what you cross thayeri with the thayeri gene just seem's to take over.Picture three(the head shot)does seem to have a cali look about it though.

I posted the history way down below. And I just posed a question on the kingsnake forum, with the history, but I mainly recieved grief.

I will refresh you, This breeding was accidental. I bred a pair of tharyi last year, these snakes were gifts for people that recieved them as gifts, when I got them, I understood why they were gifts. All had some sort of problem or another. In otherwords they were non-sellable individuals. The male was bone skinny, and missing a hemipene. One female had very old retained eggs, the other(this one) was the best of the lot, but was all soft and lumpy.

Much to my surprise, the male(buckskin type) was able to fertilize eggs last year, but in order for him to gain weight, I seperated him. Then this spring, I put him in with her and she killed in, within hours. There was plenty of time for breeding, althought I did not see any. I then introduced a perfect beautiful male. Milksnake with orange instead of white. She again killed him within twenty minites, again, barely time to breed. So I in a weak moment, put her in with a male black&white calking, they bred like all things were normal.

The RESULTS, my experience is like yours, I never produced a cross that did not have some telltale sign it was a cross. Of course my crosses were not nearly as diverse as many of yours. Mine were all amoung different mountain kings(Which really ought to be the same species)

Anyway, the result was 3 hybrids and 3 very normal appearing tharyi. My question was, In all my years, I never had two males father one clutch, but I clarified that, I always left a male with the female for days and never less then 24 hours. I did have a friend that without question, had two males fertilize a clutch, but in piggy backed them. I asked if anyone had this experience. Some gave second person answers, like so and so did.(I already knew that) But no first person responses, which I believe is the real benefit of these forums.

Of course it appears to me, that both a calking, there is no doubt about that, and the milksnake tharyi, fathered this clutch.

I also mentioned, that I will indeed treat all these animals are crosses and not represent any as pure. In fact I will keep them. Thanks FR

Thanks, Sorry I didn't see the other post. It's is obvious as you stated that both fathered the babies. I did have this happen myself one time but I can't remember with what. it was as obvious as your situation. Seems it was an albino in the clutch that could have only been from one male and the others looked normal. i'll have to look it up. HDEAN

First off, Frank, WHY MAN WHY???

Just kidding.

I had a female emory rat lay a clutch this year that was obviously fathered by two animals. Roughly 2/3 of the cluch was fathered by my male emory rat. When I was breeding her though, the male emory didn't show any signs of being reproductive. I left the female in with him for days and never saw the slightest bit of interest. So I plugged her into my albino striped motley corn male who we nicknamed "The Violator" primarily because he will breed with anything legless. Only about a third of the babies came out as hybrids though. The hybrid babies should be het for creamsicle motley.

Chris

nice snakes how big are they?
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my addiction:
2 normal ball pythons (lazlo and izzy)
1 amelenistic corn snake (mazy)
1 wc eastern milksnake (psycho)

Neat looking some look like hybrids some look kinda like pure thayeris. The red ones should be very interesting as adults.