Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I was reading Bruce Means and Kenney Krysko's paper again recently and the pictures they used show some spectacular kings. I thought I'd share them here in case some have not seen them yet.

First is a patternless form, a beautiful individual.

Several striped specimens.

Your typical blotched form.

If anyone is interested in reading the paper, you can do so here:

http://www.calacademy.org/research/herpetology/ch/ch/2001/5/index.htm

I also have a copy of Neil and Allens paper with some interesting photos. If I can find it, I'll post some pics from it as well.

The pics are rather large but I think it shows more detail so I left them at their original size.

Notice the specimens from this paper all have dark blotches and none were patternless or striped.

Ross Allen! Now that's a name I've not heard in about 30 years,I think he wrote about half the books on Florida herps that I read as a kid....

BTW,It was nice seeing you again at Daytona,Sean.
-----
Lloyd Heilbrunn

Palm Beach Gardens, Fl.

It was good to see you too Lloyd! Still have any of those Ross Allen books? I can't remember if I saw any of those when I was younger but I'd be very interested in seeing them now.

Thanks for posting the Neil and Allen paper Sean. I had wondered what the verbage was and what snakes it was based upon. How is the female you found doing? Phil

The female is doing fine Phil. She hasn't eaten yet as she's gone through two shed cycles since I found her but she looks very healthy. I'm going to try several food items once she sheds and see what she likes.

The first pic of the patternless one is stunning Sean. Thanks for the pics.

Steve

That patternless one is stunning Steve. I've always wondered why we don't see more of that phase as I think it's one of the most attractive.

...I am always confused it seems...
Anyway, I see that in many of the patternless specimens that the interscale coloring is more rounded or appears like a light spot within the scale--not the "straight down" kinda thing like as if cutting the scale in half,colorwise, on the banded ones. Know what I'm talking about? (if you do you have me beat lol!)
Since that "straight down" marking is supposed to be in the interband area, where is it supposed to be on a patternless individual??
Is this another reason to think the patternless ARE NOT "goini"???
I need sleep...
Seriously, what would/should I call mine??
:Mark

Good question Mark! Not sure why that may be but the nearly patternless female I bought this past weekend has the straight line, split coloration on each scale. I think I remember Pierson's male looking the same way. The one you posted a pic of though looks different. I'm gonna look at the patternless specimens on Hillson's site and see what I can tell.

actually i have read several accounts-and yes,i have sought anything at all about these guys;lots of reading,lol-and a general consensus seems to be that the purest of the goinis(and no i'm not lobbying for elevating them to subspecific status,not really opposed to it either-let's avoid that plenty-beaten-to-death horse) are indeed the ones with either hints of striping,and esp. the patternless ones...less 'pure' would be the actual 'blotched' variation,despite the fact that the holotype,the original specimen described,was yes blotched....this to me makes sense-the blotched ones obviously can be seen as having eastern king influence in their pattern,therefore would be an integrade of getula goini x getula getula....the patternless ones appering to have less genetic influence from the surrounding chain king's population.just because the originally described goini was blotched,does'nt mean that individual was the purest of 'said new subspecies'....then to confuse us all,and maybe even shoot this all to hell,you can get blothed,striped and even patternless specimens from the same clutch-like said in previous post,the totally patternless ones are just rarer,like a fully/unbroken-striped cal king,for instance....keeping in mind that integrades usually will show traits of both mom and pop-to seemingly random degrees of variation(i.e. a male striped cal king x a female banded cal king can give you all banded,all striped,or most likely a varied mix)

it's just like a 'perfect' pattern with anything-an unbroken stripe on a cal. king;an obx king with even speckling in each saddle;a blk. mex. king that is truly all black....more often than not,there are going to be what we call 'imperfections',but that would serve the animal just fine in the wild....we're dealing with wild animals here,not restored cars or something,lol....natural selection finds it's way via random anamolies....say like mother nature is more like jackson pallock,not m.c. escher.and what works through longevity is passed on....lol.yeah i need sleep too,i think?