Reptile & Amphibian Forums

first week in October?

It all depends on when you plan on breeding them and sometimes where you live. I wait till later in the season along with alot of other breeders that live in south florida. It's very hard to simulate a change in the seasons if there is a window in the room and they can get daylight in the room. it also makes it hard to cool the room properly when it's mid 90's outside still. I really think it doesn't matter as long as you keep it constant each year. I start cooling in late jan/feb. Hope it helps, Josh Hutto

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2.3 het pied (RDR, alan bosch x 2, BHB x 2)
1.1 het albino (ben siegel, gulf coast)
1.2 het citrus ghost(gulf coast line)
1.0 citrus ghost (gulf coast line)
0.1 graz pastel female
1.6 05 normal bp's
0.6 04 normal bp's
2.5 adult normal bp's (some need breeding to see if norm)
4 various corns
0.1 brazilian rainbow boa (alan bosch)
1.0 american pit bull terrior
1.1 taco dogs (ankle biters)
1.0 grey cat
1.1 bearded dragons

a BAD dog is MADE not bred, support the American Pit Bull Terrior as the greatest breed of dogs on Earth!!!!!

I live in southern California and it usually stays around 75-85 year round (except for summer), so I don't have that problem of being to hot like florida.

Kyle

I'm also in So Cal - I'll most likely start cooling around November/December. November for the big girls that I know are ready to go and the smaller ones will get another month to put on some more weight just in case.
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Tosha

"Nihil facimus sed id bene facimus"

7.33.0 Ball Python (Harry and Fluffy and gang)
1.0.0 Angolan Python (Anakin Skywalker)
0.0.1 Green Tree Python (Verdi - yeah I know but my kids love the book)
0.2.0 Feline (Pippen and Pandora)
0.0.1 Desert Tortoise (Pope John Paul aka JP )
2.2.1 Fish (1,2,3,4)
0.0.2 frogs rescued from pool skimmer

I usually lower mine about mid-October.

Good luck, Christy

thanks Christy

Are you under the impression that if you lower temps, it will in some way help follicles to grow? If so, then that couldn't be further from the truth. I also think that the Oct to March schedule is one of the biggest myths ever told. If it were a fact, you wouldn't have hatchlings all year long. Females produce follicles every year, no matter what and no two females produce follicles the same time every year. Having said that, if you are already confident enough in palpating you will find this to be true.

You then have the guy that cools from Oct to March and when they havent dropped or show signs of ovulation, wonders why he can't get his male to breed. That then is simple math as he has over extended his male at uneccesary times or in other words, introduced a male to females that were not follicly ready.

It works exactly the same in human reproduction. You yourself (for the sake of younger viewers) breed 100 times to 100 females and your results are less than acceptable. Why? Because you have spent yourself. You follow heat and charts and only attempt to procreate when the female/females are "follicly" ready. You then haven't spent yourself at uneccesary times and allowed yourself to bounce back from a strenuous workout . That equates to staggering results. In other words, lots of babies!!!!

A simple analogy: Pick your favorite ice cream and eat it everyday, all day for 5 months. How much more of that ice cream are you going to want in the 6th month? None.

Naturally JMO,

Jeff
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No I wasn't asking because of follicles growth. I had read a few website that said cool in Oct and then introduce in November-RDR and Marcus Jayne breeding pages.

Ok, if your not concerned with follicle growth, then you shouldn't be concerned with breeding. They go hand in hand and without the first, you dont get the second.

As I said in the first post, NO females produce follicles the same time every year and all females produce them. Babies are produced all year long and I know several breeders including myself that cool absolutely nothing. Ambient is the key and with palpation you miss nothing.

Jeff
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Jeff, since I'm just starting out, how does one learn how to palpitate for follicles? Is there a website that explains it clearly so I know what I'm feeling for? Thanks

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Alice Cobb

Jeff, that's a good theory and actually makes a lot of sense, but I ate pizza every day for 5 years and I still eat it when I get the chance. Wuzzat mean??

Quig

Additionally, I will say that I enjoy very much the conversations indirectly with Joe Compel. He has alot of insight and we both conclusively agree that no 2 people breed ball pythons the exact same way I also think that not enough information is shared on actual cooling teperatures and a very good reason for that is, that it is not substantiated by facts. For anyone interested, I put together a table that shows temps in a balls natural enviroment high and low for an entire year and based on what I have found, a ball pythons average temperature (yearly) only fluctuates plus or minus a couple of degrees. I did believe that cooling was a fact when I started, but later realized I was just following someone else's idea instead of looking at all the facts.

Keep this in mind,
If you did not cool any of your animals and only bred when they were follicly ready, how many times would you be faced with respiratory infections (RI's)??? In 2 1/2 years I have only had one ball with an RI that was previously infected before it was shipped to me and also was disclosed by the seller. I keep an ambient temperature of 85 degrees constant 24/7. No cooling, but I do adjust light for winter. I don't own hundreds of balls, but have a modest 60 ball collection. I aspire to have one of the best ball collections out there and move into predominantly endangered species reptiles to do my part and help save them. That is only a short time away I guarantee it

Please do not confuse my statements with the fact that what I say is set in stone. There are alot of breeders that have great success using the cooling method and it works for them. If it works for you great, if it doesn't, change it. When I don't know the answer to a question I ask friends, when they don't know I read.

Palpating question:
There are alot of great sites out there with extremely helpful information. There are also some video's by a few people that show you how. Browse the breeders section of KS and check through them. I particularly like VPI's site and they have some very cool stuff in there. Rick @ Ball Boutique has some great stuff there and Markus Jaynes site and for all the killer morphs RDR and N.E.R.D.

Quig, stay off the pizza and we'll see ya in 2 weeks at the Unique Animal Expo in Hillsboro if your there.
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Hillsboro? Where da Hell's Hillsboro? I can't hardly get myself outta the neighborhood, let alone outta the state.

Quig

Aren't you in the NW?
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Hummmmm, mus' be another Quig, I'm in Michigan

Definately is, my mistake your only about 2300 miles from me
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LOL Only 2300 miles?? Thirty years ago I could hitch hike that in about a week

Quig

and find time to do some herpin' along the way

I didn't cool mine, I just adjusted the light timer to the sunrise and sunset changes thru the year. As a after thought in late Feb, I decided to put the male in with the female for a couple weeks, the hooked up and now I have eggs due any day. Obviously I'm not an expert, but the point is I think people overthink things.

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1.1 Jungle Carpet Python
1.1 Ball Python
1.1 Corn Snake
0.1 Gray band Kingsnake
0.1 Desert Kingsnake
0.1 Pueblan Milksnake
1.0 Bullsnake
1.0 Rhodesian Ridgeback
0.1 Spouse
8 ball python eggs due any day now!