Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Don't get me wrong, Sharp strains are great, but I don't understand the hype about them.. Sharp strain sunglows, 15k?? Sharp strain albinos 3k? I've seen Kahl albinos that look better than Sunglows, on Peter Kahls old website he had pictures of his albinos and stripe line albinos, those were INSANE INSANE... I remember someone just posting pix of baby albinos purchased from Burke Reptiles, again, those were INCREDIBLE!!! I don't think it has much to do with the strain of albino so much as it has to do with the people working with it... And I'm not trying to be ignorant, but honestly the Sharp strains posted just below aren't all that jaw dropping, they're nice but not extraordinary.. I'm sure I'll catch a ton of heat from people on the Sharp trend, but I'm just telling it how I see it.
-----
Joe Lydon
Got Boids?

I think because there are just more kahl's then sharp's. Once more start being produced, the price will drop. just my 2 cents.
jake

Actually you are wrong, though there are alot more Kahl sunglows then Sharps, there is more to the higher price then just the quantity available. Try comparing regular Kahl albinos to Sharp albinos. Remember, term "banana" was coined to describe what alot of Kahls become. Kahl babies are born with alot of color but tend to loose alot of it as they get older (not all but most). When making a comparison you should make a comparison of apples to apples, not apples to oranges. Comparing a striped coral sunglow to a regular sharp sunglow is not a fair comparison, maybe when a striped coral sharp sunglow is produced you can. The sharp sunglows that "aren't jaw dropping" have not even begun to have their color set in, but they will.

I hope Ron does not get upset with me but here is a picture showing his newborn sharp sunglows.

Here is a picture of a yearling. No coral/pastel or anything else in this boas, just a regular sharp sunglow. Most Kahl sunglows at this age show less color then when they were 2 or 3 months old.

Here is my female at only 4 months, she will be twice as colorfull on her first birthday.

>> Kahl babies are born with alot of color but tend to loose alot of it as they get older (not all but most). >>

I never said all Kahls were great, I was making a statement that some of the people working with the Kahl strain are making them outstanding, and so far, the BEST Kahls I've seen are way nicer than the BEST Sharps I've see.. There are low and high grade animals of every morph... And the price you pay for a HIGH grade Kahl strain that will hold its color is still half the price of any Sharp strain.. Even if Sharps are a tad nicer, I still don't agree with the double the price of Kahl values..
-----
Joe Lydon
Got Boids?

Wow, very sensitive. You really can't make comparisons of the best Kahls and Best Sharps because you can't see sharps that have been plugged into anything else .... yet. If you are comparing a top notch regular Kahl albino and a top notch regular Sharp albino, who's boas are you using to make that comparison? I have both Sharp and Kahls so I can make a comparison anytime I want. Many people are in the process of plugging the sharps into different morphs and line of boas, once you start seeing twice the color then maybe twice the price will be justified.

My pictures are not all that good (all my money goes into boas, I can't afford a good camera) but if you were to see my sharp sunglow you would see nothing but orange. When I see the Kahl sunglows that retain the color of their saddles but fade in "body" color, I'm glad to have in my collection a boa that is going to be getting a deeper orange as it gets older.

Can you imagine pastels getting plugged into sharps? They would be the most colorful boas produced!

Here is another pic. of my female taken by Ron.

I guess I can't battle the fact that Sharps haven't been around long enough to maximize their potential.. So the added value of the Sharp strain MAY be valid for someone getting into the project from the start with intentions of line breeding them into something better... I guess the price is for their possible potential then???
-----
Joe Lydon
Got Boids?

The only normal Sharp albinos I've seen advertized have sold within days if not hours. If the price was too high they simply wouldn't sell. It took me three years to finally find a Sharp albino male. And I only got him because Brandon Weik was nice enough to sell me a snake that he bought from Ron M. earlier in the season.
Michael Burton

We got you to join the dark side. LOL I think that once we start seeing the exact same morphs as we currently see plugged in with the Kahls that we will be able to properly see what each line of albino brings to the table. This is only the second year sharp sunglows have been around and don't even know what a full adult female looks like yet.

Lets have this same conversation in about 3 years.

I agree with you. The best Kahl I've seen has more color then the best Sharp I've seen. Just wait a few more years. The reason some Kahls are so nice is because of selective breeding. The Sharp strain has not been around and the first Sharp albino was a female, so they still have a few more years to catch up.

Sharps have not been around as long (correction)

I agree Im not a big fan of Sharp strain either. I think the price comes from the fact that their a little more rare than Khal strain. I think their more rare only cause its a weak gene pool and they have a high mortality rate and their harder to get healthy litters from, from what I understand. Never the less their still boas and I love any boa. Rich

When people say Sharps have a weak gene pool, I think they are flat out wrong. Rich Ihle has a female Sharp who produced three years in a row. Most people who say its a weak gene pool have never even attempted to produce them. The best part about Sharps is they gain color as they mature, most people can admit that the majority of normal Kahls will loose color as they grow. This is the main reason people like me choose the Sharp strain over Kahl. Don't get me worng, Pete Kahls striped line, Tom Burkes lipstick sunglows, Jeff Ronnes pastel albinos, and many other Kahl albinos are absolutely extrordinary. Those breeders have all done something really special with the line. But I don't see how you can say Ron M's Sharp sunglows from last year and Doug M's pastel dream Sharp sunglow are not jawdropping. In my opinion, the Sharp strain has a few more years of selective breeding, then they will be just as colorful, if not more colorful then most Kahl albinos. This is just my two cents. I only work with the Sharp strain, and my opinion is based off of three years of talking to breeders of both strains and looking at countless pictures.

Michael Burton

Dont get me wrong they are good looking animals but as far as investing alot of time and money into them I personaly wouldnt be very confident going into something like that. Ive heard alot of horror stories thats all. If Im correct I dont even think Mr Sharp himself is working with them anymore cause of all the headaches. Now on the other hand those who do stick with them and are successful in reproduceing them will be at the top of the market when they come into higher demand. So best of luck and may the force be with you. Rich

This is what I've heard about Brian Sharp selling his Sharp collection. I was told that Brian introduced them together the same time you would with BCC. If that is true, this would be one reason they didn't produce for him.
Michael Burton

Hey the very first Albinos did not produce until Peter got a hold of them. Many people are now having good success with sharps.

First, the Sharp strain is actually stronger than the Kahl. People used the Kahl strain (because it was common) to produce the designer morphs now available. At first no one paid attention to inbreeding and the horrible effects. Breeders who had the Sharp strain saw this and worked to prevent it from happening with this albino genotype. They bred unrelated animals and bred albinos to normals, the only albinos were produced from het X het breeding.

Brian stopped working with COLOMBIAN Albinos, in total. He used to work with both strains. After seeing the results of combineing the Kahl Albino to a Surinam, he focused his entire albino colony toward that project and sold the rest of his stock.

np

Just judging by the ones I've seen the initial Sharps seem to have much more color than the early Kahls. So one would have to assume that the big breeders will be able to do some amazing things with the Skarp strain.

You are so right except that anybody has a chance to work with them. Do you remember, when Kahls first became available for sale? No one thought they would be able to afford one. When Sharps hit the market they hit at a reasonable price. Also, the first Kahl sunglows were WAAAAY high so I don't see how 10 to 12k for the first sharp sunglows is too high.

In Europe I see a lot of sharp albinos for sale this and last year. Many, many so i think the gen is not that weak. They have been crossed with normal females and the truth is i dont see a difference between the Kahl and the Sharp. They look the same. Some of the Kahls are very nice and some are not, the same with Sharp. And the BEST thing is that they have the same price!!! I think its good. By the way, I dont see the point why Sharp albinos will look better outrossed then the Kahls...

Take care
-----
Gabor Kaminski

They will look better because the naturally gain color as they grow.