Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Here are some pics of the hypo male that produced this very unique hatchling. He was wild collected at the flum in San Diego County.

-----
James Wilson
Pacific Coast Herpetological
www.pacificcoastherpetological.com

Where is the "hypo"?

And define "hypo" in cal kings?

Brown and white cal kings are not recessive, but naturally occuring.

Kerby...

Hypo is of course very hard to prove in Cal King but just because there are natural occuring brown Cal Kings does not mean one can conclusively say there is not a hypo gene that is simple recessive present without test breeding.

***Hypo is of course very hard to prove in Cal King but just because there are natural occuring brown Cal Kings does not mean one can conclusively say there is not a hypo gene that is simple recessive present without test breeding.***

Exactly why I have reservations about calling cal kings "hypo" without proving it through breeding projects. I would rather call a cal king "hypo" BY PROVING IT, than calling it "hypo" BY NOT PROVING IT. Have you seen all of the "hypo" cal kings for sale this summer here on the K-snake classifieds??? People are digging pretty deep IMO

If anything.....I think that the "Ghost"/Palomar cal kings from B.H.B. are more hypo than anything out there. And THAT gene IS RECESSIVE.

Kerby...

...blue-eyed blondes. Those are hypo, aren't they (at least the Vivid ones, I think)?

Pretty snake, btw. I like the brown and cream colored ones.

Terry

>>If anything.....I think that the "Ghost"/Palomar cal kings from B.H.B. are more hypo than anything out there. And THAT gene IS RECESSIVE.
>>
>>
>>
>>Kerby...

-----
Ratsnake Haven...researching ratsnakes since 1988

Ratsnake Haven Group...an information providing list site.

By definition, Blue-eyes blondes aren't hypos. In fact, I just got a pair from Vivid Reptiles. And if I can get them to eat, which they haven't eaten for me since I got them, then I will breed them to Lavenders. Scott Potts produces Lavenders that pops out babies that look just like these baby Blue-eyd Blondes......humm????

Do other species that are hypo have red eyes? No. They have reduced black.

Kerby...

"By definition, Blue-eyes blondes aren't hypos. In fact, I just got a pair from Vivid Reptiles. And if I can get them to eat, which they haven't eaten for me since I got them, then I will breed them to Lavenders. Scott Potts produces Lavenders that pops out babies that look just like these baby Blue-eyd Blondes......humm????

Do other species that are hypo have red eyes? No. They have reduced black.

Kerby..."

Kerby, This is where I disagree with you. reduced Black pigment (melanin) is the very definition of hypomelanism... Maybe the confussion here is due to the definition of hypo that you go by, but by the actual definition Blue-eyed Blonds ARE hypos if they have reduced melanin. This is also true for albinos, luecistics, amels and any other color morph that has reduced melanin. They are all hypos by definition. The Term hypomelanism simply refers to an animal that displays reduced amounts of melanin, possessing smaller amounts than would the norm for that population, be it species, subspecies, or local. So, when determining whether a certain specimen is hypomelanistic one must compare it to a sample population, and the size or type of that sample population can often be the factor that determines if that specimen is going to be considered a hypo or not.

For example, a Hogg Island Boa Constrictor is often considered a naturally occurring hypo, and this is true, only if you are looking at Boa Constrictors in general as a species. However, it is not true if you are just looking at the island(s) where they occur, as that is their “normal” coloration for these Boas in that area.

Hypomelanism is a very broad, and often confusing, term covering everything from animals with simple recessive genetic mutations such as leucism, albinism, and amelanism to animals that are on the lighter end of the spectrum of what is considered to be normal for them. However, when most people think of a “hypo” they are usually thinking of something that falls somewhere in between these two extremes.

Most people in the hobby consider a “hypo” to have reduced amounts of melanin to a lesser extreme than that of the amelanistics and albinos, but to more of an extreme than that of a light specimen that still falls within the range of what is expected for that type. In addition, many people do not consider something to be a “true hypo” unless there is some reproducible genetic marker that is responsible for causing the melanin reduction. Weather that genetic marker is co-dominant or a simple recessive trait, usually depends on the species being discussed.

I would be curious as to the definition that you associate with hypomelanism. That might clear up the confussion.
-----
James Wilson
Pacific Coast Herpetological
www.pacificcoastherpetological.com