Reptile & Amphibian Forums

hey people, whats up? I used to post on here with a different name.. but I forgot it, so I had to make a new one

n-e-ways, I noticed that the Tucson Mall has started selling turtles that are only about 1" - 1 1/2" long. Isn't that illegal? What are the laws in Tucson, Arizona? did they change?

The turtles are sold with little plastic trays with a plastic palm tree in the middle.. about an inch of water and colorful gravel in the bottom... I talked to a woman who stopped by my work with one, she had no idea that they need a heat lamp and water heater to live.

All the turtles they sell are just going to die. Is there anything I can do?

~Jessica

Contact your local health department and/or animal control with the location of the vendor in the mall, and the name and location of the mall. You can find these numbers in the blue pages of your phone book. This is also happening in my local mall, and the authorities are working on it.

Although some states and cities have laws on the books, usually health department regulations, it is also a FEDERAL regulation, under the FDA (Food and Drug Administration), listed in the Code of Federal Regulations (CFR).

Below is part of the CFR that covers baby turtles. Here's a link for the whole thing. http://www.tortoise.org/general/4inch.html

If your health department doesn't know what you're talking about, ask to speak to a manager in the communicable diseases department, and give him or her the number of the CFR. If that doesn't get you anywhere, then look in the blue pages of the phone book for the regional FDA office near you and call in a make a consumer complaint.

Katrina

[Code of Federal Regulations]
[Title 21, Volume 8, Parts 800 to 1299]
[Revised as of April 1, 1999]
From the U.S. Government Printing Office via GPO Access
[CITE: 21CFR1240.62]

[Page 638-640]

TITLE 21--FOOD AND DRUGS

Subpart D--Specific Administrative Decisions Regarding Interstate
Shipments

Sec. 1240.62 Turtles intrastate and interstate requirements.

(a) Definition. As used in this section the term ``turtles'' includes all animals commonly known as turtles, tortoises, terrapins, and all other animals of the order Testudinata, class Reptilia, except marine species (families
Dermachelidae and Chelonidae).
(b) Sales; general prohibition. Except as otherwise provided in this section, viable turtle eggs and live turtles with a carapace length of less than 4 inches shall not be sold, held for sale, or offered for any other type of commercial or public distribution.

(d) Exceptions. The provisions of this section are not applicable to:
(1) The sale, holding for sale, and distribution of live turtles and viable turtle eggs for bona fide scientific, educational, or exhibitional purposes, other than use as pets.
(2) The sale, holding for sale, and distribution of live turtles and viable turtle eggs not in connection with a business.
(3) The sale, holding for sale, and distribution of live turtles and viable turtle eggs intended for export only, provided that the outside of the shipping package is conspicuously labeled ``For Export Only.''

Thank you so much for being so specific, it's a great help.

Jess

I forgot to mention that you can also call your state vet at the health department to report this. Again, the number can be found in the blue pages of the phone book under the "state" section.

Katrina

Really?!? I live in Glendale and have 2 RES. Which mall are you talking about? The only place I've ever seen baby turtles are at the Swap Marts and stuff, but those are still illegal to sell. Could you give me the Mall and Store names?

Haha.. you just want to get one, huh? j/k. even if you do, at least you post here so you probably know more about taking care of them than 99% of the people that are buying them.

They sell baby sliders at both the Hermit Crab kiosk at the Tucson Mall (on Oracle and River)from a ghetto place on south 6th called Lee's Pet Barn (where my boyfriend got my turtle). The turtle he got me was about an inch across. They are hard to take care of when they are that big. Mine ended up with pneumonia and I ended up with $60 in vet bills... but my turtle is almost 4" big now and doing great! I had gone back to Lee's to get a heat lamp and was told that I didn't need one, that I could leave the tank in the window.

I don't think it is wrong to sell the baby sliders if they are sold with proper information on care, and the proper equipment, but too many people sell them without the turtles well-being in mind. They market them as cheaply as possible and try to make them appear easy to take care of just to make sales, and that isn't right.

Jess

Wow, only $60 bucks? I get charged $30 just for the vet to look at an animal.. $50 for him to look closely.
At any rate, you'd be amazed how many people are selling RES as mini dwarf turtles that only get 2 inches long and can live in a vase with a plant (or was that those cool fish? well, same difference). So the general public is very much under the impression that those tiny turtles are full grown. I used to work at a pet store and had people leave angry because we didn't sell those little turtles. Even AFTER being told that they don't exsist, that this 5 inch turtle here is the same thing, really, I swear. So this is a widespread problem and although I don't want to support anti-reptile laws, the four inch law, when enforced, basically keeps turtles out of the hands of people who don't really care about them.

I Live in Michigan and it is legal to sell RES that are under 3 inches if they are for Educational, Scientific purposes. Make sure that this company isn't doing anything illegal before you take any further action.

Ryan