Reptile & Amphibian Forums

This is one topic that will never end. I by all means encourage and support cbb (uscb). That is not to say that farmed Chondros from bushmaster, frantz and the like are trouble waiting to happen. Jullian, i have just a small idea of what it takes to do what you do. I purchased from a "breeder" pics of sire and dame were made available to me and i've no doubt that the "sorong type" i purchased was cbb. The problem lies in the fact that this little guy was not an established feeder, as i was led to believe that it was. It has taken near a year to get my little one "established" on f/t. During this ordeal i can telll you that i had just about had it with chondros, you know what i mean. Now on the other hand, i acquired a biak through a trade that i have no doubt is farmed, but! Smog has never given me any problems what so ever. Refuses meals just before shed and has never bitten in defense. Got tagged once thinking i would feed him by hand Lol. He smelled the rat just fine and tagged the hot spot. I think RELIABLE BREEDER is what needs to be considered, anyone with a sexed pair of chondros can be a "breeder". A hundred dollars savings on a cb vs. cbb is a big deal to someone just getting into chondros i clearly see the advantage to this as the extra hundred can go into housing. I would by from Frantz and i would by from Reliable breeders as well, but the later takes research, which should not be done through the classifieds. In the end I myself would spend the extra hundred or two for a true established cbb from a RELIABLE BREEDER. With any other route its a toss of the dice as far as i'm concerned. My farmed Biak would make a great first chondro for anyone. My cbb Sorong on the other hand may not have survived in a novices hands, he was a lot of work. I'm 34 and have been herping since 12-13 so i know a little about keeping herps. As far as chondros go, for me there is nothing worse than one which will not eat. For the novice herper and Chondro enthusiast please by from a reputable breeder, this can make the difference between enjoying your new pet or living in anxiety every feeding day, not to mention the potential for other health related issues. Well thanks for reading, i hope this will help sway those who are debating on getting a chondro and which route to take. Any other input feel free to add to this. Clint
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0.1 Colombian Boa-(Boa Constrictor Imperator) "Honey"
1.0 Hogg Isle Boa-(Boa Constrictor Imperator) "Peeker"
1.0 Brazilian Rainbow Boa-(Epicrates Cenchria) "Houdini"
1.1 Argentine Boa-(Boa Constrictor Occidentalis) "Lacie" & "Oreo"
0.0.2 Green Tree Python-(Morelia Viridis)Biak type-"Smog" & Sorong type- "un-named"
2.0 Canines Husky-Cody & Husky/Shepard-Trail
0.1 Wife-Michele
2.0 Kids-Chris & Bodhi(New born 9/14/05)

Oy!! The only problem is that you said the one you got from the reputable breeder wouldn't feed, and the one you got that was not, has been perfect! Now what???? I think we can probably agree, that if you don't know very much, haven't had a lot of snake experience, and generally would prefer lots of support (although I have gotten this from Troy) and pedigree matters to you, go to an established chondro breeder. If you have some experience, and you know what you're looking for, or don't care about pedigree (that would be me....I just want a green chondro with blue, temperament meant more to me) than try someone like Troy, or even Bushmaster.
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1.0~amel corn~C.S.
1.3~Aztec Okeetee corns~Coatl,Maya,Acatl,Tepin
0.1~Green tree python~Tempest
0.2~Rhodesian Ridgebacks~Akilah, Ona
1.0~Black fat cat~Topper
3.0~Horses~Zaarah,Galliano,Achilles.....

You don't see me on this forum too often but you I am an active participant in some of the others (venomous, indigo, burmese). Having worked with chondros for many years (strictly as a hobbyist; you won't see my name on the various "chondro coalition" lists or other "chondro clubs", the very argument you raise applies to virtually all herps available in the trade. As a curator of a very successful reptile museum/zoo/nature center, we have dealt with this issue on many occasions. We assist with some of the illegal trafficking/smuggling that takes place through commercial airports. Six years ago we acquired a group of imported, wild caught green tree pythons (supposedly Aru locality but that's debatable....my guess, however, is that they were according to the transcripts, their patterns and temperments). Within two weeks, these animals settled in and began feeding voraciously on f/t prey. Most even had a relatively calm disposition and still maintain that tameness to this day. They have bred and produced some breathtakingly beautiful babies (that were donated to public reptile facilities....we kept a few back for ourselves). And, we have some captive bred animals from some of the top blood lines in the nation who also have proven to be excellent captives but with a much more quirky disposition on some occasions (but that's okay, I'm used to working with cobras, mambas, etc so having a fiery chondro is a pleasure to work with).

The bottom line is, and with all other things being equal, I typically would recommend paying a little (heck, A LOT) more for a nice, established, cbb hatchling from a reputable breeder who can provide ongoing support and advice....this goes for just about any herp species. If something goes wrong, these folks will take care of their customers. I've been to shows where a young kid will buy an imported chondro for under $200 thinking he got a great animal and "why pay $800" for the exact same thing....until a few weeks later the snake is dead or dying. Considering their longevity, the initial investment is a drop in the bucket and my philosophy is to never skimp on quality; that also goes with proper housing....there are no short cuts to long term success.

Rob Carmichael, Curator
The Wildlife Discovery Center
Lake Forest, IL

>>Oy!! The only problem is that you said the one you got from the reputable breeder wouldn't feed, and the one you got that was not, has been perfect! Now what???? I think we can probably agree, that if you don't know very much, haven't had a lot of snake experience, and generally would prefer lots of support (although I have gotten this from Troy) and pedigree matters to you, go to an established chondro breeder. If you have some experience, and you know what you're looking for, or don't care about pedigree (that would be me....I just want a green chondro with blue, temperament meant more to me) than try someone like Troy, or even Bushmaster.
>>-----
>>1.0~amel corn~C.S.
>>1.3~Aztec Okeetee corns~Coatl,Maya,Acatl,Tepin
>>0.1~Green tree python~Tempest
>>0.2~Rhodesian Ridgebacks~Akilah, Ona
>>1.0~Black fat cat~Topper
>>3.0~Horses~Zaarah,Galliano,Achilles.....
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Rob Carmichael, Curator
The Wildlife Discovery Center at Elawa Farm
Lake Forest, IL

Meg, I said he was from a breeder, which is my point concerning reputable breeders. After i contacted this guy with my concerns over the feeding issues i got the old "It was feeding fine for me, you must be doing something wrong" routines. He has never contacted me since nor at the time offer me any suggestions over this matter. Rich gave me some pointers and i researched the feeding issue alot. Unless you by from someone who really cares and stands behind the critters they sell you really don't know what you are going to end up with. It sounds to me like you are getting really good service from troy at frantz, and i've seen the animals they offer and i like what i see. There are still Reputable breeders who do work with locale entry level chondros, but a person will have to ask around a bit to find out who has what. I would also say that for every Troy out there how many disreputable breeders/dealers are there??? Pick and choose your source wisely is what i think. There are alot of disreputable dealers out there who don't care if the snake is eating or not as long as payment is recieved they have a smile on their face and the purchaser has the headaches.. Clint
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0.1 Colombian Boa-(Boa Constrictor Imperator) "Honey"
1.0 Hogg Isle Boa-(Boa Constrictor Imperator) "Peeker"
1.0 Brazilian Rainbow Boa-(Epicrates Cenchria) "Houdini"
1.1 Argentine Boa-(Boa Constrictor Occidentalis) "Lacie" & "Oreo"
0.0.2 Green Tree Python-(Morelia Viridis)Biak type-"Smog" & Sorong type- "un-named"
2.0 Canines Husky-Cody & Husky/Shepard-Trail
0.1 Wife-Michele
2.0 Kids-Chris & Bodhi(New born 9/14/05)

Chondros are machines.

YOu introduce them to a differnt enviroment you might have to kick start them again. If it was a strong feeder for the breeder it's a strong feeder. Unless the chondro is sick, 90% of the time the keeper is doing something wrong. Not saying you're not an experienced keeper, but chondros are very secific.

I just had the same problem with a chondro i picked up. Got on the phone called my breeder, he told me a trick i didnt try 2 min later i had a feeding chondro.

-JG

And what was that dirty trick???? Just in case I ever have one that won't eat Heaven forbid!
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1.0~amel corn~C.S.
1.3~Aztec Okeetee corns~Coatl,Maya,Acatl,Tepin
0.1~Green tree python~Tempest
0.2~Rhodesian Ridgebacks~Akilah, Ona
1.0~Black fat cat~Topper
3.0~Horses~Zaarah,Galliano,Achilles.....