Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Hi, I've been wondering how those of you who use one thermostat on multiple cages with only one probe, can keep the temps acurately balanced. It seems to me that when you open one cage, then the temps will change from the others, thus being out of sync. I'm guessing that I'm over-thinking this, but I don't see how it works out. Please reply----Thanks, David/Morgans Boas
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--aka DMOG68

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--aka DMOG68

Say you have a stack of 5 cages, you would put the probe in the middle most cage, say cage 2 from the bottom. You woudl have to start all of your heating element at the same time to make sure they were at the same temps. Also you woudl ave to have the same amount of element on each cage(size and wattage). As long as everything is the same you should have pretty much the same temps all around.. Granted heat rises so that might throw your top cage off a bit....
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www.MGReptiles.com
Professional Heating Supplies

Doesnt the JC stat have the ability to " equalize" temps by using ,multiple probes ? By this i mean attaching multiple probes to the unit and placing them in cages thus allowing it to gather the three temps and base the heating set point at the desired level ?

floor up layout

bottom
cage #1 no probe n/a temp
cage #2 probe 85 temp
cage #3 no probe n/a temp
Cage #4 probe 87 temp
cage #5 probe 89 temp

average temp would be 87 does it not have that feature on the JC's I thought back when i was getting them to offer i was told by the inhouse techs they have the ability to use "zones by adding probes" to average temps in the zones ?

I have been meaning to call back and get more info on this as i am thinking this would be a AWSOME failsafe way to regulate temps that cause the cages in a normal stack to become hotter on the upp cages . if this is how i understood them then by using multipl stacks of lets say 5 stack cages then you could use one unit for say 3 stacks of cages all setup the same heat wise ( same wattages on all cages ) then you could feasibly be able to maintain all cages within i would think /- 1 -2 degrees in this method of zoning .

ok well gotta get back to the grindstone these things dont build themselves lol

this was just soemthing that popped back up in my head from months ago and i saw this thread and out it came i may be totally wrong as i had been speaking with many manufaturers on heating controllers ... oh and there are some units outthere that will surely shame both johnsons & rancos and many others in the abilities they have to do a WIDE range of functions and still stay within the price range of some of the more popularly used units by herpers .. food for thought .. try googling it one day you will be amazed at the range some units will goto .. heating , humidistats , etcetc all in one unit to monitor them all for under $250 in MANY units
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Builder of Professional Reptile Enclosures ,Plastic caging , Standard & Professional Breeder Rack Systems[url=http://www.junglehabitatsplastics.com[/url]

Yeah they will take an average reading from upto 8 probes I beleive. So yeah you can control several differnt cages with the same unit. But that being said if you have one cage spike for some reason you will get false readings in the other cages.. And if one element would completly turn off then it woudl raise the heat to compensate for the "0".. I have fooled with that here and it works ok but if one element was unplugged the others spike way ouit of control and I started to get temps that were in the 100* range when the stat was set at 80*... Anywho Im rambling.....
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www.MGReptiles.com
Professional Heating Supplies

Thanks Matt i never messed with it never had time yet to sit down and worry about it ( most of my collection is no longer here ) so i dont havealot to worry with now. I had looked at some other units that were made by a company called "greenaire" i thin kit was when searching out incubator controllers for some things im workingon . These were majorly awsome units . all operated within tolerable limits and would do heat , humidity all controlled by one unit that could be maintaqined by the PC these were a lil pricey but when it comes to volume operations in larger open facility breeding / housing it could have benfits by bounds .
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Builder of Professional Reptile Enclosures ,Plastic caging , Standard & Professional Breeder Rack Systems[url=http://www.junglehabitatsplastics.com[/url]

Oh yeah the greenair stuff is awsome(tstat nerd here). I have actually thought about carrying some of their product as alot of people are looking for humidistats....
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www.MGReptiles.com
Professional Heating Supplies

------- say I have my 5 cages running on the one t-stat, and they're all keeping relatively the same temps. Then one cage needs to be cleaned. So I leave the door open while doing my cleaning, and then it becomes cooler than the other 4 cages. Am I going to have to open all of the doors to equalize them each time. Say that the dirty cage was the middle one with the probe. While the door is open, then the t-stat stays on, rising the temps of the other 4 cages. This is my real question will they equalize on their own gradually, or do I manually correct each one everytime I mess with the snakes? Thanks, David/Morgans Boas
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--aka DMOG68

Whenever the cage with the probe changes temp as from opening doors, yes, the other cages will get warmer as the temp controller tries to compensate for the cooler temp sensed by the probe.

If you are using bulbs and the bulb burns out in the cage with the probe.. uh oh.

This is why room heating is so much better.

Well the amount of heat loss will depend on the duration the cage is left open and the type of material your heating.. I use them on all different types of bottoms from PVC to glass to wood and dont have a problem with them.. I do recommend a digital thermometer in each cages hot spot just for peice of mind.... So all in all I woudl not worry about that to much...
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www.MGReptiles.com
Professional Heating Supplies

Sure, you can hook multiple things up to one thermostat but there are SO many factors.

I'll probably refer to my racks several times. This is not a sales pitch, only a reference point.

First, you need to make sure that your sources are similar. I have a normal rack that has a 3' section of heat tape down the back then I have another 'sideways' rack that has TWO strips of 3' heat tape down the back. These would not make good buddies sharing a thermostat. Obviously it's going to take different about of power/amperage to get those two to the same temps (hopefully I wouldn't need to explain that the rack with the two strips gets much hotter than the other). If you do have to share a thermostat, make sure it's of almost identical items.

Second, obviously watch your wattage. Most heat tape is 20 or 20-watts/foot so the math is pretty simple. I love the little A-Life units to death for little/practical setups but I'd never trust one at 1000-watts. I'd cap any single zone off at 500-watts tops, that's what the Helix units max out as well I believe.

Third, and my point to be made here....this is totally UNSAFE. Forget the temperatures bouncing around a few degrees when you have the tubs pulled out of one (which is a valid point...I've made the mistake of pulling a tub that was on the same shelf as my probe...with all of that room temperature air around it suddently, the thermostat cranked up...happened to notice all of the animals pinned towards the front several hours later...temps were at 98 versus 90!). This is well beyond that. We're talking about thermostats with a single probe. Say you have Rack A and Rack B. Your thermostat is in Rack A and your temps are acceptable in both Rack A and Rack B. What happens with Rack B's heat tape shorts out? (Yes, I know this is a rare case...I've been using Flexwatt for 12 years now and have only seen this happen once or twice). The thermostat doesn't know anything about it so it just keeps on going...until you have toasted animals.

That's an extreme. Here's one that happens more often. Same situation, Rack A and Rack B. Thermostat is in Rack A but controlling Rack A and Rack B. Rack A's power cord gets unplugged...OH NO! Now guess what happens? The thermostat heats and heats trying to get that probe to 90 degrees...meanwhile in Rack B, the animals are goners.

Moral of the story, don't be cheap with thermostats. If you can't afford Helix, Big Apple, or HCS units (hands down the best thermostat on the market...those that don't believe so haven't tried one), then go with the cheaper A-Life or ESU thermostats. They're a non-proportional thermostat (but then again so are JCs and Runco's) but they're practical and cheap.

That's my 2 cents...I don't chime in very much but this is sometihng I couldn't let slip by.

Jason @ Jason's Jungle
Link

Thats very well put Jason!!! I have used the HCS units if your talking about the Habitat Controls... If Hank could just put them in a different shell they would be perfect.. If i had the brain power to make a proportinal stat Id have to put in some motion sensors that will tell the stat the tub/cage is open and to pause adjustments until an "all clear".. Then one to text message if a problem is occuring and to be able to accept replies of how to handle the problem.. I am sure in 2020 it will be out..lol
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www.MGReptiles.com
Professional Heating Supplies

Could you have your bottom tub on your rack be your "control temp tub rack"? This "control tub" only gets pulled out to check on temps and quickly gets put back in place. So you don't have the over active thermostat burning your babies.

Just a guess what do you think?

I'm thinking about getting the vision ball python rack. Does anyone have any experience with this rack system? Their solution the the hot on bottom hottest on top rack problem is heat cable. The idea is more cable on the bottom rack and less cable on the top rack. It seems like a solution to me.

Does any one have an experiences or comments???