Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Welcome to kingsnake.com's message board system. Here you may share and discuss information with others about your favorite reptile and amphibian related topics such as care and feeding, caging requirements, permits and licenses, and more. Launched in 1997, the kingsnake.com message board system is one of the oldest and largest systems on the internet.

Click here for Dragon Serpents
Click for 65% off Shipping with Reptiles 2 You

Locality Cal king pics...anyone?

Phil Peak Sep 27, 2005 03:48 PM

On this board we often have the opportunity to view some outstanding pics of getula, holbrooki, floridana, nigra and occasionally splendida.

What I don't see often is pics of locality Cal kings. I'm sure some of you have them. To me this is a beautiful snake with much natural variation. My perception is this is the guppy of the kingsnake world and is the common petshop kingsnake mass produced in a myriad of selected forms. I know the reality is much different and the snakes themselves through natural selection display much variance.

Anyhow, it would be interesting to see some wild form Cal kings. Thanks, Phil
Official Black Kingsnake Website - Updated!

Replies (30)

erik loza Sep 27, 2005 06:19 PM

While all Cal Kings in NorCal are beautiful, three areas have very unique populations. Western El Dorado County, Yolo County, and part of the northern San Joaquin valley. I'll attach a few pics, starting with a hypermelanistic Cal King from the vicinity of Davis. All the animals in these photos wild, by the way...

erik loza Sep 27, 2005 06:20 PM

.

bluerosy Sep 28, 2005 09:16 PM

Did Brian Hubbs get any of your pictures for his california kingsnake book that he is working on? He should.

erik loza Sep 27, 2005 06:22 PM

.

erik loza Sep 27, 2005 06:24 PM

.

ratsnakehaven Sep 28, 2005 05:22 AM

Great pics, Eric. Wish I had more time to talk about all the variation in n. Cal. You sure have seen some fantastic animals and some that I'm really interested in. Here's one of my baby El Dorado blue-eyed blondes...

I'm looking forward to working with this locale and morph. Right now I don't have any other locality Cal kings, but I will be getting a pair of Davis black-bellies pretty soon.

Thanks, Phil, for the strand, and bringing up the idea of localities. I'm sure there'll be more of that in the future.

Terry

Aaron Sep 28, 2005 10:27 AM

Is that one from Gerald Merker? It's nice.

ratsnakehaven Sep 28, 2005 12:00 PM

Yes...and I think the blue-eyed blondes are the hypo morph

TC

Phil Peak Sep 28, 2005 06:45 PM

Terry, thanks for posting. Sounds like you have some nice projects going and that El Dorado snake is quite impressive.

Its great to see there are some folks working with locality Cal kings. I knew there had to be some out there. Phil

ratsnakehaven Sep 28, 2005 10:21 AM

Eric, is either snake in this picture, hypo, and is the light colored one the male?? Thanks...

Terry

erik loza Sep 28, 2005 06:37 PM

...in eastern Sacramento and western El Dorado Counties, to the point where I can call a male snake on sight. Males can be dark but females never seem to be light unless they are a bonafide hypo. It gets more pronounced with age, as well. I really wish some grad student would do something with these guys and figure out what is really going on before the whole area gets turned into tract homes or a strip mall.

To anybody who is really into locality NorCal getula, either buy some from Merker or go catch your own and take as many as you want. They are by far the most abundant snake in this habitat and I've caught as many as 75 animals a year in these areas, often different snakes in the same spots for three or four years in a row. They're easy to road-hunt for in the summer and early fall and there's no way you or I could put a dent in the local population by collecting them (unless you have a crowbar or don't know how to put a board back the way you found it).

I live in Texas now and might never catch another Cal King, so have no hesitation about saying that Cal DF&G are a bunch of dumb-asses who have no interest in protecting native reptiles from the bulldozer. In fact, if I was still breeding Cal Kings, I'd drive home and catch as many nice ones as I could. My oldest wild-caught king turned 10 this summer and has never looked better. Better to be cared for in a cage with decent food, no parasites, and a comfortable life than survive ten years of drought, predators, a diet of skinny lizards, and then get buried alive one day so that you an I can have a Blockbuster 5 minutes closer.

ratsnakehaven Sep 28, 2005 07:38 PM

Eric, thanks for the post. Those babies are gorgeous.

I do have a pair from Gerold and plan to raise them up and breed them. They are unique snakes. Thanks for your article back in '00, I think, and for being there to talk about them. Maybe someday I'll get the chance to hit that area and have a look around ;O)

Good luck in TX...

Terry

bobhansen Sep 29, 2005 01:40 PM

Erik: These are great observations. Would you mind shooting me an email at rwh13@csufresno.edu as I have a few questions for you. Thanks!

Bob Hansen

erik loza Sep 29, 2005 08:58 PM

.

markg Sep 29, 2005 02:08 PM

I share your opinion re bulldozers, Blockbuster,etc. If you want to protect a species, you protect the habitat.

I spoke with one herper from the San Bernardino mtns where some rock piles were bulldozed for cabins. One or more of the workers purposely killed a few live zonata that were exposed.

If I had collected more than one of those Zs I'd be breaking the law.

Nokturnel Tom Sep 29, 2005 02:52 PM

Where in TX do you live? I am just north of Austin Tom Stevens

erik loza Sep 29, 2005 08:55 PM

...

bluerosy Sep 28, 2005 09:18 PM

Did you really find them like that and take the pic or did you set those up togther for the shot.

Would like to hear more about how you found them.

erik loza Sep 28, 2005 10:39 PM

.

bluerosy Sep 29, 2005 01:49 AM

amazing pic and amazing find! Thanks for sharing.

Phil Peak Sep 27, 2005 07:22 PM

Thanks Erik. Thats what I was hoping for. Beautiful pics and snakes! Phil

BBBruno Sep 28, 2005 06:07 AM

Phil,
I have Cal Kings from Oregon, they look similar to the black individual in one of the other posts. Hatched a bunch too. I have to get a digital camera, and I'll post. If you'd like, I can send you a photo the old fashioned way. By the way, I like the Black KIng site, an animal deserving of more attention. Did you breed any herps this year? Right now, Black Pines are hatching, Floridas should go in a few weeks.

Keith Hillson Sep 28, 2005 01:12 PM

Hey Bart

Look forward to seeing pics of those Oregon Cal Kings. What are you getting per pair on them ?

Keith
-----

BBBruno Sep 28, 2005 08:43 PM

At the moment, they're all spoken for. I usually don't ask much for them. They're great animals, sooner or later I'll post photos.

Bart

Keith Hillson Sep 28, 2005 11:51 PM

Thats okay I will hit you up next year. I thought last year I was going to get some but for the life of me I dont know what happened lol. Last year was crazy for me I bet I forgot. Please if you do make lists put me on for 1.1

Thanks Bart

Keith
-----

Phil Peak Sep 28, 2005 06:38 PM

Great to hear from you Bart! Thanks for the kind words on the black kingsnake site. We hope to keep the site updated with more locality pics and info as time goes on. Your Oregon kings sound really choice. Would really like seeing pics whenever you get a chance.

Not much breeding on my end this year. I did breed Kankakee bulls and Ky corns. I will probably try to produce more things next year.

Black pines and Fla pines sound nice. Probably a dumb question but are they locale specific?

We are still chasing down the Ky pines but no luck in the field this year as of yet, though it has been a great year for horridus which are always nice to see. At least we are having fun while failing miserably with pine snakes! We are hoping that we can try breeding our female with Gary's male again this year, only I hope the results will be better. I'll keep you posted on this. Phil

BBBruno Sep 28, 2005 09:00 PM

Phil,
The Blacks are Theodore/Mobile stock, which are pretty close, the mugitus are Tallahassee/Orlando stock,which are further apart than I'd like. My Northerns didn't drop, nor did the ruthveni, though they bred. I'll have to take photos of the Oregon Cals with a digital camera. Soon enough, I'll be asking you to help me post. As for Kentucky Pines, your persistance will pay off again. I used to have Black Kings from Alabama, have you been able to obtain photos of them?

Bart

Phil Peak Sep 29, 2005 06:40 PM

I plan on getting get some Fla pines one day. Last year we found a fresh DOR yearling in the ANF and that was a real heart breaker. I have a friend that has a large male from Levy county. I'm hoping sooner or later they will come my way. Are your hatchlings spoken for yet this year?

Look forward to your Oregon locale Cal king pics. Would be glad to assist you in posting pics whenever you are ready.

I have had some people tell me they could provide pics of Ala as well as Tenn nigra. I think the W.Va and Va pics are going to be rough but we are hoping in time to have a good representation of locality photographs.

We intend to continue our search for Ky pines and hope for a break through. I'm convinced we are in the best locations to give us the most opportunity for success. The Trigg x Calloway county pines we have are doing very well and should produce in 07. I would be real nice to bring together a project with pines from the cave area though. Phil

tspuckler Sep 28, 2005 10:35 AM

Found while roadhunting 4th of July weekend.
Image

Phil Peak Sep 28, 2005 06:50 PM

Very nice! Thanks for posting the pic. The variation in Cal kings is truly amazing. Phil

Site Tools