Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I was wondering how important it is to most chondro people about keeping the lacales pure. For example if i was trying to isolate a blue feature in the snakes and found a good aru and a good sarong is it alright to breed them since the overall objective is bluer babies. Jsut something I had been thinking about lately. Thanks, Todd

Unless you personally picked up the snake from a certain locality, or you know someone like Trooper or Greg who have wildcaught specimens that were documented as a particular locality, it's very hard to prove a locale. More likely, you will be breeding a type. Biaks are known for their larger longer heads, Aru's for the dorsal white, etc. I would breed animals that you think are going to give you the traits you want and not worry so much about locality. Most likely, no matter what you try (unless you've had a few breeding trials) you'll never know what you'll get from a breeding. Two high blues don't mean that any of the babies will be high blues, but maybe their offspring will. That's the fun of chondros. They're like a box of chocolates!
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1.0~amel corn~C.S.
1.3~Aztec Okeetee corns~Coatl,Maya,Acatl,Tepin
0.1~Green tree python~Tempest
0.2~Rhodesian Ridgebacks~Akilah, Ona
1.0~Black fat cat~Topper
3.0~Horses~Zaarah,Galliano,Achilles.....

I don't think greg has any locality "pure" animals in his collection. From what i know (and im sure greg can answer this better than i) Is he had a pair of "Aru Types" (mind you he never called them locality specific, just matching that particular phenotype) that passed away. I think all he has in his collection are "Mutts". Trooper is known for his "TW Basment Mutts" not locality specific animals as his pedigrees (pretty much all my animals have a TW started pedigree some where in them). Have "Wild" in them Not a name of a local.

Point being you'll be hard pressed to find any one in the US working with locality types. More phenotypes if anything.

So to answer your question the US is more focused on color, pattern and morphs. There are alot of European breeders who are focused on Locality "pure" animals.

So, no, its not important... If it's important to you, start it !

Actually, I do know of one breeder who does almost all locality specific projects. Ectothermics. I've purchased 2 green trees from them, Biak and Aru locale, and the majority of their breeder start are F1 imported animals. Personally, I look at locale when purchasing, and plan on doing locality specific projects in the future. I just think it'll be fun to see exactly what the outcome is of doing sorong x sorong or aru x aru for a couple generations. Different people have different tastes...so some care and from what I've seen a good amount don't.

Chris
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1.1.0 Irian x Jungle Carpet Pythons
1.2.0 Black Rats- Robert, Cady, Kylie
1.2.0 Albino FL Kings-Nick, Jessica, Ashley
1.1.0 Crimson Corns-Kane, Ruby
0.1.0 Het-Crimson Corns-Lola
0.1.0 White-Sided/Pos Het Albino Black Rat-Lita
1.0.0 Albino White-sided Black Rat-Rey
0.1.0 Albino/Het White-sided Black Rat-Stacey
1.2.0 Creamsicle Corns-Vince, Trish, Torrie
0.1.0 Fl King-Bonnie
1.0.1 Biak GTP-Brandon, Aru GTP-Orochimaru
1.0.0 Flame X Blood Bearded-Ruff
2.4.0 Ball Pythons-Kritsy, Gretchen, Alexis, 100% het for albino balls- Naruto, Hinata, 66% het VPI Axanthic-Sasuke
0.1.0 Red-tail Boa-Xena
0.0.1 Savannah Monitor-Izzy

Hey,
I'm with you on the locality debate, and wish that there were more breeders in the US, producing more locality specific animals. I don't really care much for the mutts or basement breeds.
-Angel
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In life you can fall many times, but you're only a failure, if you don't try to get back up!
Evil Canevil

I have a single male for sale on the classifieds and every interested party has asked for locality info. I keep explaining that most animals are not locality but every single person has told me I am wrong. I have literally seen some of the bigger importers pick the locale of the animals while it was in their hand. They unpack the GTP and put them in locality bins by their looks and it has nothing to do with where they came from.

I asked one guy while he unpacked his shipment how he knew where each animal originated by looking at it and he said simple. He picked up a bag and asked my opinion and I said Aru. He then put that snake in a bin labled Aru. It was that simple. So don't put to much stock in a locality animal. If you have a breeder you respect and trust you can make a choice to believe what he says but understand that he may have been told a lie and not know it.
Later Jason

Beautiful snake!!
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1.0~amel corn~C.S.
1.3~Aztec Okeetee corns~Coatl,Maya,Acatl,Tepin
0.1~Green tree python~Tempest
0.2~Rhodesian Ridgebacks~Akilah, Ona
1.0~Black fat cat~Topper
3.0~Horses~Zaarah,Galliano,Achilles.....

Yes and no...

That animal definately has some biak in it, I can tell that just by looking. Next test, hows it's temperment?

Chris
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1.1.0 Irian x Jungle Carpet Pythons
1.2.0 Black Rats- Robert, Cady, Kylie
1.2.0 Albino FL Kings-Nick, Jessica, Ashley
1.1.0 Crimson Corns-Kane, Ruby
0.1.0 Het-Crimson Corns-Lola
0.1.0 White-Sided/Pos Het Albino Black Rat-Lita
1.0.0 Albino White-sided Black Rat-Rey
0.1.0 Albino/Het White-sided Black Rat-Stacey
1.2.0 Creamsicle Corns-Vince, Trish, Torrie
0.1.0 Fl King-Bonnie
1.0.1 Biak GTP-Brandon, Aru GTP-Orochimaru
1.0.0 Flame X Blood Bearded-Ruff
2.4.0 Ball Pythons-Kritsy, Gretchen, Alexis, 100% het for albino balls- Naruto, Hinata, 66% het VPI Axanthic-Sasuke
0.1.0 Red-tail Boa-Xena
0.0.1 Savannah Monitor-Izzy

LOL I guess you didn't get my point. I don't believe you can tell a locale by looking at a snake and most of what we know of locales comes from someone telling you that this snake is from this locale and that one is from that locale. All snakes vary in any given location. What we have from "locales" should instead by referred to as locale type as there is no way in knowing what locale they are from.

I don't know if you have ever been to any importer's warehouses but I would not call any of them clean or organized. No offense to wholesalers out there but for the most part if they are small enough to be clean then they are not usually doing the importing themselves. Anyway to take there word on a locale is kinda strange. For the most part they don't care the guy they got them from doesn't care and the guys who dropped them off at the exporter don't care for sure if you know what area a snake came from.

The "farms" take females from anywhere they can get them and put them in random cages. Not until very recently has the idea of keeping track of the origins of any of their stock even occurred to them. So most if not all animals in the US can be from about anywhere.

Yes there are traits that look the same on snakes and we can group them by those traits but the idea of a GTP being a locality pure animal is funny to me. Again no offense to anyone but I have seen the process and I was not overwhelmed with the idea that the people involved even cared. What it will take is what is starting to happen and that is guys with smaller operations importing themselves and those people taking care to make sure every detail is noted. Even then they will be relying on 3-5 people minimum overseas. Still those people will be spending a lot of time and money and risk for those animals so when they do come in I hope they are appreciated. i have been out of GTP for awhile so there may be someone taking the time already but i have not heard about it.

Anyway thank you for trying to help me with the locale of my snake but I don't care I just like it for what it is. And if it make you feel any better I don't trust most US snake locale unless I pick them up off the ground myself. There are just to many bad people in a good hobby now-a-days

Later Jason

Completely understand and agree with what you said. I was just saying it is possible to get a locale by looks...but it should only be referred to as "locale type". My 2 locale animals are form a breeder that specializes and prizes themselves on their locality specific animals. Their breeders are animals they imported, and most people who know of them and have worked with them trust them enough to say their animal is "X Locale". But for most breeders I'd be adding "type" to the end.

Chris
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1.1.0 Irian x Jungle Carpet Pythons
1.2.0 Black Rats- Robert, Cady, Kylie
1.2.0 Albino FL Kings-Nick, Jessica, Ashley
1.1.0 Crimson Corns-Kane, Ruby
0.1.0 Het-Crimson Corns-Lola
0.1.0 White-Sided/Pos Het Albino Black Rat-Lita
1.0.0 Albino White-sided Black Rat-Rey
0.1.0 Albino/Het White-sided Black Rat-Stacey
1.2.0 Creamsicle Corns-Vince, Trish, Torrie
0.1.0 Fl King-Bonnie
1.0.1 Green Tree Pythons Biak-Brandon, Aru-Orochimaru
1.0.0 Flame X Blood Bearded-Ruff
2.4.0 Ball Pythons-Kritsy, Gretchen, Alexis, 100% het for albino balls- Naruto, Hinata, 66% het VPI Axanthic-Sasuke
0.1.0 Red-tail Boa-Xena
0.0.1 Savannah Monitor-Izzy