Reptile & Amphibian Forums

how do you explain the 2.2 Ga easterns in the photo?
I put all of them in one bin; I was very nervous. These animals were all kept at 80 room temp until this summer when I couldn't stand the heat and I dropped the temp to 75. They were initially offered the same food items, but GA-01f and GA-04m ate everything offered every time right through the shed phase. GA-02m has eaten normally in a cyclical fashion surrounding shed. GA-03f has never eaten more than 2 pinks in a week on the rare occasion that she eats more than once per shed cycle.

I'm going to cool all 4 this winter and expect that next spring the two smaller snakes will have a better appetite.

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Bob Bull
2.3 L.g.getula MD Locality
2.2 L.g.g GA locality
1.3 L.g.g albino
1.3 L.g.g het albino
1.2 L.g.g P-het albino
1.0 L.g.floridana peanutbutter
0.2 L.g.f. het peanutbutter
1.0 L.g.f. N.E. axanthic
1.0 L.g.nigrita
1.1 L.t.hondurensis het hypo-melanistic
0.1 L.t.hondurensis hypo-melanistic

Now just imagine how much bigger they would be WITH some "enhancment therapy"?

If I can get a kingsnake to eat a fuzzy in the third meal I consider that a success because that snake usually turns out to be a chow hound and grows at a fast rate. I follow up with several larger meals (in close succession) in the folowing weeks. The next 4 weeks should see a significant weight and size increase which will determine if that particular snake is able to attain breeding size in 1 year. If I back off the meals after there first fuzzies (something I have been known to do) they can resort back to a normal growth pattern.

The first meat or two and the timing of it can be crucial in development for some to be huge in a year and others being average.

I think the larger fuzzies have more calcium and nutrition than a pinky, which is mostly made up of water with very low nutritional value. I am sure in the wild neonate kingsnakes snake eat other snakes , lizards and the like to get them started better. If you feed a human baby powdered milk it will be malnutrioned, weak and inferior. This child is more apt to succumb to health problems during the first stages of life. Thats why I beleive in women breast feeding their children for longer than a couple weeks. There are nutrients in the mothers milk which is better for the first stages of developemnt for a child, whether good genetics or bad. Feeding a snake a pinky with low nutritional value will hurt the growth of the snake whether good genetics or not.

Of cousre some people , like snakes, have good genes and will thrive under the worst of nutritional circumstances until their bodies mature and then they kick into overdrive.

As you may know, I think the term powerfeeding is silly, with that aside.

You have genetic potential, physical support to reach that potential. consider reptiles rarely reach their maximum potential.

You have (1)genetics, (2)support, then behavioral aspects. As in group (3)stress. Consider, that are many levels of each of these areas.

As with other inherited genetics, not all of the same species, has the same genetic potential. No even in the same clutch. As with humans, dogs, cats, etc. After all, its genetics.

Also, each individual may have a different ability to withstand or tolerate stress.

As I indicate below, its not simply temps. FR

I agree.....It is not simply temps... as some of my kingsnakes grow faster than others at the exact same set up......
I think snakes are as individual as all of us.......
Good point Frank.
John Lassiter

i to have snakes and sibs the same age and ssp. same setups same feeding schedules and yet are different sizes i beleive its individuality and yeah MAYBE:O its genetic. but i cant see it being either inferior or superior just individuality.(my father has traced our family tree to the late 1800's we are all short folks men averaging 5'1-5'3on his side my mother hasnt traced hers but from what we do know its similiar in size now me and my brother are 5'9 and 5'10 SO are we het. for short or were our family somewhere het. for tall? OR is it simply individuality?
now snake growth controlled through feeding and temps doesnt seem reasonable to me if it was wouldnt w.coast&southern populations grow huge and fast in the wild? imma thinkin theres allot more to it that might just be never fully understood ,,,,,good read/topic,,,,,thomas

As an observer of this forum, there seems to be many levels of success. For instance, Tom Stevens has on average larger stronger faster growing snakes then others averages. This is not about reptile individuals, but instead, individual keepers, providing support.

Please understand, this is only an example from casual observation.

Also, some regularly reproduce their females, and others rarely. Shocking to me is, some have huge collections and do not produce much. Others have smaller collections and produce many. Again, that is only about keeper support and understanding.

While the vast majority here are to some degree successful, this success has a wide range that is keeper supported. Thanks FR

Thanks Frank, I appreciate the kind words. I have to come to realize a few things. One is the amount of snakes you have to care for plays a huge part in how much you can apply to thier care as far as details. If you have more than you are capapble of handleing you may still see plenty of success but also see a downside, being snakes you expect to thrive and produce simply do not. I wish I had things a little differently, as my snake room is in my garage which means it is hard to maintain temps in the range I prefer, BUT!, this may somehow be beneficial to my snakes as perhaps on a day I feel it was a little too warm for them they felt it was optimum? I can live with the occasional failure, as long as I feel I have an idea why things did not go as planned. I look forward to this winter, as with may snakes out of the room and more time to think about improving conditions in my snake room will make this spring a very exciting time for me. In closing, I do not like the term power feeding either. It is just feeding. There's a lot of criticism from keepers who talk about breeders,,,but i see my animals thriving and they produce exceptionally healthy offspring so instead of getting too far into the debate over how much to feed I just do what I think is best, and I am pleased with the results. Tom Stevens

You are right...Tom's snakes are some of the fastest growing '04s around.....but as Tom even stated before not ALL of his yearlings are over 3 feet and close to 4 feet.....but alot of them are.....LOL.
Some take off better than others....and husbandry has something to do with it, but snakes still exhibit individualality.....wow that was a big word....LOL
John Lassiter

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