Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I see alot of post that say do not get your females too fat, because they do not breed as well.

I also see posts that say she must be at least 500grams per foot to breed well.

I see people with girls that are 3500 grams!!!

My question is, if Ball Pythons only get to be around 5 feet, how do you have one thats 3500grams or 700grams/ft. and not have her be over weight?

Alan

Five foot is not an average size for a ball Python they average between 3.5 foot to 4.5 foot. Five foot is a rather large ball python. Yes it is true overweight females dont make the best breeders. Best weight in my book is what the snake becomes not what the owner pushes. Let your female grow at a normal rate, she will breed longer and be more productive in the long run. Snakes have metabolism rates as do humans that is why you have varying size snakes. If it is not in a snakes genetics to become 3000 grams sge shouldn't. When is the last time you saw a 3800 gram WC Ball Python. I havent this is just my experience. Others maybe but ball pythons are not supposed to be the size of mini boas lol.

Mike Tucker

Actually they get 6 feet in the wild, and they do get 3000 grams in the wild. And they do import them. They are just not imported as much as the CH babies, because the guys in africa will dig up the big mommas, take all her eggs, let her go, incubate the eggs, import the babies all over the world, and next year do it again. It does take them much longer to reach this size in the wild though. They have to be hunters, rather than lazy fat snakes.

Ben

There was a study that indicated average clutch size was 7-8 eggs and I think egg weight was around 95-100 grams. This would not indicate a length of 6 feet or weight of over 3000 grams. My largest clutch is 10 eggs from a female Almost 3000 grams and well under 6 feet. Personally, I don't believe they get this large in the wild.
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Jay A. Martin
Jay Martin Reptiles

I think the easy way to prove my point is for you to buy and watch Dr. Steve Gorzula Ball pythons in the wild. They find 14 egg clutches and 6 foot balls IN THE WILD. I have heard of captive clutches over 10 eggs several times.

Ben

>>I think the easy way to prove my point is for you to buy and watch Dr. Steve Gorzula Ball pythons in the wild. They find 14 egg clutches and 6 foot balls IN THE WILD. I have heard of captive clutches over 10 eggs several times.
>>
>>Ben

or oddities? These are entirely two different things. I have no doubt there are large animals with large clutches. But the scientic study I refer to indicates ball pythons in the wild are smaller rather than larger.

Average size clutch: 8 eggs
Average clutch weight: 800 grams
Clutches average 1/3 weight of the female: 800 grams X 3 = 2400 grams.

You can find the study in The Linnean Society of London,
Biological Journal of the Linnean Society, 2003, 78, 263–272

With all the BP breeders out there, don't you think there would be more 3500 , 6' females if this were the norm?
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Jay A. Martin
Jay Martin Reptiles

I am not trying to argue, I only know what I have learned. That DVD is very interesting. He was sent over in 97 by CITIES to check on the local populations. I think the sample size was about 200, but I forget. Here is a link to his website, where he has a clip of a BP over 6 foot that he found 15 eggs with. Its really boring at parts, but they chase around a cobra, visit some villages, see some captive hatchers... interesting stuff.

I would be very interested in the info you talked about. Do you have any links or references? I enjoy reading all about this stuff. I agree, the average is not going to be 6 foot, but "I think" its because they breed every year, and have to hunt for them selves. Given a good supply of food, such as on the out skirts of a rice/corn feild/village, you might find alot of bigger and older BPs.

Thanks,
Ben

No arguments, just discussions
Article

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Jay A. Martin
Jay Martin Reptiles

Actually there was one 6 foot female (weight not given) that was found with a 15 egg clutch.

Averages they found were:

eggs: 8
Length of female: 122 cm (around 4 foot)
Clutch weight: 772.5 grams
Egg weight: 94.9
Female Weight: 1388 grams

With that being said this is one small population of part of Africa - we know Ian G imports monsters from a specific region. I'd be interested to read The Linnean Society study since it's more recent do you know what area of Afric they studied?
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Tosha

"Nihil facimus sed id bene facimus"

7.33.0 Ball Python (Harry and Fluffy and gang)
1.0.0 Angolan Python (Anakin Skywalker)
0.0.1 Green Tree Python (Verdi - yeah I know but my kids love the book)
0.2.0 Feline (Pippen and Pandora)
0.0.1 Desert Tortoise (Pope John Paul aka JP )
2.2.1 Fish (1,2,3,4)
0.0.2 frogs rescued from pool skimmer

That is my point.

If a man is 6' tall, he is considered overweight if he is more than like 170 lBs.

By that rationale, should'nt a 4' snake weigh no more than a certain amount to be healthy?

I see some of the same people who write not to let females get too fat,and they have pictures on their web-site of huge females or they brag on the forum about this huge 4' female they have?

Is there an ideal weight range for say a 4' snake? What weight per foot is ideal? If people say at LEAST 500 grams per foot to breed than a 4 footer should be 2000grams MINIMUM? Should you put your snake on a diet if she goes over that weight? It does'nt add up.

Alan

to people that raise their females to 1500 grams in a year and sell them to people looking to breed them.

I would say it is safe to raise females to 2000 grams in two years. After that their growth should slow considerably.

After speaking with several breeders, I've learned, a 3000 gram female isn't likely to have any more eggs that a 2000 gram female. Smaller females 1500 gram range, don't really have the capacity to produce large clutches regularly, but after 2000-2500 grams it is unlikely to see much of a difference.

Cole Maas