Reptile & Amphibian Forums

These are just of the few of the twenty individuals we saw. Which sort of indicates hibernation is a ways off. Also I met a fella who captured two nice ringnecks, one about 2 feet, and another about 32 inches. I wonder, what will make them different now that they are in captivity??? I mean yesterday, they were wild, and tomorrow they are captives. Why are they different?

Anyway, enjoy the pics, FR

That's a sweet coral.

Also I met a fella who captured two nice ringnecks, one about 2 feet, and another about 32 inches. I wonder, what will make them different now that they are in captivity??? I mean yesterday, they were wild, and tomorrow they are captives. Why are they different?

People are realizing they are as easy to keep as kings.... They are catching on without a doubt.
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Mike
KingPin Reptiles Inc.
Helmz777@aol.com
www.freewebs.com/mikesnake
Updated 9/19 NEW PICS/INFO

That Blacktail has as much yellow as I have ever seen. What a treat to see. You didn't overstate its color. The Coral is just as dramatic - bright clean colors. My first Coral sighting will come soon enough. I hope it looks that good but I probably won't be composed enough to give it an honest evaluation. Your eye was right - the bigger Ringneck was 30 inches. Now, will they be different in captivity - probably. Hopefully a good enclosure will mitigate some of that. I've only collected 3 snakes in the last 4 years so I do it selectively. I sure enjoyed meeting you yesterday. Thanks for taking the time to chat with me.

It was nice meeting you and your daughter. She seemed so excited, that was very nice to see.

The tiger we found right after I saw you last.

My camera let me down, the blacktail was more yellow then greenish as the picture shows. But nice enough for me. The second one, about two hundred yards and twenty minutes from this one, was very very similar, but not such intense yellow.

We, Marty and I, had a venomous night, we found all possible species, but a mohave, hahahahaha, the most common.

Today it appears to be raining there. I will be there on and off for some period, maybe see you again. It was nice meeting you, FR

That Coral is Freak'n Awsome!

Man too bad those things are poisonous! That is a really killer snake.

Thanx for sharing
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Thanx
Royal Blue Reptilez
Bklyn's Finest Brooksi & Goini Fanatic
~ZF

The nice benefits of living in Arizona!

Cool stuff Frank.

Did you find the Coral out in daylight?

Kerby...

Yea, it was still daytime. Actually late afternoon. I find corals far more commonly in the day, then at night. Same with Lyresnakes. Many years ago, I set out to see how common corals were, and found them to be very common and widespread, but very restricted by dehydration. So when and where you look, must reflect that.

Actually I found the largest coral I have found, 28 inches, 8 miles west of this one.

I really like the head shot of the blacktail. Thanks Kerby, FR

I have yet to find a Coral, but I've only been in Arizona since 1990. LOL

A friend of mine moved here from California and found a Coral near Bagdad his first summer. Oh well..........

Kerby...

Hi,

Thanks for the pics. Being an easterner, I have always appreciated those shots of desert herps in situ that you and others have put up over the years. But, until I drove through the desert, from Vegas to the southern rim of the Grand Canyon, I really didn't have any concept of the topography. It is truly the most beautiful and amazing natural habitat that I've ever seen. I would have put my house up for sale and moved my fiancee, and the snakes down there the next weekend if not for the horribly oppressive heat in the valleys during the summer (late July). The high elevation leading up to the canyon was very tolerable....a truly dry, comfortable 100F...but that 116F in the Vegas valley was unbearable.

Do you folks often get comfortable(90-100F) breezy days at higher elevation during the summer in Arizona, or did I just get lucky with the weather....and are black widows really that common? Thanks again for the photos.

Will

**Do you folks often get comfortable(90-100F) breezy days at higher elevation during the summer in Arizona, or did I just get lucky with the weather....and are black widows really that common? Thanks again for the photos.**

I live at 5,000 ft in elevation here in Arizona (Prescott area on the map). And we do get 4 seasons up here. We are usually 20 degrees cooler than Phoenix, day and night. It does snow here but it does melt rather quickly, except for the mountains where the sun don't shine (shade) and north side. There are times that we do break 100 degrees but that often. It's dry except during the winter time and the monsoon.

Black widows, scorpions, centipedes, tarantuals, rattlesnakes, etc.. are just a way of life. I live in the country and they are there. Just keep your eyes open and stay alert.

Kerby...

It really is very comfortable when its in the 90s. The low humidity is a huge difference. I'm in Tucson so we generally run 7-10 degrees cooler than Phoenix. The evenings and nights are just fantastic - incredible skies and nice temps. Those evenings cruises are as good as life gets. You spend the whole evening seeing mcuh more than snakes. I've encountered Ringtails, Coyotes, Bears, scads of different Owls, Fox, Coons, Bobcats, etc. If you love being outdoors, this state is incredible!

Good summation you guys.

I live (parttime) 20 miles south of Tucson, at bt. 3 and 4,000 ft. ele. The vens are around our house in high desert, but not much in the yard, and not in the house. They're not active year 'round either. It gets down around freezing for lows and sometimes as warm as 70's in winter, great weather. As stated, a great state for herps, hunting, and nature in general. Must learn to be cautious, however, especially when learning about new environments

TC

if you lived twenty miles south of tucson(shorryrita, I suspect). You would have several types of Rattlesnakes around your house, I find mohaves and diamondbacks in downtown Green valley all the time, and corals too. Also, they are active all year long, even in the mountains.

My guess is, you take a tiny bit of information(your limited personal experience), and stretch it to make broad statements. Sir, you need more experience or less broad statements.

In my post, I mentioned seeing twenty snakes, number 19 was in my driveway and number 20, was on the street in front of my house. We just had to go out and hit the twenty mark. And I live a few miles west of Tucson.

In reality, we average 15 rattlesnakes a year on my property(five acres) has averaged that for a very long time. But, not one has ever entered our house or reptile building. Harmless snakes have, but not venomous. Millions of black widows thought and I do mean millions and millions. FR

>>if you lived twenty miles south of tucson(shorryrita, I suspect). You would have several types of Rattlesnakes around your house, I find mohaves and diamondbacks in downtown Green valley all the time, and corals too. Also, they are active all year long, even in the mountains.
>>

We do have rattlers and inverts all around our house (G.V.) But we don't have many in the yard. The immediate environs of our yard is surrounded by a wall and kept pretty clean. So, we don't see many venomous creatures in the yard. You don't need to frighten the guy to death.

They aren't active all year long. And what makes you think I have limited experience compared to you? What are you, 98 or somethin'? Since when are snakes active at less than 50*F, let alone 32*F? Sure, I have seen snakes active in winter before, but only when the weather, etc, is favorable. In general, they aren't active. I've seen ten AZ winters and the temps range from about 32* to 70's in G.V. To say the snakes are active all year round is stretching, I think.

>> My guess is, you take a tiny bit of information(your limited personal experience), and stretch it to make broad statements. Sir, you need more experience or less broad statements.
>>

You take one statement out of context and call it a broad statement...LOL. What do you think you're doing? I bet you're trying to start something, but I've talked to cranky ol' farts before, so good luck

TC

Why do I think you have limited experience, is because what you say. You talk like a newbie with newbie beliefs. First, a clean yard has nothing to do with rattlesnake wandering in. In fact, it forces them into places they do not want to go. In houses.

About them being active year around, I could give a flying frog bomb, what temps you make up in your head. I say they are, because we find them active year-a-around. Sir, thats called experience. Of course I was very surprised when I started finding snakes active in nov. dec, jan, then feb, then march, but hey that was 40 yrs ago, and now I am use to that idea.

Heck, you can even find them crossing roads year-a-around.

Again, that you do not know this is why I think you have limited experience.

About scaring that fella, if he is afraid of rattlesnakes, then Ariz is not the place for him. Its not about scaring. FR

I love rattlesnakes. In fact I spend more time crawling in timber territory (WNY)than most people should. That is one of the things that attracts me to AZ, the thought of walking sround the(high elevation) property with a cup of joe early in the am pokin' around for willardi. In fact, Frank and I are members of the same exclusive club...I got tagged in the toe by a white-lipped pit viper in '97 (fat, discolored foot for a week) and an eyelash pitviper in the thumb (dry) in '98. So it isn't the hots that bother me, I'd just have to get used to the widows, but I'm sure I would. Thanks.

Will

Ok, Frank. I tell you what. I think you have limited experience too. Of course, my experience w/AZ is limited 'cus I've only been going there for a few years, but that doesn't mean I don't have a lot of experience with herps. I think you're limited because you talk mostly just about what happens in your own backyard, so to speak, and you don't have much experience with people 'cus of the way you talk down to people, and you probably don't know much about other areas of the States and what herping is like in regions other than your own. Of course I'm guessing there, but you're guessing a lot about me. As far as making broad statements, I do tend to expand a lot, my way of learning, but I'm not limited to just reporting what I see in my driveway and on my porch. I want to learn and suggesting things (conjecture and theory) is a good way to drum up knowledge and other people's experience, so you can learn.

Nice talking to ya

I am responding directly to your comments about here. Nothing else. You made statements about snakes and Green Valley, It was this and only this that I made comments on.

What do you think I was taking about? And in that, You made assumptions, and they were wrong. Thanks FR

I was just looking at a book and noticed this paper, "Mating System of Male Mojave Rattlesnakes (Crotalus scutulatus)...", from the book, Biology of the Pitvipers. Paper is by Gordon Schuett, Andrew Holycross, and others, (2002). In it it says the active season for the mojave is March to September (page 515). I don't guess these guys are newbies, do You?

I'm not going to argue winter temps with you, but I have noticed that rattlers aren't very active at temps below 70*F, normally. I would definitely say they have a hibernation period, and that they only wander around when the temps are unseasonably warm. I wouldn't call that active in the true sense. Also, I've been checking on a den site for diamondbacks in the Santa Cruz Valley for the last three years. I've seen dozens of them coming out of hibernation, caked in mud, around the end of March. Got pix if you're interested

TC

Both Gordon(been in the field with him) and Andy(had several talks with him) are very good guys, you may want to ask them If mohaves have been seen in months later then Sept.

What is so darn silly is. Before you even posted, I posted of a whole bunch of rattlesnakes and a coral. I posted pics. I even have a witness, one of the forumites was there. It was in OCTOBER. So that sort of dismisses the september deal you just posted.

From your posts, it seems your a believer of paper. That is, you try to make snakes fit what you read. While theres nothing wrong with the body of knowledge contained in papers. Its merely mans(a person) interpitation of a very short and limited exposure to a snake or group of snakes.

In the paper you mentioned, I would most likely agree with everything they saw and reported. But may I add, there is much more to Mohaves then they could possibly write. So what they report is good, there surely can and will be additions to their body of knowledge.

Back to you. As I mentioned above, you seem to try to make the animal fit the paper, when in fact, its suppose to be the other way around, the paper is "supposed" to fit the snake. If the snake does anything other then what the paper or book says, then the book or paper is in error, not the snake. The snakes are always right, as they are indeed the subject of the paper or book. In this case, rattlesnakes in my area are active to some degree all year long. That is, they can be seen above the ground or even crossing roads in every month of the year.

In the coming months I will post and show some snakes that are active and not hibernating. You then can call Gordon and report it to him.

FYI, mohaves are on my property, I see them all the time. FR

>>Both Gordon(been in the field with him) and Andy(had several talks with him) are very good guys, you may want to ask them If mohaves have been seen in months later then Sept.
>>

I'm not going to ask them, since I never doubted that you saw the snakes. That was never my point. I posted on your thread to confirm what was being said about AZ being a great state and I stand by that. There's a hell of a lot a good herpers in the state also, in spite of me being hopeless (thanks a lot.) The person (Will) who said he was thinking of moving to AZ was worried about the vens (inverts and snakes) and I was just offering a different view. I'm afraid we're both hopeless 'cus you're not going to see my view or understand what I'm trying to say.

>> What is so darn silly is. Before you even posted, I posted of a whole bunch of rattlesnakes and a coral. I posted pics. I even have a witness, one of the forumites was there. It was in OCTOBER. So that sort of dismisses the september deal you just posted.
>>

I'll admit I wasn't thinking about your pics when I posted, but I had looked at the whole thread. If I had doubted you I would have posted my comments directly under your picture post.

>> From your posts, it seems your a believer of paper. That is, you try to make snakes fit what you read. While theres nothing wrong with the body of knowledge contained in papers. Its merely mans(a person) interpitation of a very short and limited exposure to a snake or group of snakes.
>>

I am a believer of paper to an extent. It is science and I like science and it can be used to further our causes of gaining knowledge, making things happen, like taxonomy, and conservation, etc. I am an educator and delve in the theorectical a lot. You like the concrete. I can respect that. I don't believe in the literature exclusively. I'm with you on experience. I believe in getting out there and experiencing it.

>> In the paper you mentioned, I would most likely agree with everything they saw and reported. But may I add, there is much more to Mohaves then they could possibly write. So what they report is good, there surely can and will be additions to their body of knowledge.
>>

agreed.

>> Back to you. As I mentioned above, you seem to try to make the animal fit the paper, when in fact, its suppose to be the other way around, the paper is "supposed" to fit the snake. If the snake does anything other then what the paper or book says, then the book or paper is in error, not the snake. The snakes are always right, as they are indeed the subject of the paper or book. In this case, rattlesnakes in my area are active to some degree all year long. That is, they can be seen above the ground or even crossing roads in every month of the year.
>>

I'm not arguing that the snakes can't be seen in all months. As a matter of fact, if I were having this conversation with someone else I might be using your argument that they can be seen in all months. The problem I think is in our interpretation of what's being said. By "activity", I was referring to their "active period", when they are carrying out life functions of eating, mating, etc. Heck, I could argue that even in Michigan, my home state, that I could find snakes in every month of the year. I think in the paper that is what they meant to, that March thru September is their active period as far as main activity and main functions, not that they weren't ever moving in other months. That's all I was referring to in the paper. I haven't even read the whole paper, yet.

>> In the coming months I will post and show some snakes that are active and not hibernating. You then can call Gordon and report it to him.
>>
>> FYI, mohaves are on my property, I see them all the time. FR

Sounds like you live in a cool spot, right out in the desert. Of course, there are probably snakes right in downtown Tucson too. I look forward to seeing the snakes you find.

I have seen snakes in Green Valley too. One of the main reasons I'm even on this forum is because of the kingsnakes there, and the fact I've taken up keeping the form from Green Valley. Last summer I came home one night and saw a diamondback crossing the street under the light in front of our house in the rain. I've seen other herps in the subdivision too, even in the immediate yard sometimes. I don't expect to see many in the winter, however, especially in the higher elevations. But I will be there in December and plan on doing some field work in the Santa Ritas. I'll let ya know if I find anything.

It's been a long week and I was really tired last night. Time to relax. Keep the faith and don't give up on your fellow herpers.

TC

right after I saw you last, we saw a mountain lion. Also, several fox, skunk doing handstands while eating a dead rabbit???? and several horned owls. Althought homeland security rid us of the dangers of one of those owls(ran it over). There just keeping us safe U know.

What part of Tucson are you in? FR

How outrageously cool does it get??? How late did you guys stay out? That is jsut awesome!! You guys really had an outstanding night. My daughter was worn out by 8pm so we headed north and them made a stop to look at a Pallid Bat site.
I'm on the far eastern edge of Tucson - about 5 miles north of the I-20 Houghton Rd exit.
I'll be down in the same territory Sunday with a couple Buds. Hope to see you.

Yes, Arizona is just too awesome for words!!! The only place better is where I live--TEXAS!!! God practiced with Arizona so he could get Texas right!!! That's why sunsets are burnt orange!!! Can you say dry heat?????LOL

Pat

New Mexico has them both beat. I'm not going to go into the details of why so don't move out here. I've lived in both TX and AZ. They're alright so move to either of them. I'll stay right here in between them.
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Vichris

Vichris Variables

W.A.(western australia) has all three put together beat, 100 times more reptiles of more species, 1000 times less people. Areas the size of New Mex or Ariz. without a single road and no people. Thousands of miles of beach front, without people on it. Of course their are a couple beachs(Cable beach) with the most beautiful(topless) young girls. Just in case you want people around.

Seeing such wonderful sights as four or five people touring Harleys thru the Kimberlys(most unpopulated and explored part of the world thats not frozen) Driving 600 hundred miles without seeing pavement(except for short jumpups). How cool is that?

Actually ariz is starting to suck, far to many people are moving here(I hope they bring water with them) FR