Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I just thought a discussion on market values would be interesting to talk about.
The year before I actually started breeding boas(in 2003), the prices I was seeing on albinos were about $800 each, ...the following year, I was all set to start buying on a small scale.
When it came time to buy the market had jumped, and albinos were $1000 and heading up to $1500 each.

I see Ghosts as being very under-rated. I wonder why people are not buying them up? Is it because most are not as clean as they can be? Or do people not see the value in them?

If Sunglows are selling for $5000 each and up ....I think I saw some for $20,000. each....then why do we have the cheap hypos and slowly lowering priced albinos out there.

At some point I would think this GAP has got to change, either sunglows will come down, which I believe is unlikely,...or the other prices are going to go up....which is what I really think is going to happen.

Just wanted to read what others think, so if you have anything on the matter, maybe we could all better understand market trends, and values.

Thanks Andy Federico

AJF Reptiles

I'm in the process of obtaining an Albino and I'd hate to see the prices jump up! Please say it isn't so!!!!

For us poor folks who just really want one due to their natural beauty and will not breed and sell, $1000 is already a lot of dough.

Just my two cents.

Damian

I, personally, am really liking the market value where it currently is. My reason is this: A few years back you either had normal type boas at affordable prices, or to get into a morph project, you'd have to take a giant financial leap and pray that you got healthy animals. Nowadays there's morph projects for all price ranges, and once you produce stock from your project, you can invest in something a little higher priced without going broke.
However , your mentioning about Sunglow prices: With all of the DH/Sunglows that are being sold in the last couple of years, I would expect to see their price to start declining. Although they are amonst the most amazing looking morph out there, the Albino and Hypo morph were the most popular morphs to get into for their cool looks in themselves, that we're going to see a large quantity of Sunglows springing up in the near future. That , in turn, will cause people to compete more with their pricing, thus becoming lower.
I am suprised how the Salmon/Hypo price went down rather quickly this last year. I see some nice looking normals (but not as nice as Hypos) selling for more money.
Just some random thoughts - I may be far from correct on the Sunglow prediction. Take care, David
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--aka DMOG68

Although "ball people" and "boa people" seem to be a little different in the way they approach things, I think watching the ball market could shed some light on the future boa morph market. There are some interesting and lively threads on the ball forum. Some of the ideas are fairly accurate. I think the only thing that saves the boa market from all the flux the ball market experiences is the time it takes to go from neonate to breedable animal. Most people looking to "get rich quick" aren't willing to wait. The boa market stays more stable that way. I am sure animal and clutch size factor in as well.

Who knows?

Al

A collector/pet owner’s perspective:
The funny thing about the ball market to me is many of the morphs need a side by side comparison with a normal to tell it's a morph (at least for a non ball person like myself) and sell for a ton. While the boa morphs are so attractive that many want them just as pets, myself included, yet they sell for so much cheaper. I know breeding factors play a role. It just seems that ball market is like a pyramid scheme were at some point someone will get stuck with very expensive snakes and no one to sell them to because they are not attractive enough for the pet/collector trade. When I show a person who does not like snakes (most people) a boa morph they immediately remark that it looks “cool” or “pretty.” When I do the same (using photos) with many (there are some that make jaws drop) ball morphs they usually state that it looks no different or or less attractive than a normal ball.

I also get the impression that there is a lot more trading in the ball world than boa morph world so this keeps prices high as well since often time no money is actually changing hands. The snakes themselves become currency. I once spoke with a very big importer in Miami, who does not do trades, who joked about how hard it was to get actual dollars for many for many of his balls.

after years in both the Ball and Boa worlds, I finally gave up all my ball python projects to persue Boas, the best choice I have ever made. It really is 2 totally different worlds. Thanks for that post, you basicly voiced my opinion as well, pretty cool. THnaks
David
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"Life is a Safari"

question:
You mention the time it takes to go from baby to breeder is different between boas and balls. I'm a boa person 100% and don't know much of anything about balls. Do ball pythons mature more quickly?
comments:
I agree about sunglows becoming more and more common. They're already below $4000 regularly now.
Ghost vs. albino-I think albinos are just more popular because they're so strikingly different. You don't have to explain what makes an albino different than a normal-even to a non-snake person. Not that I PERSONALLY agree, I LOVE ghosts. I'm working on a ghost project now.
oh, and I TOTALLY agree about the ball morphs. I look at them and think "other than $5000, whats the difference between that and a normal?" I'm sure though that someone that doesn't obsessively troll kingsnake wouldn't understand paying $1000 for an arabesque either.

Some albinos, hypos, ghosts or whatever it may be are better than others. Selective breeding has alot to do with market price, if I or someone else bred hypos or albinos... etc.. for great color I wouldn't expect to get them as cheap as some that are going to be less attractive as an adult.

I saw a lot of hypos this season that were pretty cheap, but There are also hypos that are pastel hypos or just nice looking selectivly bred for great colors and they hold a better market price.. I'm not saying that there aren't some realy good deals out there, there are.. but 9 out of 10 times the folks with a premuim price have got a little more thought and time into their project. I'd rather go with those boas, just because of the fact that there is less risk of getting a pretty baby that grows up to be semi fugly..

In the long run I think the average looking morphs will become more affordable, where the ones that have been bred for specific traits will probably go up as they get nicer looking. There are still tons of combos of designer morphs that have not been crossed, and even more new morphs that have not been produced yet. Boas are not as far along as cornsnakes or ball pythons due to the fact that they are a bit more difficult to breed, and just haven't been bred as much.
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Ed Lilley, www.constrictorsnw.com

Hey Andy,
here's my 2 cents on your post starting with the albino thing. I also remember when they were 800$ one year and jumped the next. The reason for that was, when they were $800 there were enough to go around that year. The following year I happen to know that alot of the bigger breeders of albino's that year sold most if not all of their albino stock over seas. That left us with hardly any for us here causing a supply and demand thing to take place. This info came from the top people in the bizz. After that we started seeing more color in the albino's thanks to the stripe line and sunglow siblings causing the market value to stay higher and maintain the price we see today.

Now for the ghost. My theory on that is simply the color aspect. I mean really, why breed a salmon/hypo to a female albino to get dh sunglows when you can bred a ghost and get triple hets that will make the same thing as the dh's will plus a new animal that knowone has ever seen. I think most people would rather buy a salmon/hypo cause of their outstanding colors and if their going to spend the kind of cash it costs to get an awesome one they're going to want people to look at it and be in awe. So, why buy a ghost (that should cost more do to the fact of their potential)for the same price that is just shades of brown when you can get a boa with pinks,reds, and so on. I use to think this way until I looked at the big picture and my collection got bigger and I think this is the point where I turned from collector to a hopeful future breeder.You can find awesome clean ghosts but you need to look for them cause they go first. The reason salmons are what they are today is because Rich took the time to develop the color and cleanliness by years of breeding trials and thats also why he can get those higher prices for his and others can't for almost the same thing. He's put the time and effort into these animals and to build his buisness name and it shows. I mean, he is the originator of the "SALMON BOA". Once people turn from collecting to breeding they realize the importance of a ghost and I honestly think the ghost market will pick up once we start seeing more breeding trials to make them cleaner and more attractive.

As for the sunglows. The 5000$ or less price tag these days gets you a basic sunglow. The price hikes you speak of are do to the genetics sunglows have these days. Now you see sunglows het stripe,snow,coral and the bubblegums,arabesques and now jungles. The price range changes as the possiblities of the animal grow but that obvious.

Hope this helps at all.

Ruben Michel